The JSA acquisition is going to be a game changer for Signed non witnessed books 5 5

[PDidds]

On 5/10/2024 at 4:37 AM, MattM CS said:

If you would like these to be receive a CGCxJSA authenticated signature, the books will need to be resubmitted through a grading tier. This service is not available for reholder submissions. 

THIS is BS and a CASH GRAB. !!

Pay for a REHOLDER - yes -- Pay for a JSA verification - Yes -- but PAY to have the same friggin grade put on the book !! Hell NO!!  That absolute robbery!!  What is changing?  You guys graded the book already and were paid for the grading.  Now you want to be paid a 2nd time to grade a book you already graded?  Did you damage it when you removed it from the green label slab?  Why do you need to re- grade it?  Robbery!  Extremely unethical.

To drive interest in the new label you guys SHOULD BE offering special incentives to have all the green labels re submitted.  Get these new labels out there in circulation and on eBay etc.  But often the forest can't be seen thru the cash grab.

I will NOT be submitting any of my GREEN label books.  

Edited May 17 by PDidds

[CGC Mike]

@PDidds  The language in your post is a little strong.  Please refrain from this going forward.  

[comicginger1789]

On 5/16/2024 at 3:19 AM, PDidds said:

THIS is BS and a CASH GRAB. !!

Pay for a REHOLDER - yes -- Pay for a JSA verification - Yes -- but PAY to have the same fkn grade put on the book !! Hell NO!!  That absolute robbery!!  What is changing?  You guys graded the book already and were paid for the grading.  Now you want to be paid a 2nd time to grade a book you already graded?  Did you damage it when you removed it from the green label slab?  Why do you need to re- grade it?  Robbery!  Extremely unethical.

To drive interest in the new label you guys SHOULD BE offering special incentives to have all the green labels re submitted.  Get these new labels out there in circulation and on eBay etc.  But often the forest can't be seen thru the cash grab.

I will NOT be submitting any of my GREEN label books.  

I can see your point to a degree. Also though, standards of grading have changed. It is not a static thing and many things have changed from even a decade ago. Hence why a re-grade is needed. For example certain flaws are more forgiveable so there is a chance your green labelled 4.0 with a signature on it could now be considered a 4.5-5.0 based on current grading practices. Personally, I would be happy to have updated eyes take a look at the book.

I can see the frustration in a book graded only a few years ago having to go through the process again but all of it is a safety measure. CGC got rocked with scandal and the last thing they need is another person trying one where they submit wrong books inside slabs. CGC just copying the grade without checking it over opens the door for problems that they do not want to deal with again.

[PDidds]

On 5/17/2024 at 1:08 AM, comicginger1789 said:

I can see your point to a degree. Also though, standards of grading have changed. It is not a static thing and many things have changed from even a decade ago. Hence why a re-grade is needed. For example certain flaws are more forgiveable so there is a chance your green labelled 4.0 with a signature on it could now be considered a 4.5-5.0 based on current grading practices. Personally, I would be happy to have updated eyes take a look at the book.

I can see the frustration in a book graded only a few years ago having to go through the process again but all of it is a safety measure. CGC got rocked with scandal and the last thing they need is another person trying one where they submit wrong books inside slabs. CGC just copying the grade without checking it over opens the door for problems that they do not want to deal with again.

Good points -- but everything you raise is a CGC problem NOT a customer's problem.  Why make it a customer's problem by making us pay?  MONOPOLY CASH GRAB.  CGC knows they're the only dog in the hunt and while they are very cool about a lot of things, and I praise them regularly, this is just robbery.

[comicginger1789]

On 5/16/2024 at 8:40 PM, PDidds said:

Good points -- but everything you raise is a CGC problem NOT a customer's problem.  Why make it a customer's problem by making us pay?  MONOPOLY CASH GRAB.  CGC knows they're the only dog in the hunt and while they are very cool about a lot of things, and I praise them regularly, this is just robbery.

How else is CGC supposed to protect themselves? Say I am a shady person. I have a bunch of green label books that I have purchased, signed by Stan Lee that were unverified. I took some time (because that's all it takes) to practice his signature and once I feel ready, I swap all of the legit books out for others I have (some are lower grades even and all with the fake sigs on them)

If CGC just reholders these without any closer inspection, these go into the world as fakes that CGC handled and missed. Thus it makes sense to make people pay to re-grade and inspect, that way this does not happen. And you may say well that is a pretty far fetched scam....and to that I will say, that is what people would have said about the actual scandal that did happen.

I am sure CGC would be all ears to hear how they could prevent this without having to charge customers to have it regraded again. And if you are suggesting "well they just need a better tamper proof case". Okay, even that would cost money to design and then produce and you can bet we would be paying more for such a thing so in the end, it is still the customer paying more, whether its for the better product or to have CGC re-grade it.

[comicginger1789]

I would also add that the change in stance for grading in certain areas is something that us customers and collectors have lobbied for....so when I give the example of a book that was a 4.0 that could now, with fresh eyes and updated standards, be a 4.5-5.0, that is not a "CGC problem" as you state. That is a community change within the hobby and as mentioned before, I would be happy if my book improved upon a second grading. At the end of the day if you don't think that is worth $25-30, that's fine. Just know that your green books will likely never get the same value as this new label down the road (some obvious potential exceptions may apply for a rare really desired signature, like Cole or Baker or something to that degree).

[SpineTic]

 

[Ron C.]

I sent in a few CGC Green slabs for encapsulation with the new JSA Authentication slabs. I do confess that I am a bit disappointed and confused with this grade drop. No grader's notes other than the authentication. I thought it still looked pretty nice when I sent it in.

