Captain America: Civil War official movie thread (5/6/16)

[thunsicker]

I saw them. Pretty interesting. Kind of like a cheap animation.

[Antpark]

I saw them. Pretty interesting. Kind of like a cheap animation.

I managed to watch the Cap vs. Black Widow extended fight scene, before they were pulled.

It was in the style of a vignette you'd see as part of the Bonus Features on a DVD release -- a combination of animatic/animation/storyboard shots.

They'll probably be included when this goes to DVD/Blu Ray.

Pretty cool to see.

[Turtle]

There are 2 things about this movie that I wasn't able to quite put my finger on. If you gents could please educate me...

 

 

1) What is Bucky's power set, exactly? It was my understanding leading into this movie that the bionic arm was capable of superhuman feats, but the rest of him was that of a superior athlete and well-trained assassin. I'm not sure we saw anything other than this in The Winter Soldier. But then, as the Bucky/Panther/Cap chase enters the tunnel, Bucky seems to be able to outpace many of the cars that are driving. He is able to elude Black Panther for quite some time despite T'Challa's obvious enhanced speed which seems to be at least on par with Cap's. As we saw, Captain America (from the Winter Soldier) is able to maintain a very high rate of speed relative to a normal human thanks to the Super Soldier Serum. Has Bucky had any biological enhancements other than the arm?

 

2) Iron Man only found out where Cap and Bucky were going pretty late in the game. It seemed as if Zemo was counting on Iron Man to show up so he could show the group the video of Bucky murdering Tony's parents in order to prompt a fight. Did Zemo have a plan if Iron Man didn't show up?

 

 

And I've given up on trying to figure out when Ant-Man retains/loses/gains mass. With movies about Super Heroes doing amazing things, this is the thing my brain gets hung up on the most. I like the character, inconsistencies and all.

[kav]

Bucky's power is that he can do whatever the plot requires him to do at the time.

[philsbackpack]

There are 2 things about this movie that I wasn't able to quite put my finger on. If you gents could please educate me...

 

 

1) What is Bucky's power set, exactly? It was my understanding leading into this movie that the bionic arm was capable of superhuman feats, but the rest of him was that of a superior athlete and well-trained assassin. I'm not sure we saw anything other than this in The Winter Soldier. But then, as the Bucky/Panther/Cap chase enters the tunnel, Bucky seems to be able to outpace many of the cars that are driving. He is able to elude Black Panther for quite some time despite T'Challa's obvious enhanced speed which seems to be at least on par with Cap's. As we saw, Captain America (from the Winter Soldier) is able to maintain a very high rate of speed relative to a normal human thanks to the Super Soldier Serum. Has Bucky had any biological enhancements other than the arm?

 

2) Iron Man only found out where Cap and Bucky were going pretty late in the game. It seemed as if Zemo was counting on Iron Man to show up so he could show the group the video of Bucky murdering Tony's parents in order to prompt a fight. Did Zemo have a plan if Iron Man didn't show up?

 

 

And I've given up on trying to figure out when Ant-Man retains/loses/gains mass. With movies about Super Heroes doing amazing things, this is the thing my brain gets hung up on the most. I like the character, inconsistencies and all.

 

I thought that Bucky / Winter Soldier's 'powers' resulted from the Russian counterpoint to the American super soldier program, chemically and biologically enhancing the subjects as the 'movie world' MCU implies.

 

However, in the comic's I can't find any evidence of that comics. 'Comic world' seems to imply highly skilled Russian trained assassin w/ a bionic arm. Also the 'arm' has more capabilities in the books.

 

"Winter Soldier's left arm is a cybernetic prosthetic with superhuman strength and enhanced reaction time. The arm can function when not in contact with Barnes and can discharge bolts of electrical energy from its palm. The arm can discharge an EMP causing electronics to either shut down or become useless. The use of Barnes' EMP is shown when Barnes uses it to shutdown a Nick Fury LMD and when he attempts to use it on Iron Man. The arm has a holographic function to disguise it as a flesh and blood arm."

