San Diego tale of woe

[Mister Trent]

Yeah,

But they found the buyer and explained they made a mistake. It wasn't a " we can get a few extra bucks from someone else mistake" It was a "Big" mistake. From what I understand they even offered some free stuff. Granted the buyer doesn't have to do anything but it seems like the nice thing to do would be to cut the seller some slack. If no one says anything, fine you got a deal but the guy choose to take advantage of the situation.

Am I mistaken or did I read in this thread that the buyer stated he sold it during the show and it turned out he sold it a week later?

 

Like I say, I'm fully sympathetic with Spider's plight. He was more than generous and up front in his attempts to rectify a genuine mistake.

 

The observation I was making is that many dealers (though not all) seek to maximize profits for the lowest possible outlay. Without going into specifics, I can think of a number of individuals who would exploit a lack of knowledge on the seller's behalf to their own (profitable) advantage (and I'm talking serious money here, not just a, "few extra bucks"). The Rober scenario does have a different twist to it, but the element of (excessive) greed is still there.

[artdealer]

The problem that most of you can't see is that it's all about what happened between the consignor and seller.

I sell art as a full time business. If I made a "mistake", such as the seller supposedly did, I would be completely responsible for making up the difference. I have sold dozens of originals for collectors without a problem, but then again, I do this for a living, while the seller, sells mostly comic books.

How difficult must it have been for the consignor say to the seller, I want $10,000 for the art. How stupid must the seller have been not to write down the prices, or at the very least, pencil the prices on the back! Where was the misunderstanding? Of course there is the assumption that the seller really couldn't figure out that the Frazetta should have been $10,000 not $1,000? Come on, is he that dumb that he doesn't know Frazetta prices? Sorry, I don't believe that

My feeling is that the seller should pay the difference. Rober doesn't figure into this. He saw a bargain and took advantage. Rober had no obligation to return it to either the seller or the consignor. And really, how many collectors would have? I not sticking up for Rober. I don;t know him that well and I have never done a deal with him. He just got lucky.

The seller should have just been a mensch and paid the difference to the consignor.

My 2 cents.

Mitch Itkowitz

Graphic Collectibles

[Nexus]

The problem that most of you can't see is that it's all about what happened between the consignor and seller.

I sell art as a full time business. If I made a "mistake", such as the seller supposedly did, I would be completely responsible for making up the difference. I have sold dozens of originals for collectors without a problem, but then again, I do this for a living, while the seller, sells mostly comic books.

How difficult must it have been for the consignor say to the seller, I want $10,000 for the art. How stupid must the seller have been not to write down the prices, or at the very least, pencil the prices on the back! Where was the misunderstanding? Of course there is the assumption that the seller really couldn't figure out that the Frazetta should have been $10,000 not $1,000? Come on, is he that dumb that he doesn't know Frazetta prices? Sorry, I don't believe that

My feeling is that the seller should pay the difference. Rober doesn't figure into this. He saw a bargain and took advantage. Rober had no obligation to return it to either the seller or the consignor. And really, how many collectors would have? I not sticking up for Rober. I don;t know him that well and I have never done a deal with him. He just got lucky.

The seller should have just been a mensch and paid the difference to the consignor.

My 2 cents.

Mitch Itkowitz

Graphic Collectibles

 

How stupid is it to comment on this situation without reading what happened? The consignor did tell the seller the price. The seller did write it down. The problem was that the consignor accidentally misspoke the price. There really wasn't even a misunderstanding. It was just a mistake.

 

As for knowing the price of a Frazetta prelim...well, yes, I am that dumb. As I explained earlier, I don't know squat about Frazetta. A fact the consignor was aware of.

 

Anyhow, didn't you just post this yesterday?:

 

"Sorry you don't understand any of what I explained. I do have a private life outside my business and if you can't understand it, well that's too bad. Mistakes are made all the time. If you are that perfect, having never made a mistake, let me know if you also walk on water.I apoligized and if you can't accept that, I don't know what else to say."

