BLACK PANTHER 2 directed by Ryan Coogler (TBD) 8 8

[@therealsilvermane]

I viewed Wakanda Forever a second time this afternoon in IMAX 3D at a multiplex with a packed theater. It was a better film for me on this second viewing. My concerns from my first viewing just weren't there this time, and I came away loving this movie. Shuri, Namor, Talocan, the absence of Chadwick Boseman, the supporting players including Riri, everything was perfect for me.

I just love the MCU Namor. I've always been a fan of the comics Namor, but this updated version just makes more sense in a "real" world. Whereas Wakanda was a land that never experienced colonization, Namor is leader of a people that escaped it. They know the dangers of the surface world, so their fear and hatred of it feels real.

It was fun being in a packed theater hearing the gasps and reactions to the film's many turning points. Sure, as that YouTuber a couple pages back said, there weren't really any big audience cheer moments, but this wasn't that kind of movie. The first Black Panther movie didn't really either. When the forces are fighting in this movie, there's a sadness and a "this doesn't have to be" feeling to it. The end of the film did elicit big audience clapping as the first credits rolled, though.

I did happen to be sitting right next to a guy who suddenly got so mad at the exact point of the movie we all learned who the new Black Panther would be. He just kept saying "stupid...stupid" or "so that's the Black Panther, huh?" the whole time and huffing and puffing. During the first credits roll, he muttered to his friend, "I hope they never make another Black Panther movie." It actually made the movie experience a little more enjoyable in an energy vampire Colin Robinson kinda way.

Wakanda forever.

Edited November 13, 2022 by @therealsilvermane

[comic_memories]

 I think Subby has some octopus skills we dont know about.     

[fmaz]

I came out of this movie really thinking that I liked it a lot, and I still (a few days later) think that there are a lot of things that I do like about it, but I think what I really felt was appreciation. What I mean is, I think the filmmakers had a nearly impossible assignment in making a Black Panther movie without the Black Panther, and they managed to do it… and they did so as well as it could have been done. They did not go overboard with the maudlin stuff, but it was emotional… I mean, the whole movie was basically about grief. But still it was about characters moving on and growing.

They introduced, very well, one character in Namor who — if used well, could be exactly what he is in the comics — a villain, a hero, an anti-hero, etc… because he has a clear agenda, but he isn’t inherently evil or good, so if his agenda aligns with a particular cause, he will certain fight with it.  Makes him useful for stories and interesting to watch.

Wasn’t as much of a fan of what they did with Riri, I’m sad to say. But I didn’t think the actress was bad. If the intent was simply to introduce her — they did that. But I wasn’t a fan of the suits (not that the current suits in the comics are much to look at if truth be told), so she’s a “wait and see”)

As for what the did with the main story arc itself I’ll say this (in spoilers):

Spoiler

I think Shuri is a very flawed Black Panther. She very much is more Kilmonger than T’Chala … and they didn’t hide that. Clearly she is trying not to be, so that will be her journey. But also maybe this will be her recognition that she isn’t meant to be the Black Panther.. and now that she knows her brother had a son… perhaps she will just hold the mantle until he is ready.  Not sure how Marvel will handle that with time jumps, because you have to figure you can’t make that kid the next BP for at least five years… so maybe that’s not the plan… but who knows. At least for now while Shuri is the BP, she has a battle she has to face to be better… which will keep her interesting.

So overall it certainly wasn’t the first movie… but it was emotional at times, a nice tribute to Chadwick Boseman, and a great introduction to Namor.   Very interested in seeing it again when it comes to Disney+ and seeing how I react to it.

 

 

[godzilla43]

This is in line what I gathered from reviews. Well made movie with good acting except actor who played Riri. Not much action so many have found it boring.
Very little of Black Panther in this movie. For me I will wait till this movie arrives in Disney+.

[Artboy99]

didn't like the movie.

Spoiler

The film is way to long in my opinion. The first scene that interested me was when nahMOUR grabbed the helicopter and pulled it back to him showing how powerful he can be. I felt a lot of time had passed before seeing that and I checked and it was over 45 minutes. This movie just dragged. I did not like the Atlantean costumes... sorry the Talocan costumes as they were very "over-the-top" garish and sometimes less is more. See the image below that shows a comparison of what would have looked better in my opinion; sort of a blend of water motifs on Roman armor.