[Drummy]

Regarding the second question, I think one of the film's narrative weaknesses is the convenience factor of Iron Man showing up with Cap and Winter Soldier at the end of the film. That's the part of the movie that felt the most "because plot!" for me, although it made some sense for each individual character to be there.

 

Zemo found the information he was looking for about the Winter Soldier and was going to use it against the Avengers in some fashion -- send Stark a copy of the tape, etc. -- in order to help break up the Avengers from within. The movie conveniently pushed the more dramatic ending instead -- it felt less like Zemo's strategic plan than a "lucky" convergence arranged by the directors for him.

 

In other words, Zemo's not the Mad Thinker. The fact that everyone showed up at the end was just a fortunate happenstance from his perspective.

 

Dan

[Bosco685]

Cap3 is about to make it to $400 MM Domestic.

 

 

 

It is still about $71.8 MM behind Iron Man 3 by historic USD, $92.5 MM by adjusted USD. But still climbing.

 

[Straw-Man]

don't i have $1 bets with a couple boardies about 400K?

[bababooey]

don't i have $1 bets with a couple boardies about 400K?

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9365217#Post9365217

 

 

[burntboy]

OK close to the last one at this party...

 

Saw it last night with my wife's step daughter. Last one we saw was S v B...

 

The theater (at least the stadium seating was about 60% occupied) - i was really surprised when we walked in.

 

I have to admit that the Movie ROCKED. There was so much to enjoy. Perhaps my Favorite parts were the remarkably well placed and well executed bits of Humor. I was laughing out loud throughout the flick.

 

Congrats to Marvel - this one was awesome...not sure why the numbers don't match up with AV 1 or 2, as this was better than either of those IMHO.

 

So much to love about this flick!!!!

 

 

[miraclemet]

 

And I've given up on trying to figure out when Ant-Man retains/loses/gains mass.

 

Im with you, it made sense for ant man because he shrunk but maintained his density which was why he could fight Falcon, but then wouldnt that mean he would crush an ant he rose on (since it would be a 180lb very tiny person on the ant's back?)

 

So with that logic, if he became giant, it would mean he would lose density, so he would not be able to lift a truck because the muscles he would use would lose all of their density.

 

though i may remember something about all of the characters who needed to gain mass for their powers to work accessing the negative zone or something to pull pass from there?

[Doktor]

Well, same "how does this work with physics?" questions that you get with the Hulk. I always say that it's the element of Handwavium.

[Comicopolis]

Well, same "how does this work with physics?" questions that you get with the Hulk. I always say that it's the element of Handwavium.

 

Comic book science.

[Turtle]

Well, same "how does this work with physics?" questions that you get with the Hulk. I always say that it's the element of Handwavium.

 

With Hulk, at least I can tell myself that the radiation inherent in Banner's blood ends up fueling and speeding up the cell division rate, thus increasing his mass. Flimsy science, but it's something.

 

I enjoyed the Ant Man movie and I enjoyed Ant Man's role in Civil War, but my mind has a hard time trying to explain it. A normal arrow with a 170 lb. weight at the tip just wouldn't fly. And if he's so light, how was he able to throw Black Widow around just moments before? :sumo:

 

Still enjoyed it, but man...

[Comicopolis]

Well, same "how does this work with physics?" questions that you get with the Hulk. I always say that it's the element of Handwavium.

 

With Hulk, at least I can tell myself that the radiation inherent in Banner's blood ends up fueling and speeding up the cell division rate, thus increasing his mass. Flimsy science, but it's something.

 

I enjoyed the Ant Man movie and I enjoyed Ant Man's role in Civil War, but my mind has a hard time trying to explain it. A normal arrow with a 170 lb. weight at the tip just wouldn't fly. And if he's so light, how was he able to throw Black Widow around just moments before? :sumo:

 

Still enjoyed it, but man...

 

The gamma radiation would have killed him as soon as that bomb exploded.