 

Smacks of hypocrisy to me. My two cents.

[Mister Trent]

. . . Rober doesn't figure into this. He saw a bargain and took advantage. Rober had no obligation to return it to either the seller or the consignor. And really, how many collectors would have? I not sticking up for Rober. I don;t know him that well and I have never done a deal with him. He just got lucky.

 

My 2 cents.

Mitch Itkowitz

Graphic Collectibles

 

Sadly, that's the crux of the matter.

[artdealer]

Still your responsibility to make up the difference since you made the mistake!

[Nexus]

Still your responsibility to make up the difference since you made the mistake!

 

My mistake how? The consignor named the price. I wrote it down and sold it for that price. As it turns out, the consignor gave the wrong price. So, again, how is this my mistake?

 

About the only thing you wrote with any accuracy is that Rober saw a bargain and took advantage of it. But unlike you, I believe that most collectors would have returned it once they learned that an honest mistake had been made. I guess I have a higher opinion of this collecting community than you.

[Stronguy]

Still your responsibility to make up the difference since you made the mistake!

 

I smell Troll.

[artdealer]

Nope, you just smell yourself.

I'm not hear to cause problems, just stating my 2 cents.

[WOXL]

My mistake how? The consignor named the price. I wrote it down and sold it for that price. As it turns out, the consignor gave the wrong price. So, again, how is this my mistake?

 

artdealer,

 

Could you please directly answer this question from Nexus?

 

-Bob

[pkveronese]

Come on, is he that dumb that he doesn't know Frazetta prices?

 

Mitch, I think you're being more than a little rude here.

[CW]

Rober has no obligation at all. The point is that it would have been the right thing to do. If I had bought that piece and Felix came up to me and said "guess what...." I would give it back to him.(I realize some will argue hindsight 20/20) I feel it is more of a matter of being able to sleep at night. I am by no means a pillar of moral uprightness but just because an opportunity presents itself to make money doesn't mean you have to take it at someone elses expense.

 

I think the hypothetical was placed that: if a guy was walking down the street and dropped $20 one has no obligation to tell him. They could simply pick it up and keep it but some people in this world feel that isn't the right thing to do.

 

This matter isn't a legal issue of peoples rights towards what action they are obligated to take it is a matter of being a decent human being. I don't know Rober and I have found that life is niether black nor white but shades of grey; meaning he may be a nice fellow most of the time or somebody did the same thing to him last week. My point is that if given the opportunity would you say "I'll help you out" or "Tough "? Especially if the person you would be helping is a decent person to boot?

-Chris

[Nexus]

Still your responsibility to make up the difference since you made the mistake!

 

I smell Troll.

 

No, not a troll. Just misinformed, hypocritical, arrogant, and stubborn. Nonetheless, I still have a higher opinion of him than Rober...but maybe only because I've never dealt with him before.

[Nexus]

My mistake how? The consignor named the price. I wrote it down and sold it for that price. As it turns out, the consignor gave the wrong price. So, again, how is this my mistake?

 

artdealer,

 

Could you please directly answer this question from Nexus?

 

-Bob

 

Thanks Bob

 

I'm sure Mitch will get to it once he's not so busy giving lectures on how to be a "mensch".

[Nexus]

Come on, is he that dumb that he doesn't know Frazetta prices?

 

Mitch, I think you're being more than a little rude here.

 

It's OK, I give as good as I get. I'm immature like that. But it also means that if I dish it out, I can take it as well. The question is, can Mitch?

[Nexus]

Rober has no obligation at all. The point is that it would have been the right thing to do. If I had bought that piece and Felix came up to me and said "guess what...." I would give it back to him.(I realize some will argue hindsight 20/20) I feel it is more of a matter of being able to sleep at night. I am by no means a pillar of moral uprightness but just because an opportunity presents itself to make money doesn't mean you have to take it at someone elses expense.

 

I think the hypothetical was placed that: if a guy was walking down the street and dropped $20 one has no obligation to tell him. They could simply pick it up and keep it but some people in this world feel that isn't the right thing to do.

