Are prices still climbing or have they eased up a bit??? 43 43

[lou_fine]

On 10/5/2022 at 4:01 AM, Stefan_W said:

My estimate was based on about 70% of current GPA, so it had a lower expectation already built in. Most went for about 1/3 "value" or so, but of course with prices tumbling value is tough to estimate. I probably would have done better on this group of books in one of the CL auctions prior to the pandemic. Aside from one book that climbed to lofty heights over a hundred bucks I did not even make back grading costs let alone value for the books themselves. 

 

On 10/5/2022 at 8:07 AM, Stefan_W said:

On 10/5/2022 at 7:51 AM, alexgross.com said:

what era? any pics?

It was (unsurprisingly) moderns. 

At this current stage, the only ones making any real money in this current marketplace would be the pressing and grading companies if you consider a hundred bucks to be lofty heights.  

Especially if you are talking about what are otherwise virtualy worthless Modern books since they've somehow been able to conditioned submittors to keep throwing their money away at another spin of the grading roulette wheel. 

[DC#]

On 10/5/2022 at 4:01 AM, Stefan_W said:

My estimate was based on about 70% of current GPA, so it had a lower expectation already built in. Most went for about 1/3 "value" or so, but of course with prices tumbling value is tough to estimate. I probably would have done better on this group of books in one of the CL auctions prior to the pandemic. Aside from one book that climbed to lofty heights over a hundred bucks I did not even make back grading costs let alone value for the books themselves. 

No one seems to be putting cash into run fills and moderns now. There is still a bidding war for Silver and Golden age keys, especially the scarce ones you do not see all of the time. 

I put the cash from this group into a signed CGC 9.9 Vampirella that I liked. It has pretty bad Newton Rings which means I have to send it in for a re-holder, but that also kept the price down so I think I will be ok. If I was asked before the auction whether I would trade those six books for the Vamirella I would have said yes so I guess it worked out ok for me in the end. I am a bit more concerned about the higher value books I have lined up in the next two auctions. 

I think this may be an example of what Stefan_W was experiencing (though this is not Modern).    I was just scrolling and comparing Session 3 closing prices vs GPA last night - just on random books.   These are things I wouldn't have even put in my Clink recaps.      ASM #198 in 9.8 WP - pretty interesting cover but not really a key by any definition.     The most recent GPA sale was Sept for $313 with 90-day at $293.   Clink was $183 - so nearly 40% below the 90 day.    And I saw a LOT of results like this.    There was even an ASM 194 9.8 that went for $3.2k vs last of $4000 and 90-Day of $4100.    At the same time, I also noticed results - ironically of 9.6 or 9.4 Copper/Bronze -  that were within 10% of GPA.   For example, that same ASM #198 in 9.4 sold for $76 vs GPA of $71.   

 

 

[PKJ]

Not sure if any of you ever scroll back through CL auctions but I was looking for a price paid on a couple books to update my records and while some are shocking in regards to what the price was in a say 2013, this book stood out as one that pretty much just holds the price on CL in 4.0 or 5.0. 

 

 

 

[Stefan_W]

Here is an example of the blood bath that I took. This book was ranging in the 130-160 range, and when I sent it in there was one lower sale of $100. I figured it would land at about 80-100. After I already sent it in there was a lower sale at $61 but that seemed like a one-off thing. Someone local offered me $100 for it two days after I shipped it out. 

Well, here is what happened..... 

[Microchip]

On 10/6/2022 at 7:59 AM, PKJ said:

Not sure if any of you ever scroll back through CL auctions but I was looking for a price paid on a couple books to update my records and while some are shocking in regards to what the price was in a say 2013, this book stood out as one that pretty much just holds the price on CL in 4.0 or 5.0. 

 

 

 

This book really sunk away from collectors lists over the last few years, but it's definitely on the way back up now.   The next two years will be interesting.

[Kramerica]

I'm really seeing a shift to value - to larger runs or even 12 issue runs. I'm surprised by some of the titles too.....Arak, Amethyst, MTIO, Marvel Triple Action, Marvel Team-Up, Infinity, Inc. These aren't NM books either. Just 6.0 to 9.0 copies and people are paying decent money. But put a pretty decent VF BA book up by itself and crickets......

[Microchip]

On 10/6/2022 at 2:49 AM, MAR1979 said:

As I understand many Silver and Bronze keys not in 9.4 (more applicable to silver) or 9.6 or 9.8 are going for noticeably less than last year.  WWBN 32 anyone.... Lots of room for the non-prime condition keys to settle back to probably the level they should be at had there been no pandemic. Of course like all markets no one statement fits all, but for the broader market in general it will ring true, this is what happens when a bubble bursts.

Please note my post does not refer to Golden/Atom or pre-1964 Silver. I am not involved enough in those markets to have a proper understanding.

“markets can remain irrational a lot longer than you and I can remain solvent.” - Keynes; However eventually it will become rational and we are now at the start of  that phase.

It'll be interesting to see which books hold value after their initial TV/movie connected hype.

2nd series Loki.   All the JIM books for Loki look solid, still no action on the early TVA appearances.   Kang is here to stay as a major key.  And more Thor characters coming in the next James Gun GoTG film to solidify things.  

