I recently purchased a CGG graded comic....and guess what?

[joe_collector]

This is to another reason as to why they are not accepted by me, here they come into read our posts and will not make any strides to talk with us!

 

Hey David, is your kid posting under this ID again?

 

It has been stated MANY times that CGG is simply not welcome on the CGC boards, and as competitors, Daniel has respected this edict.

[THE_BEYONDER]

Oh,and I'm quite glad to hear that Daniel not only reads this forum, but appears to take us seriously enough to be a gentleman/good businessman about matters of controversy. While I'm nervous about the edges on that book, I'm more concerned with what appears to be CGG's perception of modern fresh, new books as uglier than they really are and bronze keys as prettier than they really are. Since I use CGG for grading moderns, that could be a liability to me.

 

BTW, any truth to the theory that CGG has been prohibited by policy from joining and participating on this forum?

 

This is to another reason as to why they are not accepted by me, here they come into read our posts and will not make any strides to talk with us! I can understand this to a bit but hey why should I have to make the call to get to know them better they ought to be doing the reverse if they want to be in business a long time.

 

Davidking623

 

CGG was banned from these forums many moons ago....

[davidking623]

Oh and they were a couple tables down me at the Portland show not that it mattered to me I didnt even go look at there table or there grades.Boy is this thread documenting my belief in CGC even more!

 

I guess you missed that Batman 11 trim-job, along with the mountain of "cleaned and pressed" CGC books that are coming down the pike.

 

Make a long story short what happened?

 

Davidking623

[joe_collector]

Make a long story short what happened?

 

The forum faithful discovered a Batman 11 that had been trimmed and resubbed. -Insert tons of bickering and postering - Later CGC came in and stated that they had missed it, and a *certain seller* was trying a new "age the edges" trick that their resto gurus had missed.

 

So all's well that ends well, but I have no idea why if CGC had already caught the guy, was that Batman 11 still for sale at Heritage?

[davidking623]

This is to another reason as to why they are not accepted by me, here they come into read our posts and will not make any strides to talk with us!

 

Hey David, is your kid posting under this ID again?

 

It has been stated MANY times that CGG is simply not welcome on the CGC boards, and as competitors, Daniel has respected this edict.

 

No my son is smarter than that JC! I missed all those posts or knowledge of it! I guess contacting me via Email or thru ebay has never occured to them and that is what throws me as they must want to talk to us and send us out some free grading coupons Certainly they should be smart enough to do that! Nope havent recieved any!

 

Davidking623

[garthgantu]

Oh and they were a couple tables down me at the Portland show not that it mattered to me I didnt even go look at there table or there grades.Boy is this thread documenting my belief in CGC even more!

 

I guess you missed that Batman 11 trim-job, along with the mountain of "cleaned and pressed" CGC books that are coming down the pike.

 

Make a long story short what happened?

 

Davidking623

 

Long story short: CGC isn't perfect either, and has gone so far as to acknowledge missing trimming on the Batman 11 referenced earlier. Then there are the dozens (perhaps hundreds or even thousands) of "clean, press and resubmit" jobs that CGC has received thus far, with no indication that they consider this to be any sort of problem. (And some of the books undergoing this treatment are pedigreed books, incl. Church/Mile High and Green River, which to me is sacrilege.)

 

David, your enthusiasm for CGC is admirable. But it's pretty obvious to me that that same enthusiasm sometimes clouds your judgement. Let me turn the current situation around for a moment... if CGC had graded and slabbed a book (in Universal Blue label) that you were very confident (or even strongly suspected) had been restored, including trimming and color touch, would you send that book to CGG for a 'second opinion' ? No, you wouldn't. You'd send it to the guys who graded it the first time, to at least give them a chance to 'make things right.' Well, that's what MW1 is doing in this instance. Now, if CGG falls down on the job, MW1 can still take the book to CGC for another opinion, and then decide how best to revisit the situation with CGG...

[davidking623]

Oh and they were a couple tables down me at the Portland show not that it mattered to me I didnt even go look at there table or there grades.Boy is this thread documenting my belief in CGC even more!

 

I guess you missed that Batman 11 trim-job, along with the mountain of "cleaned and pressed" CGC books that are coming down the pike.

