Shipped Wrong Artwork - Trying To Get It Back From Karl Dignam at The Grid Games in Manchester, CT 2 2

[Dr. Balls]

On 7/20/2024 at 6:30 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

Then you'd probably end up facing criminal charges.

Unless the law has changed recently--and I don't think it has--then the person who received the artwork is now the legal owner of it and has no legal obligation to return it.

He's under no legal obligation to return it, but I am not under legal obligation to keep my mouth shut about it, either. It's not libelous to state what happened, and name the parties involved. Is it worth generating a bunch of internet drama over a hundred bucks or two? Probably not, but I am going to give a week or two for adequate response time.

[Dr. Balls]

And thanks for everyone's thoughts, it's appreciated!

[grendel013]

How did the mix up happen? Were they both packed and the labels got swapped? Or did you just pack the wrong sheet?

[davidking623]

On 7/20/2024 at 5:03 PM, JollyComics said:

At ONE time, I received all books that I won the auction but one book I didn't win or bid.  It was Avengers #1 CGC 2.0.  That was in 2012. The value was $600-635.

The auction company made a big mistake for sending me the wrong book. Evenly, they were unaware that I got the wrong book.   It was tempted to keep it but I didn't feel right so I contacted them.  They were highly appreciated and were happy to cover the shipping cost for me.  Once, they received the book back and gave me $100 credit for their future auction and I saved for Brave and the Bold #54 CGC 8.5. I won that book and they paid the shipping. It saved me about $125 included the shipping & insurance.

I hope the buyer will make it right by sending it back to you.  Think about offering a reward.  I don't know what I can say but I pray for the rightness.

Back in 2003 comicconnect sent me a check for 1250.00 addressed out in my name and everything . I had never sold anything on there before so I never cashed it although it would have worked but I am not that guy so 2 weeks later I get a letter blah blah they sent the check to the wrong person and could they get the check back if I still had it or any of the monies if there was anything left I think they sent me a self addressed envelope which I sent back to them and I think I received a 50.00 dollar credit also .

[Michael Browning]

On 7/20/2024 at 8:30 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

Then you'd probably end up facing criminal charges.

Unless the law has changed recently--and I don't think it has--then the person who received the artwork is now the legal owner of it and has no legal obligation to return it.

My mother worked for the USPS for many years, and part of her career dealing with high-value packages on a daily basis. This exact situation arose from time to time, and without exception, the person who made the errant shipment had no recourse. Some mistakes are costly.

What "criminal charges" would he face for saying "I mistakenly shipped the wrong page to Joe Smith and I'm trying to make it right, but they won't respond and have kept the page"? It's not like he's engaging in character assassination, so I'd love for you to educate me on the law in this matter.

[JC25427N]

On 7/20/2024 at 11:31 PM, Michael Browning said:

What "criminal charges" would he face for saying "I mistakenly shipped the wrong page to Joe Smith and I'm trying to make it right, but they won't respond and have kept the page"? It's not like he's engaging in character assassination, so I'd love for you to educate me on the law in this matter.

Calm down, I think you missed the part where he quoted a post where someone else said they would go to the comic store owner and "light him up". I think he was replying to that (with respect to his first line about facing criminal charges at least), not Dr.Ball's original post

 

Edited July 21 by JC25427N

[JollyComics]

On 7/20/2024 at 9:34 PM, davidking623 said:

Back in 2003 comicconnect sent me a check for 1250.00 addressed out in my name and everything . I had never sold anything on there before so I never cashed it although it would have worked but I am not that guy so 2 weeks later I get a letter blah blah they sent the check to the wrong person and could they get the check back if I still had it or any of the monies if there was anything left I think they sent me a self addressed envelope which I sent back to them and I think I received a 50.00 dollar credit also .

That was a lot of money in 2003.

If you cashed it, you would be arrested for the fraud easily.  You did the right thing and your honest earned the credit.  I wished more people like us. Those people kept and cashed the checks or received money via wire from banks by mistakes. Those people were arrested and prosecuted.  Where are your brains?

The rightness is uppermost important as always.

[Dr. Balls]

On 7/20/2024 at 7:31 PM, grendel013 said:

How did the mix up happen? Were they both packed and the labels got swapped? Or did you just pack the wrong sheet?

I had recently removed a lot of my personal collection from frames and put it into portfolios with the artworks that I was also selling - and I was in a rush (I always am when it comes to EBay shipping) and I must have been preoccupied and not paying attention when I grabbed a page (Drew Hayes Poison Elves page) and packed it without paying attention to *which* Drew Hayes page it was - my personal one, or the one I was selling.

