Is anyone else getting books back with warped inner wells? 25 25

[DanJD]

On 8/27/2024 at 6:08 PM, Berkfam54 said:

Oh my goodness I’m so sorry. Im in the process of getting my information from beginning to current to make a video on it. I did a livestream but I feel a video is warranted to discuss just my books but I will most likely mention this as well. That’s insane man and I’m so sorry. 

Make sure you put it on YouTube.  It’s the only source of feedback CGC high ups get access to.  

[MAY1979]

On 8/27/2024 at 4:57 PM, SpineTic said:

 

A simple Mea Culpa back in May coupled with immediately providing everyone the Pre-1975 and or Major Submitter/Influencer treatment and it's would of been the tiniest of blips and long since forgotton. Now however it may be on verge or have already "gone viral"

The folks in Santa Ana in their wildest fantasy never ever could envisioned how much of their foot is now already in the door.  This issue may very well cancel out their absurd mistakes with slab size and red bordered flip (get used to calling them that rather than labels). They may very well need to immediately revise their staffing count down in Newport Beach (and Jersey?) across the board 'cause as soon as they flip the sign to open they may be hit by an inbound Comic tsunami.

Edited August 28 by MAY1979

[MAY1979]

[Stefan_W]

On 8/26/2024 at 11:40 PM, 0r0d said:

If the inner well is the same size, did you check the slab dimensions to see if those changed?  I mean, inside where the inner well sits.  How about inner well material type and stiffness?

As I mentioned earlier, I did this before and saw that the dimensions were unchanged so I did not include it in the video. The question is fair though and I am kicking myself for not just doing it again while the camera was one. 

I pulled three recent cases that housed books with bent inner wells and one that was graded about a year ago and thus was straight with no issues. The dimensions on the inside where the inner well is house are about 27.5 cm by 19.5 cm. I lined them up for a photo to show the ledges all line up. The cracks in the cases are because I opened them up and they do not impact on the measurements.

Also excuse my hands looking shabby - tis the season for lots of yardwork. 

 

[grandmoph]

Ugh. I have some comics being graded now. I am really regretting sending them in.

I had sent them to a presser a couple of months ago with instructions to send them to CGC afterwards. I was hoping CGC would have this issue resolved by now, but it just seems to be getting worse.

[0r0d]

On 8/27/2024 at 5:11 PM, Stefan_W said:

As I mentioned earlier, I did this before and saw that the dimensions were unchanged so I did not include it in the video. The question is fair though and I am kicking myself for not just doing it again while the camera was one. 

I pulled three recent cases that housed books with bent inner wells and one that was graded about a year ago and thus was straight with no issues. The dimensions on the inside where the inner well is house are about 27.5 cm by 19.5 cm. I lined them up for a photo to show the ledges all line up. The cracks in the cases are because I opened them up and they do not impact on the measurements.

 

It'd be interesting to do some tests like taking a new inner well and seeing how it fits inside the old cases, and an old inner well and fit it inside a new slab.

There's something going on there and it's probably too small and/or subtle to measure unless you actually try to fit the inner part into the outer slab and see where it actually gets bent.

[Stefan_W]

On 8/27/2024 at 8:18 PM, 0r0d said:

It'd be interesting to do some tests like taking a new inner well and seeing how it fits inside the old cases, and an old inner well and fit it inside a new slab.

There's something going on there and it's probably too small and/or subtle to measure unless you actually try to fit the inner part into the outer slab and see where it actually gets bent.

For sure. I have some ideas for testing that I will try out once I am done with making a batch of pickles tomorrow. 

[Stefan_W]

This is in the interest of documenting as much as possible in case something becomes relevant down the road. The three inner wells below were the bent ones for the books I cracked yesterday for my video. They are still just as bent after about 30 hours, which is expected since the plastic is rigid. 

 

[electricprune]

On 8/27/2024 at 8:11 PM, Stefan_W said:

 

 

 

Stefan, are these laying on one of the long sides? If so, look at what appears to be the barrier on the end (I don’t know if this would be the top or bottom.)

They are almost all in different orientations, and the third on from the top looks to be off by 10 degrees or more. If the inner well was packed against the point that is closest to the middle, that could account for a couple on millimeters at least. If both the top and the bottom are like that. It would be that much worse.

