NJ Art Con August 28th 3 3

[fsumavila]

On 8/29/2022 at 1:45 PM, BCarter27 said:

As others have mentioned, the show was busy most of the day. Location was still a win with easy access to the city. See here for a few pics-

https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/share/fM5CfDtUH249QDGM01AQVLQMhGhDLm5ci9rY4wqKhun

Dealer's name is in the the image title if you want to reach out for prices. Apologies, I didn't catch the names of the two collectors opposite Dom. Those are marked "unknown". Anybody know?

Great seeing everybody!

Thanks for the pix! Some really nice pieces just in these photos...That Secret Origins page with Doctor Fate is fantastic...

[fsumavila]

On 8/28/2022 at 5:05 PM, thethedew said:

Not in my experience.  B always firm with me but I've got a target on my back.  So.

Same. I've purchased a number of (really nice) pages from Bechara the past few years, and I've never been able to get him to bend a bit.

[Buzzetta]

On 8/29/2022 at 4:24 PM, fsumavila said:

Same. I've purchased a number of (really nice) pages from Bechara the past few years, and I've never been able to get him to bend a bit.

I've only been able to get him to bend once on a piece and I think that was from like $825 down to a flat $800.  

[MAR1979]

On 8/29/2022 at 4:34 PM, Buzzetta said:

I've only been able to get him to bend once on a piece and I think that was from like $825 down to a flat $800.  

 

Edited August 29, 2022 by MAR1979

[KirbyCollector]

I think the new reality is, there is so much super wealth buying art right now that dealers don't have to deal with (or tolerate) the little guy anymore... so they aren't inclined to bend on a lot of the lower priced (sub $5K) inventory like they used to... Mitch, Glen, Mike, etc feel free to correct me, but that's how I see it

[GreatEscape]

On 8/29/2022 at 4:18 PM, fsumavila said:

Thanks for the pix! Some really nice pieces just in these photos...That Secret Origins page with Doctor Fate is fantastic...

Yes, great photos, thanks for sharing. Perhaps dealer prices are high because the cost of acquiring new material from Heritage (or other auctions) are high.  I saw dozens of 2022 auction pieces on dealer walls, mostly priced 40-70% over prices sold.   The flow of consignments and/or private sales of quality pieces are significantly lower these days.  

[Buzzetta]

On 8/29/2022 at 5:39 PM, KirbyCollector said:

I think the new reality is, there is so much super wealth buying art right now that dealers don't have to deal with (or tolerate) the little guy anymore... so they aren't inclined to bend on a lot of the lower priced (sub $5K) inventory like they used to... Mitch, Glen, Mike, etc feel free to correct me, but that's how I see it

Here is the thing though.

When you have an inventory of nothing more than $10,000 pages, you have a far narrower market.  The higher up you go, the narrower the market.  Now you have to question. 

How many of the ballers are buying $10,000+ pages?

How many $10,000+ pages are the ballers going to buy? 

Eventually there are going to be quite a few people sitting on quite a lot. 

[KirbyCollector]

On 8/29/2022 at 5:56 PM, Buzzetta said:

Here is the thing though.

When you have an inventory of nothing more than $10,000 pages, you have a far narrower market.  The higher up you go, the narrower the market.  Now you have to question. 

How many of the ballers are buying $10,000+ pages?

How many $10,000+ pages are the ballers going to buy? 

Eventually there are going to be quite a few people sitting on quite a lot. 

There must be a lot of ballers right now... heard the show might have been the high water mark for the year so far for several of the dealers... says a lot that a threadbare show in a tires hotel off Route 3 in Jersey brought out the heavy hitters vs glamourous SDCC

[Unstoppablejayd]

On 8/29/2022 at 6:21 PM, KirbyCollector said:

There must be a lot of ballers right now... heard the show might have been the high water mark for the year so far for several of the dealers... says a lot that a threadbare show in a tires hotel off Route 3 in Jersey brought out the heavy hitters vs glamourous SDCC

I heard a few mega deals where made 

[artdealer]

On 8/29/2022 at 5:39 PM, KirbyCollector said:

I think the new reality is, there is so much super wealth buying art right now that dealers don't have to deal with (or tolerate) the little guy anymore... so they aren't inclined to bend on a lot of the lower priced (sub $5K) inventory like they used to... Mitch, Glen, Mike, etc feel free to correct me, but that's how I see it

I beg to differ.

I sell a lot of lower priced art under $1000 to the “little guys”.

I find that term offensive. I treat everyone the same. I get asked all the time by BSD’s why I don’t offer them the big ticket art. I tell them get in line with all my other buyers. You’re no more special than any one else, so stop trying to impress me with your collection/wallet. 
Not something these “BSD’s want to hear.

So, because I don’t kiss the ground they walk on, those “BSD’s” won’t buy from me.

I will admit to sending previews of art to just a couple buyers before the art hits my site. But just a couple. 

Edited August 29, 2022 by artdealer

[KirbyCollector]

On 8/29/2022 at 7:10 PM, artdealer said:

I beg to differ.

I sell a lot of lower priced art under $1000 to the “little guys”.