 

Make a long story short what happened?

 

Davidking623

 

Long story short: CGC isn't perfect either, and has gone so far as to acknowledge missing trimming on the Batman 11 referenced earlier. Then there are the dozens (perhaps hundreds or even thousands) of "clean, press and resubmit" jobs that CGC has received thus far, with no indication that they consider this to be any sort of problem. (And some of the books undergoing this treatment are pedigreed books, incl. Church/Mile High and Green River, which to me is sacrilege.)

 

David, your enthusiasm for CGC is admirable. But it's pretty obvious to me that that same enthusiasm sometimes clouds your judgement. Let me turn the current situation around for a moment... if CGC had graded and slabbed a book (in Universal Blue label) that you were very confident (or even strongly suspected) had been restored, including trimming and color touch, would you send that book to CGG for a 'second opinion' ? No, you wouldn't. You'd send it to the guys who graded it the first time, to at least give them a chance to 'make things right.' Well, that's what MW1 is doing in this instance. Now, if CGG falls down on the job, MW1 can still take the book to CGC for another opinion, and then decide how best to revisit the situation with CGG...

 

Its rather obvious CGC isnt perfect I never said they were! My enthusiamim for CGC is way more than CGG obviously! I will be quite honost I havent even looked at the scans of the book of this thread and I really beleive if it was my big dollars that MW1 has invested in this book the better play would be to send it to CGG and have them look at again and see what they think and then if he isnt in agreement then have CGC look at it! Agreed, that is the best way for him to approach it! But for me to have any faith in CGG we are at a place where maybe I can have some faith in CGG and that would be to send the book into CGC first and let those guys look it over first.Thats where my confidence lays at and its not CGG it is however CGC, if the book came back not trimmed and was labeled say a 9.2 or 9.4 I would develop confidence in them at that point but if you send it back to CGG there really is nothing there for me and I still dont have anything CONCRETE to believe in them! I guess what I am saying here is if they are going to amount to something in my eyes this seems like the best chance for it!

 

Davidking623

[MW1]

...if CGC had graded and slabbed a book (in Universal Blue label) that you were very confident (or even strongly suspected) had been restored, including trimming and color touch, would you send that book to CGG for a 'second opinion' ? No, you wouldn't. You'd send it to the guys who graded it the first time, to at least give them a chance to 'make things right.' Well, that's what MW1 is doing in this instance. Now, if CGG falls down on the job, MW1 can still take the book to CGC for another opinion, and then decide how best to revisit the situation with CGG...

Garthgantu,

 

After a great deal of discussion on this subject, I agree. Why play silly games with grading? Sometimes, grading mistakes are made. Inform the seller and give the company that made the mistake a chance to correct it. If they can't or are unwilling, THEN seek a second opinion. Work within the framework of the person who sold you the comic and the company that graded it. No reason to do things backwards or to circumvent this process unless one has a different objective in mind.

 

Incidentally, I sent off the comic earlier this evening for next day delivery to CGG. I will keep everyone updated on what transpires.

[shadroch]

I've read this thread with great interest and held off on responding becauseI wanted to get eveyone elses view first.

The whole point of third party grading is that a supposed unbiased person rades the book.With no bia,they make the grade and once it is graded that is what it is. Once a book is slabbed as any particular grade,that is what the book is. It is no longer a dealers 8.5 or 9.0,it is now a CGC or CGG 8.5 or 9.0.The dealer has paid for this grading,and in the case of CGC,a restoration check.

Short of the book being damaged while slabbed,this should be the end of the story. When you send a book to CGC ,you are paying for a restoration check.When you send it to another service,this is not the case.

When a buyer buys a CGC book,they buy a book that has been examined for restoration,this adds value to the book. When one buys from another service,the price is often less because it doesn't include this added service.

While this is certainly a flaw in the other parties service,the buyer knows this when he buys.As CGG doesn't charge for restoration checks,I would feel they are under no obligation to detect it.If they do,great.If they don't-the person is getting what he paid for,a graded and slabbed book.

Anyone bidding on a CGG book should keep this in mind,it certainly should affect the price of the book.

