Copper's Heating/Selling Well on Ebay 33 33

[FlyingDonut]

20 hours ago, mcduckz said:

Significance and market value don't have a lot to do with each other in this hobby.  You are citing two very key CA books... DKR #1 was published in 1986.  You could definitely argue it is a very significant issue in regards to industry impact, BUT... it is not the book typically credited with starting the CA (that would be TMNT #1) and it is not a key first appearance of any type.  ASM #300 is a key first appearance, published 2 years after DKR #1 and demands much higher prices.

In similar fashion, look at the Bronze Age... You have Green Lantern #76 (published 1970) which is attributed as having huge industry impact (heralding an era of more adult themes and stories) AND is the book most often associated with the start of the BA.  Yet, several first appearance books of the BA sell for much, much more.  Sticking to the analogy... Marvel Spotlight #5, published 2 years after GL #76, demands many multiples of the GL #76 price in the same grade.

Significance of the story/format/industry impact each play a part in value, but the market has nearly always dictated first appearances and sometimes artists are more significant in terms of pricing.  

DC Comics Presents 26 from 1980 would like a word.

[FlyingDonut]

5 minutes ago, FlyingDonut said:

DC Comics Presents 26 from 1980 would like a word.

Or, for that matter, Wolverine 1 from 1982 and Ronin 1 from 1983 that TMNT 1 was "parodying". 

[mcduckz]

1 hour ago, FlyingDonut said:

DC Comics Presents 26 from 1980 would like a word.

 

55 minutes ago, FlyingDonut said:

Or, for that matter, Wolverine 1 from 1982 and Ronin 1 from 1983 that TMNT 1 was "parodying". 

No doubt... all these are influential books which are very under appreciated by the larger market, especially Ronin.

[whetteon]

Blip #1 - 1st Mario and Donkey Kong app. And it's a Marvel to boot. This has that cross genre feel for game collectors and comic fans.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/124668127485?hash=item1d06cca8fd:g:A6sAAOSwIaFgavw1

[jdandns]

13 hours ago, FlyingDonut said:

Or, for that matter, Wolverine 1 from 1982 and Ronin 1 from 1983 that TMNT 1 was "parodying". 

All true, and further, TMNT does not exist, not even the concept, let alone as a sellable comic book that became a cultural phenemon, without Miller's early 80's Daredevil run..

The Copper Age was well underway before turtles.They owe Miller everything.

It sure was a lot of fun being a roughly 10 to 20 years old while it was all happening!

[mcduckz]

7 hours ago, jdandns said:

All true, and further, TMNT does not exist, not even the concept, let alone as a sellable comic book that became a cultural phenemon, without Miller's early 80's Daredevil run..

The Copper Age was well underway before turtles.They owe Miller everything.

It sure was a lot of fun being a roughly 10 to 20 years old while it was all happening!

Totally agree... The Miller books really should be the beginning of CA (Ronin, DKR, Wolverine Limited, DD run)

[Jeffro.]

14 minutes ago, mcduckz said:

7 hours ago, jdandns said:

All true, and further, TMNT does not exist, not even the concept, let alone as a sellable comic book that became a cultural phenemon, without Miller's early 80's Daredevil run..

The Copper Age was well underway before turtles.They owe Miller everything.

It sure was a lot of fun being a roughly 10 to 20 years old while it was all happening!

Totally agree... The Miller books really should be the beginning of CA (Ronin, DKR, Wolverine Limited, DD run)

Miller's DD run starts in 1979 and that might be a little too early. I do get the argument though.

More and more, due to the murky evidence and many many different opinions on when the Copper age should begin, I'm in favor of a transitional period between the two. I know the idea will never achieve widespread acceptance but I like the concept.  

[HighVoltage]

56 minutes ago, Jeffro. said:

Miller's DD run starts in 1979 and that might be a little too early. I do get the argument though.

More and more, due to the murky evidence and many many different opinions on when the Copper age should begin, I'm in favor of a transitional period between the two. I know the idea will never achieve widespread acceptance but I like the concept.  

It's an interesting idea. Miller is a major force in comics, and his work was fully on display from Bronze thru Copper.

I'd probably vote for a transition period beginning in 1985 or 1986... and run that up into the early 90's - maybe when Image began?

I say 85/86 because that's when Marvel had Secret Wars going (84/85) and DC brought Crisis on Infinite Earths (85/86). So both major publishers had big changes going on.
Plus DC had Watchmen (86/87) and the Dark Knight (86), which were huge game-changers. TMNT was 1984, so it's kind of right in that mid-80s time frame.

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

1 hour ago, Jeffro. said:

Miller's DD run starts in 1979 and that might be a little too early. I do get the argument though.

More and more, due to the murky evidence and many many different opinions on when the Copper age should begin, I'm in favor of a transitional period between the two. I know the idea will never achieve widespread acceptance but I like the concept.  

I think the catalyst for the Copper Age was the DC implosion, but I wouldn't say it started until a few years later. I think, on the business side of things, creator rights and highly popular licensed properties are two big threads of the Copper Age. The DC Implosion resulted in the departure of both Archie Goodwin and Larry Hama (along with many others) from DC; they would both land at Marvel, where Goodwin oversaw the Epic Comics line (launched in 1982), and Larry Hama created the backstory for the licensed property that would be a juggernaut of the early Copper Age, G.I. Joe, also launched in 1982. So I think 1982 is a good date to start the Copper Age. As with all ages, it's not like everything shifted at once. There was some change, and the industry slowly reacted to that change. Also note the first highly popular limited series debuted in 1982.

[Jeffro.]

