Obadiah Oldbuck vs. Superman

[showcase4]

since Beerbaum is doing 99% of the research in this area, I wonder how Showcase 4 will react when Bob announces NEWER OLDER first comic book?? ouch!

 

after throwing up for about 2 hours, I'll regroup, and buy the new book also. You can never have too many $20,000 1st US comics

 

well, after you buy th enew book, you wont have all that many 20K books will you? Cause poor old OO will be more like a 2K book again! : )

 

love your new attitude, by the way!

 

you are correct again...a new "1st US comic" would devalue Obadiah quit quickly, but I'm not worried about it....even if it was years from now, I'm sure Bob Beerbohm would give me a full refund plus interest if his research was incomplete or flawed. He would give me a refund, wouldn't he? Dealers do that all the time years later when they are found to not be correct, don't they ?

[comicdonna]

since Beerbaum is doing 99% of the research in this area, I wonder how Showcase 4 will react when Bob announces NEWER OLDER first comic book?? ouch!

 

after throwing up for about 2 hours, I'll regroup, and buy the new book also. You can never have too many $20,000 1st US comics

 

well, after you buy th enew book, you wont have all that many 20K books will you? Cause poor old OO will be more like a 2K book again! : )

 

love your new attitude, by the way!

 

you are correct again...a new "1st US comic" would devalue Obadiah quit quickly, but I'm not worried about it....even if it was years from now, I'm sure Bob Beerbohm would give me a full refund plus interest if his research was incomplete or flawed. He would give me a refund, wouldn't he? Dealers do that all the time years later when they are found to not be correct, don't they ?

I guess it's the humor, that keeps me coming back to this thread.

[ShoNuff-migration]

I'm sure Bob Beerbohm would give me a full refund plus interest if his research was incomplete or flawed. He would give me a refund, wouldn't he? Dealers do that all the time years later when they are found to not be correct, don't they ?

No.

[tth2]

Let's start fresh...hi guys, my name is showcase-4, and I am not KK. I am also new to the boards, and have had my rookie hazing..thanks for bearing with me. I went from never responding to a post to starting my own, and based on your feedback, I'm not doing so hot....that's OK...we have all to start somehwere.

 

I am however, very much not a rookie when it comes to comic books, as I have collected in the past 14 years books from 1842 ( as you know ) all the way up to 1969. The reason this very interesting and appropriate pamphlet? is not a sequential comic book as is Obadiah Oldbuck, is it lacks one key ingredient. It clearly has comic art with text, and tells a story in a sequence...just like Obadiah. The single missing characteristic is that it lacks the enclosure of each image and its corresponding text within its own indivual box or "panel". Had this pamphlet had this additional feature, I would acnkowledge it as a sequential comic book. Since it does not, this would be considered an illustrated text.

Good post. I think if you had started out with this tone of voice from the beginning, you wouldn't have been given such a hard time.

 

If you have time, you should pull up Krazy_Kat's posts and then compare them to your initial posts, and hopefully you'll see the similarity. I think you'll then understand why so many here were suspicious of you, and why you rubbed so many people the wrong way.

[batman_fan]

I have done the math and here is where I see we are at:

 

showcase-4 = KK

 

Look at showcase-4's post. Everything is the same. I still think it is too out of place. Now please bear in mind, I always liked KKs post and I think his continual pumping of OA did in fact cause some of the sheep to switch pastures. My guess is the OO pumping will do the same for Victorian as well.

[tth2]

I have done the math and here is where I see we are at:

 

showcase-4 = KK

 

Look at showcase-4's post. Everything is the same. I still think it is too out of place. Now please bear in mind, I always liked KKs post and I think his continual pumping of OA did in fact cause some of the sheep to switch pastures. My guess is the OO pumping will do the same for Victorian as well.

I continue to think he`s KK too. But I`m giving him the benefit of the doubt here because he displayed some recalcitrance in his post, something that KK never did. Don`t worry, I`m sure if we give him enough rope, he`ll hang himself (again) soon enough.

[showcase4]

I have done the math and here is where I see we are at:

 

showcase-4 = KK

 

Look at showcase-4's post. Everything is the same. I still think it is too out of place. Now please bear in mind, I always liked KKs post and I think his continual pumping of OA did in fact cause some of the sheep to switch pastures. My guess is the OO pumping will do the same for Victorian as well.

I continue to think he`s KK too. But I`m giving him the benefit of the doubt here because he displayed some recalcitrance in his post, something that KK never did. Don`t worry, I`m sure if we give him enough rope, he`ll hang himself (again) soon enough.

 

 

sorry...you get a "D" in math. I am not KK. This post was originally intended to help create awareness of the top Victorian Age book ( Obadiah Oldbuck ), and how radically different it is from the top Golden Age book ( Action #1) in terms of value and demand. That is a tough comparison to make when 90% of the responses were that Obadiah isn't even comic book. ( which mutated this post into something completely different ). I did not know the " it's not a comic book " premise was so wide spread - at least from the respondants to this post. Hard to compare 2 comic books to each other, when you think 1 of the 2 isn't even a comic book. It looks like there is long way to go for the Victorian and Platinum Age markets to get their just repsect, appreciation, and investor participation on a larger scale. What do you guys think it would take for this to happen?