Overall the film was dark a lot and it was hard to see things. Night time fights, underwater scenes...very dark. And one other gripe I have and it is because I do have a hearing issue: the accents of all the characters makes it difficult for me to understand what is being said.

Additionally the movie makers used subtitles because they felt it adds something to the film to have made up languages spoken, unfortunately I can't read those subtitles in my old age.

Ri-ri didn't work for me either, she does the homework of other students for money - "you didn't pay me so today it is a grand." Unlikable character.

Yes a very nice tribute to Chadwick. I still think it would be a better decision to recast T'Challa with a strong actor that can carry on the role of Black Panther.

5 out of 10

Edited November 13, 2022 by Artboy99

[Bosco685]

[paperheart]

Domestic BO is fine; can it do 2.7x opening weekend like Batman ($500M) or will it peform like DS:MOM (2.2x) = $400M?  Int'l is not great; won't be like Thor:L&T or DS: MOM which did 20-30% greater internationally.

No chance this gets to $1BB. North of $900M off this opening might be a moral victory.

[Gatsby77]

Hmm...Wakanda Forever's 3-day global start is higher than Black Adam's global total after 22 days.

[Jaydogrules]

On 11/13/2022 at 9:38 AM, paperheart said:

Domestic BO is fine; can it do 2.7x opening weekend like Batman ($500M) or will it peform like DS:MOM (2.2x) = $400M?  Int'l is not great; won't be like Thor:L&T or DS: MOM which did 20-30% greater internationally.

No chance this gets to $1BB. North of $900M off this opening might be a moral victory.

Not going to happen.  

It's Friday-sunday daily drops were similar to MoM domestically, but it made less overall opening weekend, and, much like the original black Panther, is under performing internationally, but even more so this time. 

I'm sticking with my 800mm-900mm final total that I said a month+ ago, most likely right at around 850mm.

Not a flop, but a BIG drop compared to the first one.

And I continue to be flabbergasted at the sheer stupidity of killing a fictional comic book character off just because the actor who played him ONE time in a solo movie died.   

#notchallanoticket 

-J.

Edited November 13, 2022 by Jaydogrules

[drotto]

On 11/13/2022 at 12:38 PM, paperheart said:

Domestic BO is fine; can it do 2.7x opening weekend like Batman ($500M) or will it peform like DS:MOM (2.2x) = $400M?  Int'l is not great; won't be like Thor:L&T or DS: MOM which did 20-30% greater internationally.

No chance this gets to $1BB. North of $900M off this opening might be a moral victory.

But this pattern is consistent with the first BP.  It was split was 52% domestic and 48% international, with about $135 million of that coming from China and Russia, where this movie will not be released. So removing those two countries from that total it means BP would be 58% domestic and 42% international. WF seems to be tracking very close to that split.  Black Panther is clearly a character that plays better domestic than international, as shown by its reversal of the typical MCU split.

 

Sticking with my $850 million.

[Jaydogrules]

On 11/13/2022 at 11:34 AM, drotto said:

But this pattern is consistent with the first BP.  It was split was 52% domestic and 48% international, with about $135 million of that coming from China and Russia, where this movie will not be released. So removing those two countries from that total it means BP would be 58% domestic and 42% international. WF seems to be tracking very close to that split.  Black Panther is clearly a character that plays better domestic than international, as shown by its reversal of the typical MCU split.

 

Sticking with my $850 million.

...if only Black Panther was in it.  

-J.

[snitzer]

“As expected, BLACK PANTHER: WAKANDA FOREVER (Marvel/Disney) swamped the box office worldwide.  Its $180M US weekend was below Doctor Strange 2 ($187.4M) and the original Black Panther ($202M, on a Presidents Day weekend).”
 