[shadroch]

I've read this thread with great interest and held off on responding because I wanted to get eveyone elses view first.

The whole point of third party grading is that a supposed unbiased person grades the book.With no bias,they make the grade and once it is graded that is what it is. Once a book is slabbed as any particular grade,that is what the book is. It is no longer a dealers 8.5 or 9.0,it is now a CGC or CGG 8.5 or 9.0.The dealer has paid for this grading,and in the case of CGC,a restoration check.

Short of the book being damaged while slabbed,this should be the end of the story. When you send a book to CGC ,you are paying for a restoration check.When you send it to another service,this is not the case.

When a buyer buys a CGC book,they buy a book that has been examined for restoration,this adds value to the book. When one buys from another service,the price is often less because it doesn't include this added service.

While this is certainly a flaw in the other parties service,the buyer knows this when he buys.As CGG doesn't charge for restoration checks,I would feel they are under no obligation to detect it.If they do,great.If they don't-the person is getting what he paid for,a graded and slabbed book.

Anyone bidding on a CGG book should keep this in mind,it certainly should affect the price of the book.

[BassGMan]

Shadroch, you are really behind the times. Copied from the CGG website:

 

"THOROUGH RESTORATION CHECK

 

A thorough restoration check is done on every book that goes through the CGGroup Certification process. "

 

And this service is included in the price. They have been doing restoration checks for a few months now.

[RS]

[Aces]

 

You replaced the sign...

Could you replace the red smiley (king) with a pic of greggy?

That would be perfect!

[RS]

I will try need pic

[shadroch]

Yes,I see that they now do a restoration check. I don't use them so I really have no reason to check their sites for upgrades.

Now the question becomes-Is there a noticable difference in their slabs that would indicate if the book was slabbed before or after this change in policy.As I already said, I haven't used them and have serious doubts I will,so this is more of a question to the people who do use them.

While I think compitition is great and wish someone would offer some to CGC,there are way too many problems with CGG at this point for me to consider using them.

[davidking623]

...if CGC had graded and slabbed a book (in Universal Blue label) that you were very confident (or even strongly suspected) had been restored, including trimming and color touch, would you send that book to CGG for a 'second opinion' ? No, you wouldn't. You'd send it to the guys who graded it the first time, to at least give them a chance to 'make things right.' Well, that's what MW1 is doing in this instance. Now, if CGG falls down on the job, MW1 can still take the book to CGC for another opinion, and then decide how best to revisit the situation with CGG...

Garthgantu,

 

After a great deal of discussion on this subject, I agree. Why play silly games with grading? Sometimes, grading mistakes are made. Inform the seller and give the company that made the mistake a chance to correct it. If they can't or are unwilling, THEN seek a second opinion. Work within the framework of the person who sold you the comic and the company that graded it. No reason to do things backwards or to circumvent this process unless one has a different objective in mind.

 

 

 

Incidentally, I sent off the comic earlier this evening for next day delivery to CGG. I will keep everyone updated on what transpires.

 

Smart Move! Smart Play! Good Luck!

 

Davidking623

[Smokinghawk]

Just got an email from CGG about my books. They sent grader's notes along, and I thought you all might like to see what they're like:

 

 

Hello Matthew,

Here is a list of your books and some of the grading notes that affected the grades the books received. This list does not necessarily include all grading notes, and certainly doesn’t explain the full grading process, but we believe it can provide you some benefit. This list will not be completely specific for each defect as to where exactly it is on the book, or the complete severity of the defect. We will use words like minor, moderate, significant, heavy, and severe on some defects to help in some instances.

 

Often many defects can’t be seen or are hard to find when the books are put in the holder, often causing, say, a 9.2 to look exactly like a 9.8, or a 6.0 to look like an 8.0, which can make it difficult when examining books. For a more complete discussion of grading notes, you are always welcome to call us. If you have any suggestions or feedback concerning this section please let us know.

 

We do not include grading notes for books that are graded 9.4 or higher.

