PROBATION DISCUSSIONS 21 21

[jsilverjanet]

Solarcadet's nomination is a "nip it in the bud" thing. IMHO, he has the ability to get that far (a la CapFreak) and has proven so with just a few actions here. I don't think it is an overreaction.

 

Menace does seem PL-worthy, but not HoS.

 

 

 

-slym

 

I do agree with Slym. Solarcadet lied about his father's death to get out of a transaction (and admitted it later), changed up his sales terms in the middle of an active transaction, and then blew it all out of proportion by (1) stating he didn't care as he would do transactions privately and (2) started changing his username a few times.

 

He started off with PL-level activity, and pretty much drove people to a HOS vote with his Cap Freak-like antics.

 

I'm pretty certain his I don't care attitude was what sped up the process. All this despite having cool books

[Speedy-D]

Yes, a blind poll. Colour me unimpressed. Take a poll in moderns on whether the latest TV rumour will be a smash hit. People love to pile on.

 

 

Here is what I see.

 

Menace took on way too much. I called this the day he joined the boards. For those who wish to research I believe I posted this when he offered multiple opps in the 1st week he joined the boards.

 

So he is now drowning in a pile of commitments and I'll bet he is so overwhelmed that he has no idea what to do next. I'll also bet that he is not organized enough to even have an idea of the full list to be completed.

 

So, as a community we can step on the head of the drowning man or help him out of the water. All I see here is inexperience and not a desire to rip anyone off. Someone asked if holding a buyer's money for 5 months is ripping someone off. No it is not. He was refunded.

 

So long as Menace has a desire and we see an attempt to clear things up then he belongs on the probation list. When all those with an issue decide to write off their time and money then we can all say a collective you and put him in the HOS.

 

Doug Scott offered to help with one issue and there are a few of us that can help with the other opps if need be.

 

I completely understand that some feel disrespected, used, played or lied to but when we don't take intention into account and only the results then who does that leave willing to try?

 

Signature Series and sketch opps can become overwhelming very fast. I probably have more experience than the average submitter and I severely limit the quantity and control who I allow to submit through me. This was learned over time.

 

Is this just a really long winded way of saying "Burn the Witch?" If not, expect it to fall on deaf ears.

 

I think we can agree on the odds of anything calming the mob but I thought it was worth a try. The HOS is quickly becoming useless as well. I stopped using the "No HoS or Probies" in my sales threads. Although the list of boardies I will not accept any SS subs from has grown tremendously.

 

In the SS forum, Menace said he never received my email. PM me your email and I can forward you his response to my email. Its not just about getting my refund. I am not going to let him bash me by saying he did not get my emails. He is showing no remorse and needs to man up and tell the truth for once.

 

So I am still waiting for this communication to be produced... was this a lie? Who needs to man up and tell the truth here?

 

Not sure if you've noticed which way the wind is blowing in this thread, but if I were you I wouldn't go stirring things up right now.

[N/A]

As much as I am critical of Menace's handling of communication and fulfillment of duties in all the matters that came to light, I can't help but feel that adding him to a list of people who are actual thieves is an error that, in retrospect, will be the moment when this type of list "jumped the shark" into irrelevance, sadly.

 

+1, unless the HOS is kept for just the most egregious incidents, it looses it's bite.

 

I didn't vote either, I watch this forum but I got sidetracked and missed it, which is why I'd like the votes to be in CG, with a specific header, Proposal for So and So to enter the HOS, with the thread bumped so more people can see it. The more people who see it and vote, the more relevant any decision becomes.

 

But I don't think it will work without a lead statement, stating exactly what the HOS is for. I think there are newer people who think it equates to being told to sit in the corner in school. It's just that easy for new people to nagivate...or SOT either it seems;)

 

 

It might be a lack of experience or perspective, as many of the folks advocating most strongly for HOS in the last couple of incidents were not even here for most of the HOS member's inductions much less witnessed their actions first hand.

