CGC 9.8 Hulk Annual #1

[Red Hook]

Furthermore...

 

Shouldn't someone who supposedly has a respect & appreciation for pedigrees refrain from doing work on such books?

 

a. You're assuming he did work on the book.

b. He doesn't think there is anything wrong with spot pressing.

 

Just for the record. Not disagreeing with you.

[nearmint]

Furthermore...

 

Shouldn't someone who supposedly has a respect & appreciation for pedigrees refrain from doing work on such books?

 

We don't know that work was done. But, as in any topic about pressing, I'm sure those that are against it will think he should leave peds alone, while those who aren't bothered by pressing wouldn't mind.

[THE_BEYONDER]

Furthermore...

 

Shouldn't someone who supposedly has a respect & appreciation for pedigrees refrain from doing work on such books?

 

a. You're assuming he did work on the book.

b. He doesn't think there is anything wrong with spot pressing.

 

Just for the record.

 

Until I'm informed otherwise....I am definately assuming he pressed the book.

 

If Matt really believed that there was "nothing wrong with spot pressing" he would disclose info upfront & not hide behind the "You just have to ask" BS

[Davenport]

He responded that he submits so many books, there's bound to be an occasional mistake. He added that he knows that the boards watch his books very carefully, and it simply wouldn't be worth it, even if he had the inclination, to try and slip something like this by anyone. This thread is very good evidence that he's right about that.

The auction subtitle: "The only CGC 9.8 in existence! Beats 22 9.6 copies!"

Goes from $690 to $2336.

Worth it.

[THE_BEYONDER]

Furthermore...

 

Shouldn't someone who supposedly has a respect & appreciation for pedigrees refrain from doing work on such books?

 

We don't know that work was done. But, as in any topic about pressing, I'm sure those that are against it will think he should leave peds alone, while those who aren't bothered by pressing wouldn't mind.

 

This has nothing to do with one's stance on the practice of pressing. This is about deceit & manipulation. Period.

[jbud73]

That's a pretty balanced statement LR. I definitely agree that you have a point. The issue I have is that people in this hobby tend to wear different "hats" and assume different identities when it suits their purpose. In my experience which occurs in the political realm this is very commonplace, but that still doesn't mean that they should not be called out on it. The old adage, its a two-way street is I believe applicable here. For example:

 

CGC has specifically targeted and positioned itself as a flag bearer of impartiality and legitimacy in the hobby. The slogan "the difference is CGC" the use of the word guarantee in the their company name etc etc. However, on numerous occasions when the heat got turned up, I've also seen the 180 come out. "We're just a company who offers an opinion on a comic book, which is only valid at the time the book is encapsulated."

 

Similarly Matt Nelson gets a lot of mileage out of "Matt has been an Overstreet advisor since 1994, and regularly contributes to the Comic Book Marketplace, Overstreet’s Comic Price Review, Overstreet Grading Guide and Price Guide. He genuinely loves comics, and wakes up every day thankful that he works with his passion—and gets paid for it." as well as....

 

"But this fantastic revolution also bears hazard. The market can be treacherous, ready to make a right turn when you least expect it. And there are many ways you can be taken advantage of. One misstep could cost you hundreds, or even thousands of dollars. When you sell, you need to know how to maximize your profit for each book. When buying, you want to make sure your investment will reap great rewards—both short-term and long-term. Classics Incorporated can do this for you."

 

So from these quotes someone would garner that Matt is an industry leader, who can help you navigate the pitfalls in the market and mazimize the utility of your investment.

 

Now we know the buyer is Bill Hughes so I doubt he needs Matt's protection in the marketplace, but what if the buyer was just some average collector oblivious to the finer nuances of the hobby?? Did Matt Protect their interests and maximize the utility of their purchasing dollar???

 

Quite frankly No. What he was poised to do was pump an extra $1400 out of someone, more if you consider he dropped the ball (intentionally or not) though the BSD "oops I forgot Oliver North" defense has worn thin, by not advising the buyer that the book used to be a 9.6 and used to be the Northland copy.

 

So in effect IMO Matt is a worse perpetrator than some of the EBAY fraudsters, because he really is a wolf in sheep's clothing. He is advertising on his status and merit in the industry, yet at the same time using the skils that got him that status to pump every last nickel out of the buying public. Instead of sheep to the sheppard, its sheep to the slaughter.

[divad]

Bravissimo!

[divad]

Damn, I forgot . . . Matt's still got five of my books

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

[Ze-man]

Furthermore...

 

Shouldn't someone who supposedly has a respect & appreciation for pedigrees refrain from doing work on such books?

 

We don't know that work was done. But, as in any topic about pressing, I'm sure those that are against it will think he should leave peds alone, while those who aren't bothered by pressing wouldn't mind.

 

This has nothing to do with one's stance on the practice of pressing. This is about deceit & manipulation. Period.

 

 

Why of all people would Matt bother resubbing a 9.6 book without first working his magic on it? On the off chance a random resub might garner him a .2 bump?