[wiparker824]

A nice explanation of what bending the book can cause and how it “impacts the condition” of the book from the horse’s mouth. 

[Stefan_W]

On 8/27/2024 at 8:38 PM, electricprune said:

Stefan, are these laying on one of the long sides? If so, look at what appears to be the barrier on the end (I don’t know if this would be the top or bottom.)

They are almost all in different orientations, and the third on from the top looks to be off by 10 degrees or more. If the inner well was packed against the point that is closest to the middle, that could account for a couple on millimeters at least. If both the top and the bottom are like that. It would be that much worse.

It is an optical illusion. There is a ridge of plastic in the well that stops the book from dropping or going too high. I had to photograph it from an angle to get it to show, but that distorts it to some degree. I was hoping people would see it lining up, but I guess the angle of the photo does not do that very well. 

They line up perfectly. 

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 8/27/2024 at 2:40 PM, bc said:

This one suggests that the "bowing" is more parabolic than other pics shown thus far in this thread.

-bc

 

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

On 8/27/2024 at 5:50 PM, wiparker824 said:

A nice explanation of what bending the book can cause and how it “impacts the condition” of the book from the horse’s mouth. 

[electricprune]

On 8/27/2024 at 9:07 PM, Stefan_W said:

It is an optical illusion. There is a ridge of plastic in the well that stops the book from dropping or going too high. I had to photograph it from an angle to get it to show, but that distorts it to some degree. I was hoping people would see it lining up, but I guess the angle of the photo does not do that very well. 

They line up perfectly. 

Ah, ok. Thanks!

[electricprune]

I was finally able to get a “better” picture of mine. The gulley going through Kid Colt’s legs now extends almost out to the K in the title.

A pretty solid look for a 9.4.

Edited August 28 by electricprune

[electricprune]

Here is a picture of the bottom of mine. I believe it was RMA and bc that hinted at the parabolic shape the book is now in. I believe it is putting the top of the spine in compression, and that is causing the front cover to bend, crease, and show the gulleys. The back of the cover is actually being put into tension, and that is why we are not seeing the damage on the back covers. The open edge is far less susceptible to the damage.

Stefan’s picture of the well still showing the curving a day later tends to back this up.

Where are our structural engineers? They can explain this far better than I can.

[Stuk]

On 8/27/2024 at 11:59 AM, El Toro Rojo said:

You need to lay off the pressure when pressing, too - you got a gift grade in the first place with those sunken staples.

A bit off topic, but it is true. "Recessed staples," according to CGC's own grading guidelines, max out at 9.6.

[ChrispyC66]

I know I’m really, really, really late to respond to this post. But  I just watched YT video tonight, about this post. I had assumed this problem was resolved last year.

FWIW - I posted about this problem, on these boards, in June of last year, about two of my May orders in ‘23. I received 13 of 15 slabs in one order and 3 of 10 slabs in another order with improperly sealed slabs and a noticeable bowl shape to the books, some with damage.

Because of the 14 day ME policy, I quickly returned the damaged slabs and requested them to be re-pressed and re-slabbed. They were re-slabbed and returned. Here was my original post, hopefully it won’t be deleted.

https://boards.cgccomics.com/topic/350613-where-in-the-world-was-the-quality-control-at-cgc/page/262/#elControls_12827591_menu

I have had ~75-100 books slabbed since the May ‘23 orders and all those slabs were fine. 

Edited August 28 by ChrispyC66
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[DaveSFU]

My books have been with CGC for over a month now in ME.   CS has told me multiple times theres nothing wrong, they arent damaged, wells not bent, theres no issue at all and theyre sorry if thats not what i want to hear.   But the books are still sitting there.  Very much sick of dealing with CS and wish someone in any position of authority would talk to me

[Figment]

54 pages of visual evidence and there's still "nothing wrong" according to CGC.  Well there may be nothing wrong according to CGC, but there is certainly something wrong with CGC.  And yet still people send in their books.  I don't get it, I'll never understand it, and I have since abandoned buying any CGC slab with a serial number starting with 3 or 4.