[dbcn]

@Ron C.  sig and book look great - but the grade drop - oof - that gives me hesitation about sending anything in - I assume when you send a slab in for authentication, you go through the grading process again similar to the reholdering process. I know it's early, but does anyone have an example of sending in a slab for sig authentication and received the same grade back..?

Did you get the book pressed? if not, I wouldn't be surprised if the grade drop is just due to CGC mishandling the book. If you did get the pressing, it might be that the pressing damaged the book? Either way, not great. 

[Ron C.]

On 5/30/2024 at 2:49 PM, dbcn said:

@Ron C.  sig and book look great - but the grade drop - oof - that gives me hesitation about sending anything in - I assume when you send a slab in for authentication, you go through the grading process again similar to the reholdering process. I know it's early, but does anyone have an example of sending in a slab for sig authentication and received the same grade back..?

Did you get the book pressed? if not, I wouldn't be surprised if the grade drop is just due to CGC mishandling the book. If you did get the pressing, it might be that the pressing damaged the book? Either way, not great. 

I didn't even consider pressing a really nice 9.8. I can see if an artist is handling and signing a book there is always a risk, but this is a pretty big drop for an already 9.8 book.

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 5/30/2024 at 2:20 PM, Ron C. said:

I didn't even consider pressing a really nice 9.8. I can see if an artist is handling and signing a book there is always a risk, but this is a pretty big drop for an already 9.8 book.

Hard to hear about the grade drop with no notes and etc. Unfortunate but idk if a fix is there, or if it is more a preparation for our brains to wrap around?

I was also coming back to ask if you had the "signature graded?" I vaguely remember them mentioning such, and with the fairly clean sig, I was wondering if the sig was graded your opinions on that as well? 

Edited May 30 by ADAMANTIUM
Ask

[CHWL]

I still don't understand why a slabbed green label requires a regrade, as opposed to them authenticating the signature in the holder and if it passes the test, then to reholder/reslab it under the new JSA label. I mean, even in the video they posted, the JSA authenticator is looking at the sig while the book is still in the original slab...

Reducing the need to handle the book and removing it from the inner sleeve would make this service much more attractive.

 

[dbcn]

On 5/31/2024 at 11:44 AM, CHWL said:

I still don't understand why a slabbed green label requires a regrade, as opposed to them authenticating the signature in the holder and if it passes the test, then to reholder/reslab it under the new JSA label.

I'm also curious to see as more of the Yellow/Black labels get into peoples hands if they are generally graded lower for whatever reason - extra handling during the sig verification step? - seems less enticing to send a 9.8 signed book in (slabbed or not) if you're going to effectively max out at 9.6.

[waynemel]

On 5/30/2024 at 2:28 PM, Ron C. said:

I sent in a few CGC Green slabs for encapsulation with the new JSA Authentication slabs. I do confess that I am a bit disappointed and confused with this grade drop. No grader's notes other than the authentication. I thought it still looked pretty nice when I sent it in.

Oh man...that much of a drop?  Makes you wonder if the Green 9.8 was the wrong grade.  Still with no grader notes, that is awful.  I would contact support to have them revisit this and check and hopefully state reason for drop.  This is a bad precedent for authenticating.

[Ron C.]

On 5/31/2024 at 2:55 PM, waynemel said:

Oh man...that much of a drop?  Makes you wonder if the Green 9.8 was the wrong grade.  Still with no grader notes, that is awful.  I would contact support to have them revisit this and check and hopefully state reason for drop.  This is a bad precedent for authenticating.

That was a pretty strong 9.8 book.

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 5/30/2024 at 6:07 PM, ADAMANTIUM said:

Hard to hear about the grade drop with no notes and etc. Unfortunate but idk if a fix is there, or if it is more a preparation for our brains to wrap around?

I was also coming back to ask if you had the "signature graded?" I vaguely remember them mentioning such, and with the fairly clean sig, I was wondering if the sig was graded your opinions on that as well? 

Isn't the signature graded on some of these slabs? @Ron C. If my question wasn't clear? Or can and did you opt out of that?

[ADAMANTIUM]

I thought JSA was supposed to look at the signature and grade how well it presented or was written, maybe that is just a factor in the over all grade of the book or I'm missing something, idk 😶 😐 

Edited May 31 by ADAMANTIUM

[Skippeydoo]

On 5/31/2024 at 2:22 PM, ADAMANTIUM said:

I thought JSA was supposed to look at the signature and grade how well it presented or was written, maybe that is just a factor in the over all grade of the book or I'm missing something, idk 😶 😐 

Pretty sure that was an option you could opt into, but I also am pretty sure you had to pay extra for it. Like $25 for the verification and another $25 for the grading the sig. I don't remember how much extra it was, I just know it was enough for me to say nah, not worth it. But that was just my personal opinion. Others may find it worth while. 

[Dr. A]

Ron, a grade drop happened to me as well a couple years back, but I only resent it in to get the name of the Autographer instead of "Name Written..." and it came back a 7.0 from a 9.0. (but I did get the autographed name).

Grading is far more subjective between the CGC graders because they all view it differently--the human element. I have an 8.0 labeled as a 9.8 that I cannot sell. One gaze upon it and  one can see there's no way it's a 9.8 with multiple spine stress marks and more. So I just keep it as a memento since it is also a minor key. I do not share photos of it because it can be used against CGC's validation process and also lends to questioning all graded books, thereby negatively affecting other investments (although it has already happened thru others). 

Yet another issue rose when only one of my 40+ 15-25 book submissions (since 2017) received "rounded corners" on multiple books in that single submission. The whole lot is questionable, and arguably the worst submission out of all of them. They may have hired a card grader when submissions were off the chain a few years back.

 

 

[Dr. A]

Does anybody know if the CGC+JSA authentication applies to signatures on the splash page as well? thanks.