“Wakanda Forever is somewhat more frontloaded than its predecessor, down 33% on Saturday and a projected 30% on Sunday, compared to Black Panther‘s 13%/9%, suggesting that its US total may be more like the $411.3M of Multiverse of Madness (which had 36%/33% Day 2/3 drops) than Black Panther‘s $700.4M.”

https://showbuzzdaily.com/articles/behind-the-us-worldwide-weekend-box-office-11-13-2022.html 

[drotto]

Movie was OK.  Give it like a 6.5/10.  Felt it was well made, showed reverence for Boseman ( I was concerned it would feel exploitative, but it never quite crossed that line) , Angela Basset was very good, and the bit parts with Killmonger and M'Baku were great.  I was entertained, but it  just felt very by the numbers. 

1. The cast lacked charisma and screen presence.  I do not feel invested in them moving forward. The previous leads oozed charisma. 

2. It was very predictable film. There was not a single moment except for the credit scene, where I did not see it coming.

3. There was a lack of any stakes.  The only point that the audience applauded during my showing was the mid credit scene and the dedication to Boseman.  For me there was never a heck yeah moment. 

4. If they think fans will except Riri as a new Iron Man, they are in for a massive disappointment. 

5. The underwater scenes were murky and dull.  And please to all directors in all areas of entertainment, stop doing action sequences in the dark and then barely lighting them.  I know the final sequence was during the day, but I am sick of it.

6. The movie really dragged at times.  I never was falling asleep, but my attention was drifting often. 

7. Black Panther deserved a heroic death, not off screen from a mysterious illness.

[johnenock]

Why did the audience applaud? Was it the live version?

[@therealsilvermane]

On 11/13/2022 at 2:58 AM, fmaz said:

As for what the did with the main story arc itself I’ll say this (in spoilers):

  Reveal hidden contents

I think Shuri is a very flawed Black Panther. She very much is more Kilmonger than T’Chala … and they didn’t hide that. Clearly she is trying not to be, so that will be her journey. But also maybe this will be her recognition that she isn’t meant to be the Black Panther.. and now that she knows her brother had a son… perhaps she will just hold the mantle until he is ready.  Not sure how Marvel will handle that with time jumps, because you have to figure you can’t make that kid the next BP for at least five years… so maybe that’s not the plan… but who knows. At least for now while Shuri is the BP, she has a battle she has to face to be better… which will keep her interesting.

 

Semi-spoiler....

But you know, it's been a whole weekend, so...

I feel Shuri's hero arc actually mirrored that of T'Challa's in Captain America Civil War.

[@therealsilvermane]

On 11/14/2022 at 7:27 AM, johnenock said:

Why did the audience applaud? Was it the live version?

I guess some folks feel a barometer of a MCU movie's success is how much people applaud and holler during the thing.

[kimik]

On 11/12/2022 at 10:52 AM, ianh said:

I didn't care for BP1 and the fact it is the highest rated Marvel movie on RT from the critics is still laughable to me.

 

Agreed. It was a weak movie that dragged on too long.

I am going to go to BP 2 with my usual comic collecting friends so hopefully it is not as bad as I am worried it will be. My plan is to go in with extremely lowered expectations so it has nowhere to go but up. 

[thegiftedone45]

On 11/14/2022 at 6:40 PM, kimik said:

Agreed. It was a weak movie that dragged on too long.

I am going to go to BP 2 with my usual comic collecting friends so hopefully it is not as bad as I am worried it will be. My plan is to go in with extremely lowered expectations so it has nowhere to go but up. 

I really enjoy Black Panther the character but the movie I wasn't a fan of.  I thought Black Panther was the most likable during Captain America Civil War (he actually had character growth and it showed how wise he really was).  The BP movie was more about Wakanda than BP and it suffered as a result.  Now I don't get to see T"Challa any longer so it sucks.....

[Bird]

I am going to this with wifey tomorrow evening, see BP2 with Kevin Smith hosting. she has 2nd foot surgery thurs am, so good way to pass the time for her and keep her mind off it. George RR martin was there last week and we didn't know, I am following them now so won't miss anything that groovy again.

[gadzukes]

Went to it today.

I liked many moments including the tributes to Chadwick, but...... overall, I didn't love it.

6.5 out of 10

I'm not sure about Namor.  He was one of my faves from the comics so I think they messed with his origin too much.

My hats off to Coogler for navigating such a tricky situation.

I think I would rather have had a recasting of BP than what they did.  I like Shuri but I want my BP to be a man.