Beware…Fake high value CGC books in Pacific Northwest 14 14

[onlyweaknesskryptonite]

On 2/26/2023 at 10:02 PM, ExNihilo said:

If I remember, CGC Mike stated somewhere that CGC was looking to add QR codes that would direct to the census page.  Not foolproof for this particular situation, but a step in the right direction.

Until you get this code on one of the slabs.

[southern cross]

On 2/26/2023 at 8:19 PM, onlyweaknesskryptonite said:

Until you get this code on one of the slabs.

If grading notes are free, link the code to that and the census. Not fool proof but hard to manufacture and adds another layer of protection.

Like currency that's been forged since after currency was invented. Governments around the world continue to add security features to their currency. And will continue to do so in the future.

[davidpg]

A simple high adhesion sticker would also likely go a long way to helping this.  Similar to what's used on cigarettes and alcohol, that would gave to be cut through first to crack the slab.  Actually, like what used to be stuck onto CD and DVD cases to show whether it was tampered with.

[Mr. Zipper]

On 2/27/2023 at 9:43 AM, davidpg said:

A simple high adhesion sticker would also likely go a long way to helping this.  Similar to what's used on cigarettes and alcohol, that would gave to be cut through first to crack the slab.  Actually, like what used to be stuck onto CD and DVD cases to show whether it was tampered with.

I thought of this as well, however, the problem is routine handling and rubbing could easily tear a frangible tamper evident  sticker on the outside of the slab. They would have to figure out some way to put the sticker on the inside of the slab to show that had been cracked or the label and/or inner well have been removed.

[davidpg]

On 2/27/2023 at 10:02 AM, Mr. Zipper said:

I thought of this as well, however, the problem is routine handling and rubbing could easily tear a frangible tamper evident  sticker on the outside of the slab. They would have to figure out some way to put the sticker on the inside of the slab to show that had been cracked or the label and/or inner well have been removed.

I don't thing that would be necessary overall.  The goad would be an added line of defense,  Looking at the sticker, and it being compromised or worn would simply give a potential buyer another reason to dig deeper into the actual book being purchased.

That said, maybe dealers can start making their own tamperproof stickers and put them on books they sell, as a seal of quality.  If the dealer is big enough it could make them stand out from the crowd.  Could also prove provenance.

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 2/27/2023 at 10:33 AM, davidpg said:

I don't thing that would be necessary overall.  The goad would be an added line of defense,  Looking at the sticker, and it being compromised or worn would simply give a potential buyer another reason to dig deeper into the actual book being purchased.

That said, maybe dealers can start making their own tamperproof stickers and put them on books they sell, as a seal of quality.  If the dealer is big enough it could make them stand out from the crowd.  Could also prove provenance.

No one wants dealer stickers on their slabs.  If the dealer is big enough to have a sticker in the 1st place, then I would think you could trust that dealer to buy slabs from. 

[davidpg]

On 2/27/2023 at 10:54 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

No one wants dealer stickers on their slabs.  If the dealer is big enough to have a sticker in the 1st place, then I would think you could trust that dealer to buy slabs from. 

Understandable, though the sticker should/woud be along the edge of the case, bridging the two halves of the case together.  Would not be visible from the front or the back.

[MarvelsKryptonite]

I'm thinking more in terms of something like the QR code. They can individualize those things so well that they cannot be replicated, and the scan of the authentic one is the only one that would provide the authenticity confirmation. There's an app for that!

[Northwest]

On 2/27/2023 at 11:10 AM, MarvelsKryptonite said:

I'm thinking more in terms of something like the QR code. They can individualize those things so well that they cannot be replicated, and the scan of the authentic one is the only one that would provide the authenticity confirmation. There's an app for that!

https://www.cgccomics.com/news/article/10362/qr-code-comics/

[wurstisart]

On 2/27/2023 at 4:07 AM, BlowUpTheMoon said:

It looks like the slab did the job it was designed to do.

The slab got broken open, reassembled, and looked like it had gotten broken open and reassembled. 

Great, but if the case was never sealed then no cracking ist open is needed and we are back to square one.

[Steven Valdez]

On 2/21/2023 at 5:44 AM, Qalyar said:

Agreed. I'd like to have seen better photos of exactly what went on. The label is, upon close examination, fake. But that doesn't answer how the case was compromised (it's far less likely that they custom-built fake cases de novo).

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/UV-Resistant-Premium-Quality-Clear-Acrylic_1600554752930.html?spm=a2700.7724857.0.0.66f446aaEEGqIn&s=p

 

[Steven Valdez]

On 2/24/2023 at 6:16 AM, MarvelsKryptonite said:

There is something odd and amiss with this whole story, and it's about as obvious as the small discrepancies with label.

What I'd like to know is what the guy paid (got ripped off) for a Hulk #1. If it's anywhere under $12-15k, then how could that not be a red flag in itself?

Among the Facebook threads there was some insinuation toward what was paid. Anybody with 40 years of comic industry experience is going to know what a book like that is worth. In fact, had it been anything under that amount, the question then comes up of who was ripping off who, especially in lieu of the latter points to be described in this comment.