 

Ac=abraded corner / Bc=back cover / bc/fc=back cover & front cover / be=bottom edge / Bind=bindery / bl=blunted / br=browning / brc=bottom right corner / bric=browning on interior cover / cas=cracking along spine / cb=corner bend / cc=corner crease / cchip=corner chip / cesw=cover, edge, & spine wear / corn=corner / cr=crease / cw=cover wear / DCC=distibutor color coding / ed=edge / ed bl=edge blunting / ed tr=edge tear / ew=edge wear / Fc= front cover / fc2bc=front cover to back cover / fp=finger prints / ic=interior cover / it=interior tears / mac=minor abraded corner / mbc=minor blunted corner / mbr=minor browning / mbric=minor browning on interior cover / mcb=minor corner bend / mcc=minor corner crease / mcs=multiple creases along spine / mcss=multiple creases/stress lines along spine / mcw=minor cover wear / md=moisture damage / mew=minor edge wear / min=minor / mm=minor miswrap / mmd=minor moisture damage / msw=minor spine wear / mswp=miswrap / mwd=minor water damage / mod=moderate / msw=minor spine wear / mult=multiple / ox sh=oxidation shadow / scss=several creases/stress lines along spine / se=side edge / Sev=several / sig=significant / Sl=stress lines / Sp=spine / sss=several stress lines along spine / sw=spine wear / te=top edge / tr=tear / trc=top right corner / vmbc=very minor blunted corner / vm=very minor / vmbr=very minor browning / vmcw=very minor cover wear / was=wear along spine / wd=water damage / wr=wear

 

9.6 Secret War 1-dented corner bottom of spine

9.2 Batman 608-cb fc2bc sp, several bindery stress lines spine

9.6 #7613 Batman 608-cas, sev bind sl sp

Batman double feature 9.8

Batman 612 9.4-cb fc2bc

#5766 Batman 619 9.8

#5767 Batman 619 9.6-cas vmcw bindery

5768 Batman 619 9.6-cas, vm cb fc2bc, 2 stress marks sp

5769 Batman 619 9.8

5770 Batman 608 9.8

 

Additional Notes

 

PACKAGING TIPS

We recommend putting 4 to 8 books together, then a piece of cardboard, 4 to 8 more books, surround with bubble wrap, another piece of cardboard for each side, them tape together, or you can use the 2 pieces of cardboard 1st then surround with bubble wrap. Putting books that are already inside bags & boards, or mylars in a GA or magazine bag will also help books from moving around (highly recommended). Having each half of the books facing each other so all the spines of the books are not all on one side is advised.

 

Please avoid any excessive use of tape!

 

Having each book in a polybag or mylar sleeve with a backing board provides excellent protection. Putting more than one comic book in a polybag or mylar sleeve is not recommended.

Fill any excess space in the shipping container with extra packaging material to keep any movement of your books during shipping to an absolute minimum. Bubble wrap works excellent as packaging filler. It can be a little more expensive though. Peanuts are also an excellent filler material. Also using a box that is big enough to allow for a good amount of packaging material will go a long ways towards protecting your books during shipping.

 

Correct packaging of your books for shipping is crucial in protecting your books from possible shipping damage.

 

Feedback is always welcome!

 

Any comments about your experience with us, ideas of what you would like to see us do in the future, or anything else you feel might help us improve in any area is always appreciated.

 

If you have any questions about the grading of your books, would like to go over the grading notes, or anything else, feel free to contact us through the website (comicgradinggroup.com) or call us at 541-341-1230.

 

We are no longer using the hologram stickers on the sides of the outer holder.

 

Broken corner posts or broken seals on the interior well will void certification.

 

You may notice that some of the inner holders have a small amount of play inside the outer holder. This does not affect the comic book in any way but we will be correcting this so the whole thing will feel even more solid when being held.

 

We highly recommend keeping the holder in the outer bag to avoid possible scratches to the outer holder and dust, and will protect tamper-evident sticker from accidental damage.

[RS]

Nice Grades

[burntboy]

Shadroch, you are really behind the times. Copied from the CGG website:

 

"THOROUGH RESTORATION CHECK

 

A thorough restoration check is done on every book that goes through the CGGroup Certification process. "

 

And this service is included in the price. They have been doing restoration checks for a few months now.

 

i thought i was confused - glad it wasn't me.

[BachelorOfComix]

I know it's off-center in the holder but the dimensions on this one look strange.