GoTG should do more for Thor and his pantheon of characters, than the last Thor movie did 

2nd series Moon knight.   WWBN 32 has always been in demand, but it will be interesting to see where this book settles into.   I do see it sitting above the what-if the pandemic had never happened scenario.   

[MAR1979]

On 10/5/2022 at 6:47 PM, Microchip said:

2nd series Moon knight.   WWBN 32 has always been in demand, but it will be interesting to see where this book settles into.   I do see it sitting above the what-if the pandemic had never happened scenario.   

My post excluded 9.4 and higher but what about 8.0 and below? Especially lower than 7.0?

[mtracy64]

On 10/5/2022 at 12:09 PM, theCapraAegagrus said:

Bouncing off of your sentiment: About 5 years ago, I told all of my friends/family that I am no longer participating in gift exchanges. Birthdays, X-Mas, etc. Why spend $50 on something that I think someone might want, and vice-versa, when both parties can simply buy exactly what they want and end the charade?

I only feel like gifts are truly gifts when they're random, unplanned. Otherwise, I feel compelled to reciprocate, and I truly despise it. I enjoy the gift exchange here because there is so much content that I cannot track, people have genuinely given me new areas to collect. Most of my collection - of collected editions - in fact started because of the gifts I've received from other CGC members. (The gift recipient being the random aspect of the exchange makes it fun.)

I did the same thing about 25 years ago, suggesting that we only buy for my nephew who was an infant at the time. He's married with two little girls now, and watching the youngsters open and play with their gifts is great fun. My nephew was an odd duck in our family - we noticed by the time he was maybe eight years old that he didn't read anything he wasn't forced to read for school, and the rest of us were reading anything we could get our hands on by that age. He loved Star Wars movies and games, so I started buying him TPBs of the Dark Horse Star Wars comics. He loved them and kept them in good shape (bagged and boarded), and before long he started reading novels as well. It's nice to see someone enjoy a gift, but it's amazing to open a youngster's eyes to a whole new world like that - he just needed a little nudge.

[Microchip]

On 10/6/2022 at 10:25 AM, MAR1979 said:

My post excluded 9.4 and higher but what about 8.0 and below? Especially lower than 7.0?

Agreed, most big books from 8.5 upwards are going to be fairly safe.   Below those grades, it will be a very different discussion.  

With the super keys, we're seeing a widening gap from 9.8 to 9.6.   9.8's are almost in a completely separate market for IH181, FF48, ASM129, etc.  

9.2 to 9.6 for Keys have established price points, and too many people are looking out for softening prices, for those to fall in meaningful amounts.

8.5 to 9.0 has a lot of support with the lower price point being attractive.

[toro]

I had a 9.4 newsstand of Tales of the Teen Titans #44 end at $80, most on ebay sell for $125 to $150+, but that was offset by the X-Factor #6 in 9.2 that sold for $102.  My copy of Wolverine #1 9.8 (regular series direct) sold for $401, the other 9.8 sold for $277.  

[Nick Furious]

On 10/5/2022 at 5:43 AM, 1Cool said:

I love when people give real world examples of how the market for a bunch of books are crashing people still question if a large portion of the market is crashing.  Nobody is saying prices of all the ivory tower Golden Age books are crashing or saying the uber high grade books that never come up are crashing but it is pretty evident that prices are crashing on a vast majority of books in the current market.  The crashed prices may not be back to 2019 levels but when you consider that was 3 years ago and a ton of people were buying over that time period it really shouldn't be a consideration any more then saying prices have not gotten back to 1995 levels.  I think most people on the boards knew the COVID stimulus explosion in prices was not sustainable but avoiding calling it a crash or severe correction on a ton of books is just not right.  We all called it an explosion in prices in 2020 - 2021 so lets just call it what it is.

We typically compare year-to-year prices without taking inflation into account.  Truth is, prices could be about 25% higher than 2019 and actually be at 2019 prices...relative to the cost of groceries or other things you might buy with that money.  

[lou_fine]

On 10/5/2022 at 2:30 PM, Stefan_W said:

Here is an example of the blood bath that I took. This book was ranging in the 130-160 range, and when I sent it in there was one lower sale of $100. I figured it would land at about 80-100. After I already sent it in there was a lower sale at $61 but that seemed like a one-off thing. Someone local offered me $100 for it two days after I shipped it out. 

Well, here is what happened..... 

I guess it's really a case of to each their own, but isn't this the kind of book which other than the slab, is considered to be pretty much worthless drek?    

Especially when you see HG unread copies of books like this sitting in the dollar boxes at the local con's with dealers hoping against hope that somebody will stop and buy one from them.  No doubt CGC is ecstatic and their owners laughing all the way to the bank with submittors clogging up their submission pipeline with books like these even though they have to wait a full year or more to get them back.    

What's that old saying about "putting lipstick on a pig", but glad to see that there's a market for books like these, and as long as the buyers and sellers are happy with them, then it's all good from my point of view.  

[darkstar]

On 10/6/2022 at 12:20 AM, lou_fine said:

I guess it's really a case of to each their own, but isn't this the kind of book which other than the slab, is considered to be pretty much worthless drek?    

Especially when you see HG unread copies of books like this sitting in the dollar boxes at the local con's with dealers hoping against hope that somebody will stop and buy one from them.  No doubt CGC is ecstatic and their owners laughing all the way to the bank with submittors clogging up their submission pipeline with books like these even though they have to wait a full year or more to get them back.    

What's that old saying about "putting lipstick on a pig", but glad to see that there's a market for books like these, and as long as the buyers and sellers are happy with them, then it's all good from my point of view.  

That What If Iron Man book is only sought after by readers who buy it because it has part of the What If Venom Possessed Deadpool story arc in it. The What If Venom Possessed Deadpool issue sells for hundreds of dollars, so buying that What If Iron Man book, and the other three What If issues that have part of the story in them, is a far cheaper alternative. The four What If issues are effectively dollar books, even though the set can sell for 75 or so.

Still there is plenty of money to be made selling modern graded drek though, like moving 500 mystery boxes at 200 dollars a piece.

 

[Ryan.]

On 10/6/2022 at 1:20 AM, lou_fine said:

I guess it's really a case of to each their own, but isn't this the kind of book which other than the slab, is considered to be pretty much worthless drek?    

Especially when you see HG unread copies of books like this sitting in the dollar boxes at the local con's with dealers hoping against hope that somebody will stop and buy one from them.  No doubt CGC is ecstatic and their owners laughing all the way to the bank with submittors clogging up their submission pipeline with books like these even though they have to wait a full year or more to get them back.    

What's that old saying about "putting lipstick on a pig", but glad to see that there's a market for books like these, and as long as the buyers and sellers are happy with them, then it's all good from my point of view.  

It's a good example of how what I consider to be The Comics Market and what someone else considers to be The Comics Market aren't necessarily the same thing. 

The hyper inflated modern 9.8 market was out of control the last two years and was likely due for a correction, regardless of external economic factors. 

Same with the movie spec books where dollar bin books become worth hundreds literally overnight. 

For the particular books I collect I've not noticed any material deflation in prices.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 10/6/2022 at 7:28 AM, Ryan. said:

 

Same with the movie spec books where dollar bin books become worth hundreds literally overnight. 

 

Good times 

[WolverineX]

Books I've sold recently have definitely dropped, moderns most affected.   Older rare books I want have maintained some value but are not increasing like last year.   I have noticed that I am also not as inclined to buy as much stuff recently.  Will probably put a hold now that the holidays are around the corner.

This pain has only started.  Housing market has barely taken a turn.  Give it time. 

Recession will come for all. 

[Stefan_W]

On 10/6/2022 at 1:20 AM, lou_fine said:

I guess it's really a case of to each their own, but isn't this the kind of book which other than the slab, is considered to be pretty much worthless drek?    

Especially when you see HG unread copies of books like this sitting in the dollar boxes at the local con's with dealers hoping against hope that somebody will stop and buy one from them.  No doubt CGC is ecstatic and their owners laughing all the way to the bank with submittors clogging up their submission pipeline with books like these even though they have to wait a full year or more to get them back.    

What's that old saying about "putting lipstick on a pig", but glad to see that there's a market for books like these, and as long as the buyers and sellers are happy with them, then it's all good from my point of view.  

Honestly couldn't care less about your opinion of the book - I was just sharing as an example of how much below market value modern books were going. As I said in the post, I had someone local offer me $100 for it a couple of days after it was sent in so it has value at least to some people. People's tastes, and what they choose to spend money on, are personal and exist regardless of what someone who feels they have more elite tastes thinks of them. 

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

On 10/5/2022 at 5:30 PM, Stefan_W said:

Here is an example of the blood bath that I took. This book was ranging in the 130-160 range, and when I sent it in there was one lower sale of $100. I figured it would land at about 80-100. After I already sent it in there was a lower sale at $61 but that seemed like a one-off thing. Someone local offered me $100 for it two days after I shipped it out. 

Well, here is what happened..... 

I'm hopeful that you, at least , got your money back (purchase price of comic book, shipping to CGC, grading by and shipping from CGC, shipping to CL - did I miss any other cost) but, unfortunately, I'm likely out of hope.

If I am, that stinks.

[Stefan_W]

On 10/6/2022 at 9:42 AM, Tec-Tac-Toe said:

I'm hopeful that you, at least , got your money back (purchase price of comic book, shipping to CGC, grading by and shipping from CGC, shipping to CL - did I miss any other cost) but, unfortunately, I'm likely out of hope.

If I am, that stinks.

I had 6 moderns close out this week and only one of them recovered my grading costs. A couple more would have but I sent that one through a different presser (it was before I started pressing my own books) and the extra costs associated with that pushed the line higher.

Full disclosure though that being in Canada the costs of shipping to and from CGC are much higher, and there are also costs shipping to a US-based auction house. My cost per book after all fees in a full CGC submission of 25 moderns is usually about $45 CAD, so 33 USD. Auction house fees at CL at 10%, and shipping to CL is about $40 for a six book lot. I don't send smaller in books in for auction unless I figure they will go for $100 or more.