I find that term offensive. I treat everyone the same. I get asked all the time by BSD’s why I don’t offer them the big ticket art. I tell them get in line with all my other buyers. You’re no more special than any one else, so stop trying to impress me with your collection/wallet. 
Not something these “BSD’s want to hear.

I will admit to sending previews of art to just a couple buyers before the art hits my site. But just a couple. 

I don't use the term as a pejorative, it just fits guys like me... you know, a collector who loves odd cheaper pages and whose net worth is not that of a crypto gazillionaire 

[delekkerste]

On 8/29/2022 at 8:16 AM, KirbyCollector said:

Mystery question... who were the three foreign individuals (attractive 30ish brunette female with 2 men in Euro style clothes) buying art? I overheard Bechara telling someone they were  "the Italians" who bought over $100K in art from him at SDCC and were buying more yesterday... she was in charge and they seemed to be very active with all the dealers.

Found them

[Bronty]

On 8/29/2022 at 5:39 PM, KirbyCollector said:

I think the new reality is, there is so much super wealth buying art right now that dealers don't have to deal with (or tolerate) the little guy anymore... so they aren't inclined to bend on a lot of the lower priced (sub $5K) inventory like they used to... Mitch, Glen, Mike, etc feel free to correct me, but that's how I see it

That doesn’t ring true to me tbh.   My take is that dealers face high replacement costs.   A smart dealer doesn’t price off of actual cost; ie what he paid, but replacement cost as otherwise the model isn’t sustainable in the long run.    If they are stuck paying full FMV to replace pieces with similar quality, what’s that model look like?    Pay FMV, add a premium and hope for the best?   In which case they really can’t bend on prices much if at all.    Gone are the days of replacing on the cheap from artists/connections selling below FMV. 

[Rick2you2]

On 8/30/2022 at 2:05 AM, Bronty said:

That doesn’t ring true to me tbh.   My take is that dealers face high replacement costs.   A smart dealer doesn’t price off of actual cost; ie what he paid, but replacement cost as otherwise the model isn’t sustainable in the long run.    If they are stuck paying full FMV to replace pieces with similar quality, what’s that model look like?    Pay FMV, add a premium and hope for the best?   In which case they really can’t bend on prices much if at all.    Gone are the days of replacing on the cheap from artists/connections selling below FMV. 

Hmmm… two anecdotes, not related but addressing two different points.

Just before COVID, I was at one show talking to Tom Mandrake. Anthony walks over to see if Tom had anything to sell. Tom said yes, and Anthony went through his stuff like a Hoover asking him if he would sell a bunch of things. Tom objected to selling the better pieces at what was probably apparently a previously agreed deal rate for the run of the mill, and gave him a large discount. Afterward, he turned to me and explained that Anthony was a dealer who buys a lot, so he got a big discount due to bulk.

Another time, I looked at a piece Bechara was trying to sell. I asked him how much, and he quoted me a very high price. I told him I thought the last time he had it for sale, he priced it at $2,000 less. He responded that he never raises prices on things he had bought. In other words, he doesn’t sell based on replacement cost (which may explain his unwillingness to bend). The piece was later bought by another dealer, and last time I looked is still for sale. I suspect this is more common than you would expect.

[kbmcvay]

On 8/30/2022 at 6:29 AM, Rick2you2 said:

 

Another time, I looked at a piece Bechara was trying to sell. I asked him how much, and he quoted me a very high price. I told him I thought the last time he had it for sale, he priced it at $2,000 less. He responded that he never raises prices on things he had bought. 

I think Mr. Mustache is blatantly lying here. He raises prices on things on his website all the time and unless every single one of those things was gifted to him they were bought. By him.

[Buzzetta]

On 8/30/2022 at 6:29 AM, Rick2you2 said:

The piece was later bought by another dealer, and last time I looked is still for sale. I suspect this is more common than you would expect.

@jaybuck43 and I have noticed this frequently that while certain dealers cite data on previously sold pieces, those pieces never left the room but are sitting across from them at another dealer's table. 

I can think of a few bundles of art that this has occurred with since I've been paying more attention and looking for it. 

[pemart1966]

On 8/30/2022 at 8:08 AM, kbmcvay said:

I think Mr. Mustache is blatantly lying here. He raises prices on things on his website all the time and unless every single one of those things was gifted to him they were bought. By him.

True this.

[Bronty]

On 8/30/2022 at 8:08 AM, kbmcvay said:

I think Mr. Mustache is blatantly lying here. He raises prices on things on his website all the time and unless every single one of those things was gifted to him they were bought. By him.

100%.    He was embarrassed and covered. 

[gumbydarnit]

Thanks so much for the video and great photos, nice of y'all to take the time to do that!

[jaybuck43]

On 8/30/2022 at 8:08 AM, kbmcvay said:

I think Mr. Mustache is blatantly lying here. He raises prices on things on his website all the time and unless every single one of those things was gifted to him they were bought. By him.

I know for a fact he is lying.  He has had this piece for almost a decade at this point.

(It looks much nicer in person, this is a copy from the fanzene it was published in).  I passed on it at $1,500, I passed on it at $2,500, and I passed on it this weekend at $6,500