Totally dumb oversight on my part. I only made the mistake because I had two pages from the same artist, one I was selling and one I was keeping. I’m not really even mad at this guy for not saying anything - I’m more disappointed. It was my mistake that could have been avoided if I were paying more attention and slowed down. I don’t feel that I want to be that guy who retaliates for the consequences of his own mistake.

Edited July 21 by Dr. Balls

[Rick2you2]

On 7/20/2024 at 8:30 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

Then you'd probably end up facing criminal charges.

Unless the law has changed recently--and I don't think it has--then the person who received the artwork is now the legal owner of it and has no legal obligation to return it.

My mother worked for the USPS for many years, and part of her career dealing with high-value packages on a daily basis. This exact situation arose from time to time, and without exception, the person who made the errant shipment had no recourse. Some mistakes are costly.

No, he would not be the legal owner. I deal with the legal end of contracts all the time. Unilateral and mutual mistake can avoid a transaction. The recipient has every legal responsibility to return it but has the right to be placed back in his original financial position (you pay postage and any other costs or charges he incurs).

Whether there is effective legal recourse is a different question. You would probably have to sue in the county where the recipient is located, and seek a “replevin” or return of goods. Those suits are not cheap, or easy. I’ve done a few, including one on an 80 ton marine crane which a lessor refused to return.

If you know the recipient’s number, try a phone call and find out what the problem is. If he doesn’t answer, try calling every few days at different times until he does. Also, use different phones. Based on the response, then figure out the next step.

[Michael Browning]

On 7/21/2024 at 8:37 AM, Rick2you2 said:

No, he would not be the legal owner. I deal with the legal end of contracts all the time. Unilateral and mutual mistake can avoid a transaction. The recipient has every legal responsibility to return it but has the right to be placed back in his original financial position (you pay postage and any other costs or charges he incurs).

Whether there is effective legal recourse is a different question. You would probably have to sue in the county where the recipient is located, and seek a “replevin” or return of goods. Those suits are not cheap, or easy. I’ve done a few, including one on an 80 ton marine crane which a lessor refused to return.

If you know the recipient’s number, try a phone call and find out what the problem is. If he doesn’t answer, try calling every few days at different times until he does. Also, use different phones. Based on the response, then figure out the next step.

Great advice!

I would also add that he should reach out to eBay customer service and make them aware and try to enlist their help. It worked for me one time when I sent the wrong graphic novel and was able to successfully get everything back to their rightful owners without any problems.

[delekkerste]

On 7/20/2024 at 10:34 PM, davidking623 said:

Back in 2003 comicconnect sent me a check for 1250.00 addressed out in my name and everything . I had never sold anything on there before so I never cashed it although it would have worked but I am not that guy so 2 weeks later I get a letter blah blah they sent the check to the wrong person and could they get the check back if I still had it or any of the monies if there was anything left I think they sent me a self addressed envelope which I sent back to them and I think I received a 50.00 dollar credit also .

Back around 2003, I ordered some low-value stuff on eBay and received a small box full of slabbed 1950s sports cards by mistake. 

Of course I reached out to the seller, who had been freaking out about where the cards had gone and had no clue. I returned them, and he asked me what my favorite sports teams were. He sent me an autographed John Elway Super Bowl program for my trouble.  

[KirbyCollector]

I still don't see what the issue is with having someone take the time to have an in-person chat. It's as simple as walking in and saying, My friend X send you the wrong art, it's a piece which has some meaning for him and he would be happy to pay the postage to get it back. Most people would respond well to this.

[mister_not_so_nice]

On 7/21/2024 at 5:13 AM, Dr. Balls said:

I had recently removed a lot of my personal collection from frames and put it into portfolios with the artworks that I was also selling - and I was in a rush (I always am when it comes to EBay shipping) and I must have been preoccupied and not paying attention when I grabbed a page (Drew Hayes Poison Elves page) and packed it without paying attention to *which* Drew Hayes page it was - my personal one, or the one I was selling.

Totally dumb oversight on my part. I only made the mistake because I had two pages from the same artist, one I was selling and one I was keeping. I’m not really even mad at this guy for not saying anything - I’m more disappointed. It was my mistake that could have been avoided if I were paying more attention and slowed down. I don’t feel that I want to be that guy who retaliates for the consequences of his own mistake.

It's a simple matter of integrity.  The buyer got the wrong piece. You know it, he knows it, where is the grey area? 

I really don't see two sides to this. He should return the page(on your dime) and get the page he paid for. Very simple.  