If we are talking about flaws of a miniscule nature that keep a book from being either a 9.6 or a 9.8, and Matt can safely remove a few of those minute flaws it would be stupid to think he would not bother pressing it to give it the best possible shot at 9.8. It could very well still recieve a 9.6, or be damaged during the process. It is a conservative gamble.

 

So lets move past the sticking point that the best presser out there would not utilize his own skills when resubbing books, with the intent of reselling them for maximum profit.

 

What bothers me the most is why/how the old CGC labels of these Pedigree books are not sent in WITH the book from the get go. And are only sent to CGC after the book has been slabbed so they can THEN be removed from the census. Hence the original uproar over the collecting community "losing" Pedigree books forever through this form of resub bait and switch practice. If Matt sent in the old labels with his re subs there would be no room for error unless CGC goofed.

 

 

Which brings us to the crux of this whole issue. Since pressing is not considered restoration, and pressing is what Matt does for a living. Why does he continue to feed the stigma surrounding pressing by hiding what he does for a living to those he is selling his books to?

 

No need to answer that question..everyone already knows.

 

 

 

Ze-

[Aman619]

you dont want to send th elabels back with the pressed book because then you arechallenging CGC that they undergraded it. The feeling is that they would stick to their guns. Since grading is subjective, a fresh look at a fresh book i sbetter.

[Ze-man]

I thought the graders do not know it is a resub. To them the book in front of them IS a fresh book.

 

Correct?

 

Ze-

[jbud73]

David I'm not harping on Matt's skills - but the misrepresentation of his books for public auction, I would argue this is a deliberate decision. I also hate the precedent that this sets and all the lawyers around here should be all too familiar with that word. Here's Matt an industry leader, pillar of the collecting community and look at how he manuevers in the marketplace. Well if that's how the best and brightest operate, worse yet the behavior is tolerated and even encouraged by the structure inherit in the system , its open season for the rest of the snake oil salesmen to come into this hobby and do as they please.

 

I love comics and comic collecting, but it always seems such a short sighted enterprise on the part of the individuals whom have the influence to shape the hobby. Part of that may be due to the fact that collectors were complacent, but I see a new generation (nothing to do with age) of collector who will no longer allow that to be the case.

[Red Hook]

Jason Ewert used the leeway he felt (correctly) he had, and look at the mess he created.

 

Matt, welcome to your intervention!

 

Brad

[Aman619]

I thought the graders do not know it is a resub. To them the book in front of them IS a fresh book.

 

Correct?

 

Ze-

 

thats the question, aint it?

[Ze-man]

Here's Matt an industry leader, pillar of the collecting community and look at how he manuevers in the marketplace. .

 

This is exactly why I wrote Matt and asked him to send back my pressing candidates from the experiment thread. I overlooked all too readily my feelings about his selling practices because I was eager to learn first hand as much as possible about pressing that I could.

 

I was in denial I suppose. But these recent events made my decision alot easier.

 

 

 

Ze-

[Sal]

I thought the graders do not know it is a resub. To them the book in front of them IS a fresh book.

 

Correct?

 

Ze-

 

thats the question, aint it?

 

i reference back to BEYONDER's "probabilty matrix," tossed with a light Occam's Razor sauce.

 

in truth, if you actually believe that CGC would let the graders know whose book they are working on, you might as well quit the hobby. or at least a large portion of it. or only trade with other OOs

[Ze-man]

I thought the graders do not know it is a resub. To them the book in front of them IS a fresh book.

 

Correct?

 

Ze-

 

thats the question, aint it?

 

i reference back to BEYONDER's "probabilty matrix," tossed with a light Occam's Razor sauce.

 

in truth, if you actually believe that CGC would let the graders know whose book they are working on, you might as well quit the hobby. or at least a large portion of it. or only trade with other OOs

 

I could see myself collecting Pez dispensers and Lunch boxes. They are mildly comic related at least.

[Aman619]

I thought the graders do not know it is a resub. To them the book in front of them IS a fresh book.

 

Correct?

 

Ze-

 

thats the question, aint it?

 

i reference back to BEYONDER's "probabilty matrix," tossed with a light Occam's Razor sauce.

 

in truth, if you actually believe that CGC would let the graders know whose book they are working on, you might as well quit the hobby. or at least a large portion of it. or only trade with other OOs

 

to me, I dont think every book is anonymous, nor is every book earmarked as it moves thru the system.

But certain books must certainly attract their attention arriving and passing thru the system.

[OldGuy]

I thought the graders do not know it is a resub. To them the book in front of them IS a fresh book.

 

Correct?

 

Ze-

 

thats the question, aint it?

 

i reference back to BEYONDER's "probabilty matrix," tossed with a light Occam's Razor sauce.

 

in truth, if you actually believe that CGC would let the graders know whose book they are working on, you might as well quit the hobby. or at least a large portion of it. or only trade with other OOs

 

Steve B. has stated on these boards that there are plenty of times he knows whos books he's grading.