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ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC
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Started by spidermanbeyond,

9,030 posts in this topic

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Red Hook

Red Hook

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On 1/12/2024 at 2:48 PM, MasterChief said:

Welcome back, Brad.

Good to see you around these parts! :applause:

I wandered around in the wasteland for many years and find myself here. Thanks for the welcome! :-) 

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comicjel

comicjel

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I might be a dreamer but...

Since the reholder process seems to have been the obvious weak link for scammers, and since CGC has the history of all reholdered books, CGC really has the ability to root out "likely" most of the "graded comic scammers" through close examination of past reholdering patterns (and their internal scans).

We will likely never get the details, but unlike other types of scams, this one is pretty easy to go back and check now that they know what to look for, so it seems like CGC will be able to purge the scammers from using their services through a pretty easy check of past grading and reholdering records, and if they are so inclined, could eventually have a pretty accurate list of likely tainted books. 

 

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ADAMANTIUM

ADAMANTIUM

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anyway @agamoto

It was just my 1st impression of these videos, same as it was weeks ago when 1st posted. I wasn't trying to argue, stated that it was imo, and that hasn't changed. No need for convincing for either of us.

Possibly CGC wouldn't have a case, but I would still think they've thought of how to respond to them. I'm glad you are confident enough to pay no never mind :) 

Just something I wouldn't feel cause nor justified to do. 

I had missed your post on true "intent" and myself thought of 1st amendments and intent, I still think given the seriousness that it is not something that helps. Just my Opinion :) not worth a hill of beans, as stated :cheers: 

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drotto

drotto

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On 1/12/2024 at 11:31 AM, Dr. Balls said:

They could be taking a page from software developers' approach to this: letting the public do the footwork, while they collate information everyone else has gathered, formulating their next step internally. Software companies have been releasing buggy software for two decades, letting end-users troubleshoot the problems for them, where the make all the bug fixes and push an update. We may not see a response from them until they've made the next significant step behind the scenes.

The other old adage in programing is that end users will find ways to break the program or exploit the program that the programmers never imagined. 

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grendel013

grendel013

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On 1/12/2024 at 5:07 PM, drotto said:

The other old adage in programing is that end users will find ways to break the program or exploit the program that the programmers never imagined. 

That's why I recommend testers DO NOT just follow the script when in UAT. I'd rather users break it while still in development then in production. But nobody listens...:banana:

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wiparker824

wiparker824

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On 1/11/2024 at 3:37 PM, brute_nm said:

Here is why I keep harping on this point.  I went through the Hot 350 list and found a ton of "holes" - individual cert numbers missing from a single submission batch.  For example, say cert numbers xxx001, xxx003, xxx004 are on the list but xxx002 is not.  I used the census to fill the holes and this is what I came up with: 215 more books

The highlighted column shows the number of books I added (N meaning not on the initial Hot 350 list).

Some highlights

  • 1 more ASM 129
  • 25 more ASM 194's
  • 11 more ASM 252's
  • 39 more ASM 300's
  • 3 more Hulk 181's
  • 4 more Hulk 340's
  • 8 more X-Men 266's, including 1 with MJ

We need some clarity on why some books are NOT on the list.  Take ASM 300 for example: why were 86 9.8's on the list but 14 weren't?  What is different about the 14?  How do we know these 14 are "safe" and guaranteed not fraudulent?  There were 3 FF 48's on the list and 3 not on the list; is CGC 100% certain those 3 are OK?  How can you tell?

@CGC Mike, please ask to release the criteria used to generate the list of 350 and/or release his entire submission history. Better to be safe and recheck everything this guy touched.

certs expanded.png

Has this had a response? It does seem like this would go a long way into the clarity of the situation. I also don’t think this necessarily has to replace the current list. This list could be added and noted separately as not suspicious for XYZ but it would certainly help at a minimum for those of us to understand the thought process in omitting these books. 

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brute_nm

brute_nm

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On 1/12/2024 at 3:54 PM, wiparker824 said:

Has this had a response? It does seem like this would go a long way into the clarity of the situation. I also don’t think this necessarily has to replace the current list. This list could be added and noted separately as not suspicious for XYZ but it would certainly help at a minimum for those of us to understand the thought process in omitting these books. 

Radio silence. Maybe @CGC Mike put me on ignore xD

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CGC Mike

CGC Mike

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FAQs

What happens when I submit a book for Holder Review?

If your book is determined to be correctly graded, it will be reholdered with a new certification number and returned to you at no charge. If your book is determined to be incorrectly graded, CGC will retain your book as evidence, and you will be compensated for the current fair market value of the book in accordance with the CGC Guarantee.

How did CGC create the list of impacted books?

Due to the ongoing investigation, at this time we cannot share how we determined which books were impacted.

What changes are being made because of this incident?

CGC is always evaluating ways to make our processes better and our holders more secure. Every reholder submission is now being reviewed by a Senior Grader, and we have made other significant improvements to our processes as a result of this incident. We will continue to take appropriate steps to help ensure that this type of incident does not happen again.

We will make an announcement if we have any new information to share about updates to our processes or holders. However, please understand that some updates will not be made public because they are proprietary and relate to security.

Will the list of impacted certification numbers be retained?

We will retain the list of impacted certification numbers on this page of our website. As impacted books are returned, the certification number will be struck through, indicating it is no longer valid and the book has been given a new certification number. Certification numbers that are no longer valid will not be searchable in the Verify CGC Certification database, consistent with our normal reholder process and to ensure that there is no duplication in the CGC Census population report.

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brute_nm

brute_nm

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On 1/12/2024 at 7:09 PM, Nick Furious said:

Sorry to nitpick, but I assume that is fair market value based on the label in the slab, not the actual book in the slab.

Imagine if someone bought a Hulk 181 9.0 at the height of the boom and get reimbursed for a 8.0 green label at today's prices.

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