 

This matter isn't a legal issue of peoples rights towards what action they are obligated to take it is a matter of being a decent human being. I don't know Rober and I have found that life is niether black nor white but shades of grey; meaning he may be a nice fellow most of the time or somebody did the same thing to him last week. My point is that if given the opportunity would you say "I'll help you out" or "Tough "? Especially if the person you would be helping is a decent person to boot?

-Chris

 

Thanks Chris. I can always count on you for a reasoned, well-thought out post. I'm two weeks into an all-vegan diet (no carbs or sugar, either), so I'm a little cranky. To say the least. I should have been more restrained in my posts. Unless Rober chimes in, I've said all I have to say on this matter. Thanks again to everyone for their support.

[artdealer]

Maybe someone can point me to the post that says it was the consignors fault the art was

mispriced, cause I just don't see it.

 

Mitch I

[Apotheosis]

Artdealer, here is the part where it wasn't Nexus' fault.

 

Flash forward to Preview Night at Comic Con. Steve brings the pieces to my booth. We price them out: He tells me the sticker price as well as any wiggle room with each piece. When it comes to the piece in question (a smallish 4” X 3” prelim), Steve says “That one’s fifteen HUNDRED, but I’ll take twelve”. I’m sure now that he had “fifteen THOUSAND” in his head, but “fifteen hundred” is what he said. It happens. Thankfully (for me), there was a third party at the booth who was there the entire time this took place and heard “fifteen hundred” as well, clear as day.

 

It's on page two and is Nexus' first post if you want to re-read the entire post.

[artdealer]

Ah well, can't win them all. Then of course the consignor is SOL.

I'm right this time, Right?

[langur88]

The fault does not lie with the person who bought the art. He paid the price asked by the person who was in charge of selling it. Period. The buyer is not obligated to share his personal knowledge of art and prices with the seller. This is why knowledge is power. He did'nt steal it. He bought it for the price that was asked by the person in charge of selling it.

 

The screw up was between the consigner and the dealer "friend". Think about this before the lynching party is rounded up.

 

where does "Do The Right Thing" fit in here? because as far as i can see it, this isn't a legal issue, it's a moral one

 

I am talking pure responsibility. The owner of the books passed responsibility to the friend dealer. Of course the buyer knew a good value and maybe even realized that a mistake had been made. I saw this happen a few years ago with an ambiguously priced Spidey 1 at a Big Apple show. Yes, the Ditko one. Is there another? The book was sold by the dealer's helper when the dealer was away from the table. I can still see the dealers face change from joy to horror when told that he had gotten $250 instead of $2500 for the book. The "buyer" had asked the dealer about the book at least twice earlier and had even had the dealer take it out of the Mylar so that he could look it over. He knew full well the correct price of the book. The worst part was that is was a consignment book! I had someone pull the same thing when my 12 year old son misread the price on a Flash 137 at a show. The "buyer" must have run like the Flash because I caught on quick and he was gone in a flash. You notice that missing expensive book from the display. I expect a lot more from an adult than with a twelve year old. I was not upset with my son. It was probably a good lesson for him to experience.

 

Bottom line:

 

The agent of the owner (the friend dealer) sold the art at a price that he was not authorized to. If they had their ducks in a row the art would have been priced correctly. They need to work it out because thats where the real fault lies.

[langur88]

The fault does not lie with the person who bought the art. He paid the price asked by the person who was in charge of selling it. Period. The buyer is not obligated to share his personal knowledge of art and prices with the seller. This is why knowledge is power. He did'nt steal it. He bought it for the price that was asked by the person in charge of selling it.

 

The screw up was between the consigner and the dealer "friend". Think about this before the lynching party is rounded up.

 

 

True, the scumbag that bought the piece technically didn't do anything wrong, .

 

Then why is he a scumbag and why are you jumping on me for my honest opinion?

 

I don't have the art and have nothing to do with this.

 

This is why we live in a country of laws. I answered it as a legal question.