[Doktor]

Hence... the periodic element of Handwavium. An element with the primary property of closing the huge gaping holes in the physics behind how powers work & making them "just work"

[Unca Ben]

for what it's worth, from the Marvel Cinematic Universe Wiki:

 

Powers

Ant-Man Suit

 

Size Manipulation: Using technology developed by Hank Pym, Lang is able to reduce himself to approximately the size of an ant, though he can also grow his body to giant sizes as well. He still maintains his regular-sized strength and resilience when shrinking; while in reduced scale, this translates to granting him inhuman effort and exertion capabilities. Also, obtaining momentum and kinetic energy in small scale and exerting it immediately while returning to or right after returning to normal size can result in a feat of inhuman effort and exertion, and therefore, momentarily give Lang enhanced strength while in regular size, enough to send a man flying while attacking and enlarging himself at the same time. The process of altering size compresses force and energy, manifesting as brief shockwaves of vibration around the target that charge the target with momentum.

Enhanced Durability: When he has increased his size into a giant-sized man, he naturally becomes far more tougher and more durable than normal. This is due to his increased density and muscle mass, and it was enough to withstand missiles from War Machine. However, this enormous amount of durability comes at the cost of his speed and balance, making his movements somewhat clumsy as a result.

"When you’re small, energy’s compressed. So you have the force of a 200-lbs. A man behind a fist a hundredth of an inch wide. You’re like a bullet. You punch too hard, you kill someone. Too soft, it’s a love tap. In other words, you have to know how to punch."

―Hope van Dyne

Superhuman Strength: While wearing the Ant-Man Suit in its miniature form, Lang possesses superhuman strength due to his increased density, effort, and exertion, enabling him to take out multiple opponents of normal human size while shrunk and use the physical force and momentum attained from changing size to simulate superhuman strength directly after returning to normal size. This strength also extends to legs, allowing him to jump, spring and leap across with great force, allowing him to move through the air like a bullet to strike and impact opponents and incapacitate them instantly or move halfway across a room in a single bound. This strength is possible through force being compressed by the process of changing size, as well as his density and resilience being enhanced along with his momentum and acceleration. However, exerting too much force into impacts and physical attacks can accidentally kill an opponent, due to the force of attacks being comparable to that of a bullet. The process of altering size compresses force and energy, manifesting as brief shockwaves of vibration around the target that charge the target with enough momentum that can briefly enhance the target's strength while enlarging or immediately after enlarging. In his enlarged form, his strength rivaled even that of Thor and Hulk, enabling him to lift and crush huge vehicles with ease. This enormous mass comes at the cost of his speed and balance however and the anatomic strain exhausts him.

Insect Manipulation: Lang, through the use of radio and electric waves and signals accessed with the suit's helmet and earpieces given by Hank Pym, can affect the pheromones of insect-sized organisms and stimulate their olfactory nerve centers, allowing him a rudimentary form of control over ants.

[Turtle]

For the shrinking aspect, that explains how he can effectively fight full-sized opponents while in his miniaturized state, but it does nothing to explain how he can climb on someone's shoe, his buddy's shoulder, or Hawkeye's arrow with them feeling a negligible weight difference. Even though he's small, he still weighs as much as a full grown man. He's reducing the space between atoms...the number and size of the atoms stays the same.

 

And from that article, how does increasing his size lend itself to "increased density"? If shrinking increases his density, growing should reduce his density. Since he should be the same weight but with much more surface area, a gust of wind could potentially knock him over pretty easily.

 

It doesn't make sense!

 

Sure fun to watch though. "I thought that was a water truck!"

[Turtle]

By the way...I like "handwavium". Never heard it before.

[Unca Ben]

I figured Ant-Man was like DC's Atom with the ability to control both his size & weight.

 

Personally I don't get some of these discussions (although they may be fun - but that's about it).

Thor throws a hammer, holds on to the thong, and flies behind it?

Superman flies by altering his "personal" gravity field?

The Hulk and other super strength characters commonly lift massive objects and the objects' structural integrity doesn't give?

I get the feeling if one were able to lift an aircraft carrier, or other such thing, the frame would bend beyond the breaking point and the superstructure(s) would collapse.

 

And so on and so on...

 

I work with a suspension of disbelief when it comes to enjoying these characters and their feats.

The pseudo-science needed to "explain" their abilities is just that - fun, fluffy stuff to talk about, and harmless; unless one starts to take it too seriously.

 

my ½¢