The page should be in the mail already back to you. I wouldn't give him another 24 hours. If you do I'm predicting a "I didn't realize it was the wrong page, and I already sold it" response. 

[Rick2you2]

On 7/21/2024 at 3:47 PM, mister_not_so_nice said:

It's a simple matter of integrity.  The buyer got the wrong piece. You know it, he knows it, where is the grey area? 

I really don't see two sides to this. He should return the page(on your dime) and get the page he paid for. Very simple.  

The page should be in the mail already back to you. I wouldn't give him another 24 hours. If you do I'm predicting a "I didn't realize it was the wrong page, and I already sold it" response. 

In that case, the good Dr. has a right to demand the return of the piece from the third party buyer. Legally, the seller did not have title, so he could not transfer title to a 3rd person. The unfortunate 3rd party buyer then has to seek reimbursement from the seller. That’s where buyers of Nazi seized artwork have been getting in trouble even decades later (except in Europe where some countries have passed special laws limiting the recovery rights of Nazi loot).

Let me add that some people file criminal complaints in their local court systems. That can also work.

Edited July 21 by Rick2you2

[pemart1966]

On 7/20/2024 at 9:27 PM, Dr. Balls said:

He's under no legal obligation to return it, but I am not under legal obligation to keep my mouth shut about it, either. It's not libelous to state what happened, and name the parties involved. Is it worth generating a bunch of internet drama over a hundred bucks or two? Probably not, but I am going to give a week or two for adequate response time.

He may be under no legal obligation to return it but one would hope that he's under a moral obligation.

Depending upon how far away he is, either visit his store or call him on the phone.

If that doesn't work then you'll probably just have to live with it and at the same time decide whether you want to out him.

Not a good advertisement for him or his business if he doesn't make good though.  

[batman_fan]

I won a piece of artwork on Heritage.  They sent me the wrong piece (worth a fraction of what I won).  I contacted them and had to mail the piece back before they would send me mine.

[Rick2you2]

On 7/20/2024 at 9:27 PM, Dr. Balls said:

He's under no legal obligation to return it, but I am not under legal obligation to keep my mouth shut about it, either. It's not libelous to state what happened, and name the parties involved. Is it worth generating a bunch of internet drama over a hundred bucks or two? Probably not, but I am going to give a week or two for adequate response time.

Actually, he is under a legal obligation to return it. The tort, at common law, was called “wrongful detainer”. That’s is where an item is lawfully acquired, but not returned. You sent it to him by accident, so the acquisition was legal. The detainer was not.

[Rick2you2]

On 7/22/2024 at 8:20 AM, pemart1966 said:

He may be under no legal obligation to return it but one would hope that he's under a moral obligation.

Depending upon how far away he is, either visit his store or call him on the phone.

If that doesn't work then you'll probably just have to live with it and at the same time decide whether you want to out him.

Not a good advertisement for him or his business if he doesn't make good though.  

He is under a legal obligation to return it. Enforceability is a different issue. Like an uncollectible judgment.

[Ryan.]

On 7/22/2024 at 8:55 AM, batman_fan said:

I won a piece of artwork on Heritage.  They sent me the wrong piece (worth a fraction of what I won).  I contacted them and had to mail the piece back before they would send me mine.

A couple years back I purchased a page from Anthony's Comic Art and they accidentally sent me two pages, as they were both stored together in the same sleeve. I contacted them and offered to send it back or throw a price at me to just keep the accidentally sent second page. They offered a fair price, I paid it, and kept both pages.

[Dr. Balls]

On 7/21/2024 at 1:47 PM, mister_not_so_nice said:

It's a simple matter of integrity.  The buyer got the wrong piece. You know it, he knows it, where is the grey area? 

I really don't see two sides to this. He should return the page(on your dime) and get the page he paid for. Very simple.  

The page should be in the mail already back to you. I wouldn't give him another 24 hours. If you do I'm predicting a "I didn't realize it was the wrong page, and I already sold it" response. 

Yeah, it kinda truly is. I feel pity for someone's who's integrity is bought for $245. We're all human, and it's in our nature to do wrong or stupid things when no one is looking - but when they are looking, you kind of figure that you're coerced into doing the right thing. As a business owner myself, I find that I have to step aside from any personal perceptions or ideas that will affect me, and focus on how those decisions will affect my business, or in this case, how my business looks. I would never steal or short a customer simply because I thought I'd never see them again.

He has been making Facebook and Instagram posts over the past 5 days, so I know he's online and has likely read my requests. I've also sent him one under Instagram, to see if. Ican get him there. My guess is that he's just going to ignore them and keep the artwork. 

Edited July 22 by Dr. Balls