I'd like to know some numbers in these stories. But even if he got it for $1, this is extremely damaging to the industry as a whole. I find it hard to believe that one single lone "scammer" is at the root of this.

All aside, here's the real kicker that may throw the whole thing through a loop: back about 7-8 months ago there was a Hibid auction up in that Spokane corridor that had nearly every single one of those books this guy has pictured in a single lot (along with various miscellaneous things like furniture and even a fur coat). When I happened upon it, I can't say my eyes didn't get big and wide with what-ifs and dreams of the jackpot. But I learned at a very young age if it's too good to be true it is.

The photographs for the auction we're not clear enough to read the labels, in any request for more information is ignored in that type of auction. So I rationally assumed most of those were just facsimile graded books - mainly the Hulk(s), GSXM 1, Spidey, etc. There was a box of raw comics that they carelessly photographed enough to show what may have been considered a somewhat lucrative raw collection. Enough that I bid $150 mainly for the few ASM's that caught my eye. In the end, I'm sure overzealous hopes were what won that auction. If I recall, I think it closed at about $400 to $500.

Nobody's going to be that lucky or stupid enough to believe they should be so fortunate to win an auction for that many key comic books at $4 to $500. And that's even to say if the focus of their purchase wasnt directed at some of the other ticket items in the lot, which I think included some kind of signed letter from Audrey Hepburn and an ivory walking cane.

Point being that The whole thing borderlined absurdity, as does this guys story. You can't crack a slab without there being some evidence, period. That's what they're designed foremost with the intention of providing.

So then, if there is any validity to these poor saps claimed misfortunes, they may be in pursuit of this lone "scammer" (unlikely) to the avail of finding he was the winner of that auction. However, maybe he was the seller?

Either way, when I offered up this information, the guy promptly went so far as to name me as the scammer. Well hell, I need that bs like I need a kick in the groin. I don't particularly need a kick in the groin, and when I do, my wife has a long standing tab on that tally😆.

I get the feeling it was a crazy low price, which caused the buyer to jump in quickly without doing due diligence.

[Steven Valdez]

On 2/24/2023 at 2:39 PM, VintageComics said:

I wasn't pulling numbers out of thin air. 

You'd need to engineer and machine moulds for the outer case halves and the inner well halves. That's at least 4 moulds. 

But maybe more to be convincing since comics are all different shapes and sizes.

You'd need to come up with a supplier / manufacturer. 

You'd need to come up with a plastic compound. The plastic has to look and feel right. It has to be the right hardness and clarity. Not cheap. 

You'd need to inject / create all the separate plastic pieces. There would be trial and error. 

And the machines that do the sealing? Let's just say they're not cheap (yes I know how much they cost).

I'm vague because I'm choosing to be. I don't want to put too much info out there. 

Maybe you can make something similar but cheaper out of wood? 

 

I reiterate:

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/UV-Resistant-Premium-Quality-Clear-Acrylic_1600554752930.html?spm=a2700.7724857.0.0.66f446aaEEGqIn&s=p

 

 

[wardevil0]

On 2/28/2023 at 7:10 AM, Steven Valdez said:

I reiterate:

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/UV-Resistant-Premium-Quality-Clear-Acrylic_1600554752930.html?spm=a2700.7724857.0.0.66f446aaEEGqIn&s=p

 

 

I'd love for you to buy that and show us what you get. Some of the pictures show a clear box that goes around a CGC slab, the X-Men #1 is just a CGC slab, and one picture even has the UltraPro logo on the item but is definitely not the same as any other item pictured.

[Steven Valdez]

On 2/28/2023 at 11:59 PM, wardevil0 said:

I'd love for you to buy that and show us what you get. Some of the pictures show a clear box that goes around a CGC slab, the X-Men #1 is just a CGC slab, and one picture even has the UltraPro logo on the item but is definitely not the same as any other item pictured.

They do appear to offer quite a range... who knows what would actually turn up if ordered:

https://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&tab=all&SearchText=comic+book+case&selectedTab=product_en

 

[buttock]

On 2/26/2023 at 8:07 PM, BlowUpTheMoon said:

It looks like the slab did the job it was designed to do.

The slab got broken open, reassembled, and looked like it had gotten broken open and reassembled. 

The solution is to slab the slab with a seal on both, laser etched numbers, and holographic QR codes on everything.  And put one of those blue dye packets in that explodes when you open it. 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 2/28/2023 at 9:52 AM, buttock said:

The solution is to slab the slab with a seal on both, laser etched numbers, and holographic QR codes on everything.  And put one of those blue dye packets in that explodes when you open it. 

Slab the slab for sure 

Then carbonite the whole thing 

 

[buttock]

On 2/28/2023 at 7:59 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

Slab the slab for sure 

Then carbonite the whole thing 

 

All with reduced cost and faster TATs.  

 

[Tec-Tac-Toe]

And include a "free" lollipop with each shipment of the new and improved slabs.

[El Toro Rojo]

On 2/28/2023 at 5:40 AM, Steven Valdez said:

They do appear to offer quite a range... who knows what would actually turn up if ordered:

https://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&tab=all&SearchText=comic+book+case&selectedTab=product_en

 

This appears to be a case that surrounds your existing CGC case for display purposes: