Bry is going to destroy his AF15 for a blue label 2 2

[Transplant]

I don't know what the big deal is, all over a few bindery chips. 

[trademarkcomics]

On 5/30/2023 at 7:57 AM, Artboy99 said:

Agreed. I watched @thehumantorch crack out a CGC purple label Fantastic Four 45 at a comic show we were set up at because the potential buyer didn't want a slabbed copy. The graders notes stated “small amount of colour touch”. Once cracked we inspected it and the color touch was all over the place. The entire spine was heavily touched as were several spots in the central mass and the top and bottom edges. This is an area where CGC needs to improve the descriptions.

Beyond any shadow of doubt. I've seen some that state  "small amount of color touch" then get a moderate C-2 resto tag. Wouldn't that indicate a moderate amount of color touch?

Edited May 30, 2023 by trademarkcomics

[trademarkcomics]

This industry is all about how beautiful something looks...unless that beauty has been restored in some way, then they'd rather have it ugly? 

If a comic has been touched up, it's still as close to its original condition as it will ever be. If you cut that all off, you're not accomplishing anything other than making it even further from its original condition than it ever was, in my opinion.

[EastEnd1]

Based on what was shown, I'd be surprised if CCS went forward with the restoration removal.  

[thehumantorch]

On 5/30/2023 at 8:57 AM, Artboy99 said:

Agreed. I watched @thehumantorch crack out a CGC purple label Fantastic Four 45 at a comic show we were set up at because the potential buyer didn't want a slabbed copy. The graders notes stated “small amount of colour touch”. Once cracked we inspected it and the color touch was all over the place. The entire spine was heavily touched as were several spots in the central mass and the top and bottom edges. This is an area where CGC needs to improve the descriptions.

Agreed.  There was tons of color touch and the label indicated 'small amount of color touch'.  

[B2D327]

On 5/30/2023 at 11:42 AM, trademarkcomics said:

Beyond any shadow of doubt. I've seen some that state  "small amount of color touch" then get a moderate C-2 resto tag. Wouldn't that indicate a moderate amount of color touch?

C-2 is the quality of restoration in regard to how it was done, not the amount

[october]

People have no idea how many clowns entered the hobby over the past five years just looking to make money in any way possible. 

Hacking up restored books? Check. 

Badly pressing comics? Check. 

Cleaning using chemicals that CGC may not catch? Check. 

Peroxide baths to lighten covers and interior pages that CGC may not catch? Check. 

I honestly trust raw comics bought on eBay from random sellers over slabbed from dealers/auctions houses at this point. Much higher chance they are not yet molested. 

[Phill the Governor]

On 5/30/2023 at 10:57 AM, Artboy99 said:

Agreed. I watched @thehumantorch crack out a CGC purple label Fantastic Four 45 at a comic show we were set up at because the potential buyer didn't want a slabbed copy. The graders notes stated “small amount of colour touch”. Once cracked we inspected it and the color touch was all over the place. The entire spine was heavily touched as were several spots in the central mass and the top and bottom edges. This is an area where CGC needs to improve the descriptions.

As someone who works on books this is the number one issue that I encounter.

[COI]

Restoration in all of its forms was stigmatized in the past for good reason - in 99% of cases, it was done to deceive buyers. Logically, you would think that the existence of grading companies would reduce this stigma by putting the restoration on the label, which informs potential buyers and solves the deception problem. Instead, the stigma remained, which is reflected in the market prices of purple label books. The stigma around deception became a stigma around the purple label.

I don't know this guy, but the reason he's even taking this chance is because the market incentivizes it. You know, the same market that greatly rewards the clean and press game, a practice that also used to be stigmatized until it became highly profitable to look the other way. So while I don't like what he's doing, it's his property, and mid-grade AF 15s, while valuable, are not one of a kind artifacts that transcend notions of basic property rights. So to single him out as everything that is "wrong with the hobby" - when he's just operating in a space where profit or at least the preservation of value is the main game - is kind of silly.

[manetteska]

On 5/30/2023 at 12:46 PM, october said:

People have no idea how many clowns entered the hobby over the past five years just looking to make money in any way possible. 

Hacking up restored books? Check. 

Badly pressing comics? Check. 

Cleaning using chemicals that CGC may not catch? Check. 

Peroxide baths to lighten covers and interior pages that CGC may not catch? Check. 

I honestly trust raw comics bought on eBay from random sellers over slabbed from dealers/auctions houses at this point. Much higher chance they are not yet molested. 

These two are the ones I am most surprised with -- both in terms of how much they can change a comic's appearance and that CGC apparently cannot catch them.

This one may also fall under one or more the above, but to add:

• Completely disassembling a comic for pressing, lightening, or both that CGC may not catch.

[chrisco37]

On 5/30/2023 at 11:40 AM, Transplant said:

I don't know what the big deal is, all over a few bindery chips. 

[rlextherobot]

On 5/30/2023 at 10:59 AM, manetteska said:

These two are the ones I am most surprised with -- both in terms of how much they can change a comic's appearance and that CGC apparently cannot catch them.

This one may also fall under one or more the above, but to add:

• Completely disassembling a comic for pressing, lightening, or both that CGC may not catch.

Can we throw "cutting up a comic into individual pages for sale" into this pile? IMO the absolute grossest practice, as it's literally selling a complete book for parts. Just the most avaricious way to approach the hobby. 

[Ed Hanes]

I dont understand his math...he was offered 45 to 50 k but wants to repurpose it and get a 3 to 4 , which from recent sales , suggests he would lose a lot of money ...am I missing something here? 

Edited May 30, 2023 by Ed Hanes

[manetteska]

On 5/30/2023 at 1:13 PM, Ed Hanes said:

I dont understand his math...he was offered 45 to 50 k but wants to repurpose it and get a 3 to 4 , which from recent sales , suggests he would lose a lot of money ...am I missing something here? 

Dude's got a bustlin' YouTube channel where he slings knowledge and comics -- sometimes a little of both! Don't question him.

 

[toro]

On 5/30/2023 at 1:46 PM, october said:

People have no idea how many clowns entered the hobby over the past five years just looking to make money in any way possible. 

Hacking up restored books? Check. 

Badly pressing comics? Check. 

Cleaning using chemicals that CGC may not catch? Check. 

Peroxide baths to lighten covers and interior pages that CGC may not catch? Check. 

I honestly trust raw comics bought on eBay from random sellers over slabbed from dealers/auctions houses at this point. Much higher chance they are not yet molested. 

And sometimes they give the book a regular bath.
 

 

[Ed Hanes]

On 5/30/2023 at 11:22 AM, manetteska said:

Dude's got a bustlin' YouTube channel where he slings knowledge and comics -- sometimes a little of both! Don't question him.

 

are you being sarcastic? I wouldnt exactly use the word 'bustling' for his youtube channel (compared to other high volume youtubers)..not even close

Edited May 30, 2023 by Ed Hanes

[manetteska]

On 5/30/2023 at 1:29 PM, Ed Hanes said:

are you being sarcastic? I wouldnt exactly use the word 'bustling' for his youtube channel (compared to other high volume youtubers)..not even close

I am being sarcastic overall, but 16k subscribers for a comics channel isn't bad; roughly 1/3-1/4 of CT101.

But back to the comic: He also has to pay the presser/CT-remover, shipping, walkthrough grading, and maybe some other stuff. Not to mention those quoted HA prices INCLUDE BP and commission, so... I don't know what he's trying to do here if he legitimately received a $45k offer as-is.

[Ed Hanes]

Yeah, I have my doubts about the offers he got,  Also. The only other thing that I can think that he may be doing… Is that he got only a lowball offer from someone who wanted to basically turn it back into a RAW, and asked if he could disassemble it for them…. And then he just made up this charade to have an interesting YouTube show…. And he has no intention of sending it to CGC.

Edited May 30, 2023 by Ed Hanes

[trademarkcomics]

On 5/30/2023 at 10:33 AM, B2D327 said:

C-2 is the quality of restoration in regard to how it was done, not the amount

The letter "C" is the quality, the number "2" is how extensive(or amount). Even the chart you uploaded states this. 

[joeypost]

Why is this even being debated?