 

That might be the disconnect as if they don't realize there were full on 5 figures scams and criminal acts amongst those earlier inductees they make think that the PL list is a "jerk list" and the HOS is a "mega jerk list"

 

The red rocks and solarcadet inductions were the furthest afield we'd traveled. It departed from flat out theft and wanton forum destruction to more civil issues, borderline fraud, and simply lying. All are bad actions, but the HOS was carved out as a place mostly for those beyond (or not desirous of) rehabilitation. The argument for including those that thumbed their nose at the lies and misdeeds and the forum in general. That made sense. They didn't want to be here, conform to the laws of civility here, and do right by others here, so it was ensured they would get their wish and not be welcome here.

 

RR and Solar seemed mostly of this ilk. The new breed of unrepentant guys who don't care to conform to the rules set up or to take seriously their duties to others. I get that. It was a stretch from what the HOS started out at, but I got how the discussion went that way.

 

The Menace situation doesn't give me any sense of why or how this fits in with all the other "rogues". Even if ineffective and slow, he seems to be responding and attempting to fix his issues.

 

This leap, from Alleybat (for example), to Solarcadet, to Menace seems to have lost something in translation and it doesn't seem for the better.

 

I used to assume that the HoS was like the "Hall of Fame for Scoundrels" and that I'd know a bona fide candidate when I saw one, kind of like how there is often a clear consensus on certain athletes that they are headed for the Hall of Fame. But I can see this analogy is not sufficient.

 

Neither Solarcadet nor Menace are in any sense Hall of Fame scoundrels, not even close.

 

So make a poll calling for a vote to get them off the list

 

You keep saying this but the vote don't work.

[N/A]

Has Menace refunded everyone who wanted or needed a refund ?

 

Only one refund that I'm aware of and it's done. Apparently one open sketch opp and the books will be at CGC after the holidays.

 

Good thing we saved the community from him.

 

I just can't see putting this guy in the HOS if he has tried... and is continuing to try... to get the job done.

 

I know a member who can call moderation and get things done in less than 24 hours... maybe we can have him instantly taken off.

 

I have no idea what you're talking about and yet I'm very interested.

 

Since he's in the HOS, he really doesn't have any reason to try to get anything done now. No refunds, no books, no anything.

 

I know the guy didn't handle his business to the best of his abilities... but it appeared he was trying.

 

I suspect he will still fulfill his obligations and the pro-HOS crew will claim it is because they voted him in when it will actually show how foolish they were to do it.

 

Lets hope so. It would be proof that he IS a good person to do business with and not the flake people voted him in for...

 

People didn't vote him a flake. They voted him a dangerous offender. Anyone who voted him a flake completely missed the point of the HOS. (thumbs u

[N/A]

Solarcadet's nomination is a "nip it in the bud" thing. IMHO, he has the ability to get that far (a la CapFreak) and has proven so with just a few actions here. I don't think it is an overreaction.

 

Menace does seem PL-worthy, but not HoS.

 

 

 

-slym

 

Solarcadet dared the boards to do their worst and they did. He brought it on himself and almost requested to be in the HOS. His actions may not be worthy but if he really wants to be there......

[N/A]

Has Menace refunded everyone who wanted or needed a refund ?

 

Only one refund that I'm aware of and it's done. Apparently one open sketch opp and the books will be at CGC after the holidays.

 

Good thing we saved the community from him.

 

I just can't see putting this guy in the HOS if he has tried... and is continuing to try... to get the job done.

 

I know a member who can call moderation and get things done in less than 24 hours... maybe we can have him instantly taken off.

 

I have no idea what you're talking about and yet I'm very interested.

 

Since he's in the HOS, he really doesn't have any reason to try to get anything done now. No refunds, no books, no anything.

 

I know the guy didn't handle his business to the best of his abilities... but it appeared he was trying.

 

I suspect he will still fulfill his obligations and the pro-HOS crew will claim it is because they voted him in when it will actually show how foolish they were to do it.

 

Lets hope so. It would be proof that he IS a good person to do business with and not the flake people voted him in for...

Well...there's lots of room to get your obligations met eventually and still be a flake. And being a flake shouldn't be enough to get you on the HoS. If people remember what it was like when Frankie (Dr. Frankenstein aka Muscleshark) or Alleybat or Cap Freak were tearing it up, there's a huge difference. To tell you the truth, some of the stuff I've been hearing about solarcadet is closer to that than what Menace's situation appears to be.

 

I'll agree with you on that. Having been around a bit more and educating myself on how things work here, I can understand the true meaning of having the HoS and PL. Menace's situation WAS more of a PL than HoS offense. If there is a poll to remove him, I will be changing my vote to do so.

 

And thanks for the info on the SS stuff I inquired about.

 

 

I rest my case. (thumbs u

[Bosco685]

Solarcadet's nomination is a "nip it in the bud" thing. IMHO, he has the ability to get that far (a la CapFreak) and has proven so with just a few actions here. I don't think it is an overreaction.

 

Menace does seem PL-worthy, but not HoS.

 

 

 

-slym

 

I do agree with Slym. Solarcadet lied about his father's death to get out of a transaction (and admitted it later), changed up his sales terms in the middle of an active transaction, and then blew it all out of proportion by (1) stating he didn't care as he would do transactions privately and (2) started changing his username a few times.

 

He started off with PL-level activity, and pretty much drove people to a HOS vote with his Cap Freak-like antics.

The Superman German "variant" situation probably left people wondering about his character. It came across like he was toying around with folks, though it wasn't like he ripped anyone off over the situation. It was just odd.

[Darrell F]

Yes, a blind poll. Colour me unimpressed. Take a poll in moderns on whether the latest TV rumour will be a smash hit. People love to pile on.

 

 

Here is what I see.

 

Menace took on way too much. I called this the day he joined the boards. For those who wish to research I believe I posted this when he offered multiple opps in the 1st week he joined the boards.

 

So he is now drowning in a pile of commitments and I'll bet he is so overwhelmed that he has no idea what to do next. I'll also bet that he is not organized enough to even have an idea of the full list to be completed.

 

So, as a community we can step on the head of the drowning man or help him out of the water. All I see here is inexperience and not a desire to rip anyone off. Someone asked if holding a buyer's money for 5 months is ripping someone off. No it is not. He was refunded.

 

So long as Menace has a desire and we see an attempt to clear things up then he belongs on the probation list. When all those with an issue decide to write off their time and money then we can all say a collective you and put him in the HOS.

 

Doug Scott offered to help with one issue and there are a few of us that can help with the other opps if need be.

 

I completely understand that some feel disrespected, used, played or lied to but when we don't take intention into account and only the results then who does that leave willing to try?

 

Signature Series and sketch opps can become overwhelming very fast. I probably have more experience than the average submitter and I severely limit the quantity and control who I allow to submit through me. This was learned over time.

 

Is this just a really long winded way of saying "Burn the Witch?" If not, expect it to fall on deaf ears.

 

I think we can agree on the odds of anything calming the mob but I thought it was worth a try. The HOS is quickly becoming useless as well. I stopped using the "No HoS or Probies" in my sales threads. Although the list of boardies I will not accept any SS subs from has grown tremendously.

 

In the SS forum, Menace said he never received my email. PM me your email and I can forward you his response to my email. Its not just about getting my refund. I am not going to let him bash me by saying he did not get my emails. He is showing no remorse and needs to man up and tell the truth for once.

 

So I am still waiting for this communication to be produced... was this a lie? Who needs to man up and tell the truth here?

 

Not sure if you've noticed which way the wind is blowing in this thread, but if I were you I wouldn't go stirring things up right now.

For what it is worth, John is up north visiting him family for Christmas and does not have internet.

[bababooey]

Can anyone link me to the post that has Menace's HOS poll ?

 

Thanks

[Logan510]

Solarcadet's nomination is a "nip it in the bud" thing. IMHO, he has the ability to get that far (a la CapFreak) and has proven so with just a few actions here. I don't think it is an overreaction.

 

Menace does seem PL-worthy, but not HoS.

 

 

 

-slym

 

I do agree with Slym. Solarcadet lied about his father's death to get out of a transaction (and admitted it later), changed up his sales terms in the middle of an active transaction, and then blew it all out of proportion by (1) stating he didn't care as he would do transactions privately and (2) started changing his username a few times.

 

He started off with PL-level activity, and pretty much drove people to a HOS vote with his Cap Freak-like antics.

 

I'm pretty certain his I don't care attitude was what sped up the process. All this despite having cool books

 

Which I am sure that the people who defended him will continue to get from him via PM

[ExcludedTim]

Can anyone link me to the post that has Menace's HOS poll ?

 

Thanks

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7234259#Post7234259

[BeachBum]

Menace didn't seem to handle his business here on the boards properly but I don't think it's HOS worthy.

[Speedy-D]

Can anyone link me to the post that has Menace's HOS poll ?

 

Thanks

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7234259#Post7234259

Let's try a little test, quite unofficial. This poll will run through Christmas Eve, and we can't see the results until it's ended.

 

[Bosco685]

Now I voted.

[jsilverjanet]

Can anyone link me to the post that has Menace's HOS poll ?

 

Thanks

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7234259#Post7234259

Let's try a little test, quite unofficial. This poll will run through Christmas Eve, and we can't see the results until it's ended.

 

a better test would be to place this in the Comics General portion of the boards.

 

 

[Speedy-D]

Can anyone link me to the post that has Menace's HOS poll ?

 

Thanks

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7234259#Post7234259

Let's try a little test, quite unofficial. This poll will run through Christmas Eve, and we can't see the results until it's ended.

 

a better test would be to place this in the Comics General portion of the boards.

 

I've already changed too many parameters maybe. If we change the whole thing up, the test won't really mean much.

[bababooey]

Can anyone link me to the post that has Menace's HOS poll ?

 

Thanks

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=7234259#Post7234259

Let's try a little test, quite unofficial. This poll will run through Christmas Eve, and we can't see the results until it's ended.

 

a better test would be to place this in the Comics General portion of the boards.

 

I've already changed too many parameters maybe. If we change the whole thing up, the test won't really mean much.

While I disagree with the last two results, what are we testing here?

 

Whether or not certain board members can influence a vote or whether people who vote in these things are influenced by results? Are we expecting people to "just read" the last few days, search back to early December and follow the sig forum links or should people be bumping old posts that are relevant to this poll to ensure people are informed?

 

If Menace wins this vote you already called it unofficial...so nothing good can come from this. I probably wouldn't be thrilled to see this exercise if it was about me and one of the main guys (TheMightyJohn) has already been identified as unavailable for the duration of this poll so it's unfair to one of the key guys lobbying for HOS.

 

Where's solarcadet's new unofficial poll? He had a higher percentage but less votes saying he was HOS worthy & less votes saying he shouldn't be in the HOS?

 

Does less "no" votes mean he has less friends here or just has less appealing stuff to offer others? @ myself for adding the loganism

 

Also since this is an unofficial exercise & I didn't vote last time - I will declare that I am going to vote for Menace to be added to the HOS. Not because I feel he is worthy but I am casting that vote on behalf of TheMightyJohn who is unable to vote.

 

Sorry Menace, it's not personal..it's because the Bill's game is blacked out. &

[comicdonna]

This thread is getting the poles put right to it.

[bababooey]

Voted

 

[Park]

 

Fonzie gliding on to the beach at the end is pretty cool though.