szav Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 On 11/10/2021 at 8:23 AM, woowoo said: I can tell you that 120 came out before 121 You make a strong argument here. FoggyNelson, woowoo, Randall Dowling and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimjum12 Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 (edited) On 11/10/2021 at 10:23 AM, woowoo said: I can tell you that 120 came out before 121 There's no need to complicate things GOD BLESS.... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) .... Alpha Flight first appeared in X-MEN 109 and The Inhumans first appeared in FF 36 .... hopefully this will not result in any tearfall.... Edited November 10, 2021 by jimjum12 Randall Dowling 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woowoo Posted November 10, 2021 Author Share Posted November 10, 2021 On 11/10/2021 at 8:21 AM, jimjum12 said: There's no need to complicate things GOD BLESS.... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
APDallas Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 If this is true then AMAZING SPIDERMAN #299 is the first appearance of Venom. MR SigS, jimjum12 and Randall Dowling 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pantodude Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 Can't we all just agree that I am really, really good-looking? jimjum12 and rexinnih 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rexinnih Posted November 10, 2021 Share Posted November 10, 2021 A little green in the photo but yes, good-looking. Pantodude and jimjum12 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGsimba77 Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 So to try and make this more silvery I'll bring up FF48, 49... Im not sure there's been as much spirited disagreement over Galactus as there clearly have with Wolverine/Venom even though I think Galactus is just on one last panel in 48. I think there's a clear consensus FF 48 is first Galactus. Would that be because FF48 story clearly is building up to the cameo and mentions "Galactus" unlike Hulk 180 with a brief Weapon X mention? I always wondered about that . Regardless of the mentions, the Galactus debut app = Wolverine's debut app with a similar amount of commentary from both. So let's just say for arguments sake Surfer wasn't involved until 50... Would FF48 still be considered Galactus first app? Still be way more valuable than FF49 without Surfer in the equation? The Venom thing is cgc not wanting to weigh in on whether the Web of spider-mans before 299 were a prelude....or whether 298 with the symbiote arm panel is a Venom cameo or not. That one is legit confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExNihilo Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 Isn't this all just a case of comic definitions diverging from the literal definitions used in dictionaries? By the very definition of the word, Wolverine makes an "appearance" in 180 and it is his "1st", so by Webster's, it would be his "1st appearance". However, the comic book hobby for years now has created and used its own definition of what constitutes a "1st appearance" and a "cameo". By comic definitions, a "cameo" is a one panel or short appearance of a character. (As opposed to the Webster definition posted back on page 1 or 2 of this thread.) Until the powers-that-be in the hobby can be convinced to adjust the comic definitions to be more in line with the English dictionary, then it's clear that 180 is a cameo and 181 is a 1st appearance. Does it make sense? No, not really, but it sure seems to be what is hanging people up in one camp vs the other. What irks me is the inconsistency with which this standard is used as there seem to be times where single panel appearances are given the 1st appearance designation (ie with the aforementioned Galactus appearance). And for what it's worth, I own 180/181 so I don't have a preference for any camp. So long as no one makes a case for 179 somehow, I don't care what the hobby decides. IngelsFan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hulksdaddy1 Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 Incredible Hulk #182 is Wolverine's 1st appearance. Come at me, bro! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGsimba77 Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 (edited) Funny how CGC notates Thor 163 as Him 2nd cameo even though its pretty much just a casket in one panel. They at least show the cocoon inside the casket in the next issue with the "3rd cameo" note. So how bout chewing on that one to figure out what "cameo" really means I bet that was fun for cgc to figure out 20 years ago That being said, the view of diverging definitions of comics vs literal for "appearance" sounds right. Hasn't that been the case pretty much forever? 180 "cameo" can be distinguished from 181 imo. Edited November 12, 2021 by MGsimba77 Wrong issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUECHIPCOLLECTIBLES Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 Possible trend in the future. Sell your big "FIRST APPEARANCE" and buy a nice house, while chuckling to yourself that you still have the actual first appearance. grendelbo and szav 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazyboy Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 On 11/10/2021 at 10:42 AM, APDallas said: If this is true then AMAZING SPIDERMAN #299 is the first appearance of Venom. Then who the hell is on the last page of ASM 298? And that's even ignoring the mysterious character who barely, but still actually, appeared multiple times before that and just happened to attack Peter Parker while not triggering Spidey's special danger sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoggyNelson Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 Both 180 an 181 are great books to have, both big keys👍😷‼️🏆 jimjum12, grendelbo, Randall Dowling and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazyboy Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 On 11/13/2021 at 1:17 PM, BLUECHIPCOLLECTIBLES said: Possible trend in the future. Sell your big "FIRST APPEARANCE" and buy a nice house, while chuckling to yourself that you still have the actual first appearance. Oh, the are way ahead of you on that. They've been pushing that for quite some time. Luckily, most people aren't dumb enough to fall for it. S2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLUECHIPCOLLECTIBLES Posted November 13, 2021 Share Posted November 13, 2021 On 11/13/2021 at 1:46 PM, Lazyboy said: Oh, the are way ahead of you on that. They've been pushing that for quite some time. Luckily, most people aren't dumb enough to fall for it. Of all the reactions I might've expected from that, I wouldn't have put anger in the mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woowoo Posted November 14, 2021 Author Share Posted November 14, 2021 On 11/13/2021 at 1:42 PM, Lazyboy said: Then who the hell is on the last page of ASM 298? And that's even ignoring the mysterious character who barely, but still actually, appeared multiple times before that and just happened to attack Peter Parker while not triggering Spidey's special danger sense. Let's see a picture Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waaaghboss Posted November 14, 2021 Share Posted November 14, 2021 On 11/10/2021 at 8:42 AM, APDallas said: If this is true then AMAZING SPIDERMAN #299 is the first appearance of Venom. You misspelled web of spidey 18. Lazyboy and jimjum12 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGsimba77 Posted November 14, 2021 Share Posted November 14, 2021 (edited) On 11/13/2021 at 2:17 PM, BLUECHIPCOLLECTIBLES said: Possible trend in the future. Sell your big "FIRST APPEARANCE" and buy a nice house, while chuckling to yourself that you still have the actual first appearance. The thing with advertisements is they've never been thought of as legit appearances. I think this is another standard set forth by the comic community since the beginning that "appearances" must be in the context of a story. If important enough, like those would be, most they get is a notation on the cgc label. Anyhow, I like how back in the stone age it was always "The" Batman, never just Batman Btw, another one could be tossed around all day is Mary Jane...obscured face and all. I'm sure there's a number of others. Edited November 14, 2021 by MGsimba77 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FoggyNelson Posted November 14, 2021 Share Posted November 14, 2021 180, 181 I’ll take either or 👍😷‼️ Randall Dowling and 1950's war comics 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
profholt82 Posted November 15, 2021 Share Posted November 15, 2021 I suppose if you get technical, a first appearance is a first appearance, regardless if it's a one panel cameo or not. Meaning, the first time he ever appears is in 180. But that's why I have no problem with distinguishing the first cameo appearance from the first full appearance. Sometimes though, the powers that be can get rather liberal with their interpretation of the term "cameo." Looking at you X annual 14. But I think in that case it's because they literally effed it up, and didn't realize the annual came out before 266 until much later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