1 hour ago, HighVoltage said:

2 hours ago, Jeffro. said:

Miller's DD run starts in 1979 and that might be a little too early. I do get the argument though.

More and more, due to the murky evidence and many many different opinions on when the Copper age should begin, I'm in favor of a transitional period between the two. I know the idea will never achieve widespread acceptance but I like the concept.  

It's an interesting idea. Miller is a major force in comics, and his work was fully on display from Bronze thru Copper.

I'd probably vote for a transition period beginning in 1985 or 1986... and run that up into the early 90's - maybe when Image began?

I say 85/86 because that's when Marvel had Secret Wars going (84/85) and DC brought Crisis on Infinite Earths (85/86). So both major publishers had big changes going on.
Plus DC had Watchmen (86/87) and the Dark Knight (86), which were huge game-changers. TMNT was 1984, so it's kind of right in that mid-80s time frame.

I was thinking earlier than '85/'86. I can't in any way wrap my brain around the concept that copper begins that late.

[THE_BEYONDER]

2 minutes ago, Jeffro. said:

I was thinking earlier than '85/'86. I can't in any way wrap my brain around the concept that copper begins that late.

Definitely earlier.  DD 181 is not a bronze book (4/82)

 

[ADAMANTIUM]

There used to be pin 📌 threads that discussed what goes in each section, but 

https://www.cgccomics.com/resources/glossary/

If you look at cgcs glossary, they go by decades with 80's being copper, so idk

Given their tiers separate modern as 1975 till now it can be confusing

 

 

[jokiing]

22 hours ago, whetteon said:

Blip #1 - 1st Mario and Donkey Kong app. And it's a Marvel to boot. This has that cross genre feel for game collectors and comic fans.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/124668127485?hash=item1d06cca8fd:g:A6sAAOSwIaFgavw1

I sold a CGC 9.8 in Dec 2020 for $435... went quickly. Looks like it's doubled since then.

Edited May 19, 2021 by jokiing

[Lazyboy]

4 hours ago, Jeffro. said:

Miller's DD run starts in 1979 and that might be a little too early. I do get the argument though.

More and more, due to the murky evidence and many many different opinions on when the Copper age should begin, I'm in favor of a transitional period between the two. I know the idea will never achieve widespread acceptance but I like the concept.  

Miller writing DD is what actually matters, and that is right there at the start of Copper.

[Jeffro.]

10 minutes ago, Lazyboy said:

4 hours ago, Jeffro. said:

Miller's DD run starts in 1979 and that might be a little too early. I do get the argument though.

More and more, due to the murky evidence and many many different opinions on when the Copper age should begin, I'm in favor of a transitional period between the two. I know the idea will never achieve widespread acceptance but I like the concept.  

Miller writing DD is what actually matters, and that is right there at the start of Copper.

Ah good point. I forgot he didn't start writing at 158.

[Lazyboy]

3 hours ago, GeeksAreMyPeeps said:

I think the catalyst for the Copper Age was the DC implosion, but I wouldn't say it started until a few years later. I think, on the business side of things, creator rights and highly popular licensed properties are two big threads of the Copper Age. The DC Implosion resulted in the departure of both Archie Goodwin and Larry Hama (along with many others) from DC; they would both land at Marvel, where Goodwin oversaw the Epic Comics line (launched in 1982), and Larry Hama created the backstory for the licensed property that would be a juggernaut of the early Copper Age, G.I. Joe, also launched in 1982. So I think 1982 is a good date to start the Copper Age. As with all ages, it's not like everything shifted at once. There was some change, and the industry slowly reacted to that change. Also note the first highly popular limited series debuted in 1982.

The DC Implosion was only a symptom of the decline of the newsstand market. The Big Two embracing the direct market and enabling its rise was the catalyst. The different distribution channel enabled the proliferation of indies, limited series, etc.

The only thing that was special about any licensed properties in the Copper Age is the involvement of comic pros in the creation of the story for a few properties that were being adapted to other media.

[Zonker]

3 hours ago, GeeksAreMyPeeps said:

I think the catalyst for the Copper Age was the DC implosion, but I wouldn't say it started until a few years later. I think, on the business side of things, creator rights and highly popular licensed properties are two big threads of the Copper Age. The DC Implosion resulted in the departure of both Archie Goodwin and Larry Hama (along with many others) from DC; they would both land at Marvel, where Goodwin oversaw the Epic Comics line (launched in 1982), and Larry Hama created the backstory for the licensed property that would be a juggernaut of the early Copper Age, G.I. Joe, also launched in 1982. So I think 1982 is a good date to start the Copper Age. As with all ages, it's not like everything shifted at once. There was some change, and the industry slowly reacted to that change. Also note the first highly popular limited series debuted in 1982.

Actually, Goodwin left DC under his own power at the end of 1974.  The other editorial casualty of the DC Implosion in 1978 was Al Milgrom.

[Lazyboy]

6 minutes ago, Jeffro. said:

Ah good point. I forgot he didn't start writing at 158.

If he had continued only doing the art, the title might have been cancelled. Which, of course, is why he was given the opportunity to write.

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

3 hours ago, Zonker said:

Actually, Goodwin left DC under his own power at the end of 1974.  The other editorial casualty of the DC Implosion in 1978 was Al Milgrom.

I guess I mixed up my Als. SO maybe the Imposion was not quite as much of a catalyst. But that doesn't change what happened in 1982; that's still a better year for the beginning of Copper.

[whetteon]

20 hours ago, jokiing said:

I sold a CGC 9.8 in Dec 2020 for $435... went quickly. Looks like it's doubled since then.

If you have more let me know. I'm buying.