[showcase4]

http://www.comic.de/angouleme2003/fotos/galerie4.html

 

Here's a nice web page to view....Bob Beerbohm holding what is now one of my Obadiah copies....he's probably smiling because someone told him he'd get $10,000 for the book in 2005, even though it's a Fair 1.0 with tan pages and detached covers

[esquirecomics]

I have done the math and here is where I see we are at:

 

showcase-4 = KK

 

Look at showcase-4's post. Everything is the same. I still think it is too out of place. Now please bear in mind, I always liked KKs post and I think his continual pumping of OA did in fact cause some of the sheep to switch pastures. My guess is the OO pumping will do the same for Victorian as well.

I continue to think he`s KK too. But I`m giving him the benefit of the doubt here because he displayed some recalcitrance in his post, something that KK never did. Don`t worry, I`m sure if we give him enough rope, he`ll hang himself (again) soon enough.

 

Was KK's true identity or location never known? I thought people knew who he was but that he kept creating new shill accounts.

 

All I know is that I know exactly who showcase-4 is. I can call him at work, on his cell phone or e-mail his personal account. In fact, he is a charter member of the NOD and an advertiser in the OS.

 

So basically what you guys are saying is that Steve is the original KK and has finally come out publicly with his true identity?

 

I really doubt it.

[Timulty]

I thought, KK was some dude named Brad. Supposedly, a major OA collector with primo OA.

[showcase4]

yes, it is unfortunate that many of you think I'm not for real...shill for KK (who I don't know ). Between thinking I'm someone else, and thinking Obadiah Oldbuck is not even a comic book, it makes having a healthy and interesting debate pretty difficult. That's a shame, because I was really looking forward to input from Golden Age collectors regarding the issues brought up in this post. Here is one more web page that I thought had some good, factual info for you regarding Oldbuck:

 

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PlatinumAgeComics/

[Rip]

I have done the math and here is where I see we are at:

 

showcase-4 = KK

 

Look at showcase-4's post. Everything is the same. I still think it is too out of place. Now please bear in mind, I always liked KKs post and I think his continual pumping of OA did in fact cause some of the sheep to switch pastures. My guess is the OO pumping will do the same for Victorian as well.

I continue to think he`s KK too. But I`m giving him the benefit of the doubt here because he displayed some recalcitrance in his post, something that KK never did. Don`t worry, I`m sure if we give him enough rope, he`ll hang himself (again) soon enough.

 

Was KK's true identity or location never known? I thought people knew who he was but that he kept creating new shill accounts.

 

All I know is that I know exactly who showcase-4 is. I can call him at work, on his cell phone or e-mail his personal account. In fact, he is a charter member of the NOD and an advertiser in the OS.

 

So basically what you guys are saying is that Steve is the original KK and has finally come out publicly with his true identity?

 

I really doubt it.

 

Steve isn't KK.

KK is Fred Karger on e-bay. Also known has Brad Savage.

Steve is on pg 255 of the Overstreet

 

BTW, Steve I've read a lot of your purchases in the news. Nice to see you at the forums.

 

So who has the Oldbuck with the thin yellow cover.

 

Also you could post some interiors. I'd love to see the insides of some of those books.

[Crowzilla]

Hard to compare 2 comic books to each other, when you think 1 of the 2 isn't even a comic book. It looks like there is long way to go for the Victorian and Platinum Age markets to get their just repsect, appreciation, and investor participation on a larger scale. What do you guys think it would take for this to happen?

 

You will never have large scale investor participation in this area (while I think there is already respect for their place in history). They will continue to be looked upon as precursors to the modern comic book. Similar to how titles like Comic Monthly and The Funnies (1929 version) are perceived - links to modern comics, but not true comics in and of themselves.

Fortunately, with the titles that you are concentrating on, their doesn't need to be any "large scale investor participation" as the rarity of the books means that you only need a couple more people like yourself to enter and see increasing prices.

Will this happen? Very hard to say. I remember buying stacks of "Victorian" era comics/books/magazines in the late 80s through mid 90s at fantastic prices thinking the same thing - only a little bit of interest needs to be shown here for these books to go up dramatically. It didn't happen then and I really don't see it happening now. It's very hard for a group of 75+ year old comics which have never been hot to all of a sudden have a surge in demand.

[showcase4]

I have done the math and here is where I see we are at:

 

showcase-4 = KK

 

Look at showcase-4's post. Everything is the same. I still think it is too out of place. Now please bear in mind, I always liked KKs post and I think his continual pumping of OA did in fact cause some of the sheep to switch pastures. My guess is the OO pumping will do the same for Victorian as well.

I continue to think he`s KK too. But I`m giving him the benefit of the doubt here because he displayed some recalcitrance in his post, something that KK never did. Don`t worry, I`m sure if we give him enough rope, he`ll hang himself (again) soon enough.

 

Was KK's true identity or location never known? I thought people knew who he was but that he kept creating new shill accounts.

 

All I know is that I know exactly who showcase-4 is. I can call him at work, on his cell phone or e-mail his personal account. In fact, he is a charter member of the NOD and an advertiser in the OS.

 

So basically what you guys are saying is that Steve is the original KK and has finally come out publicly with his true identity?

 

I really doubt it.

 

Steve isn't KK.

KK is Fred Karger on e-bay. Also known has Brad Savage.

Steve is on pg 255 of the Overstreet

 

BTW, Steve I've read a lot of your purchases in the news. Nice to see you at the forums.

 

So who has the Oldbuck with the thin yellow cover.

 

Also you could post some interiors. I'd love to see the insides of some of those books.

 

thank you for your Boards welcome, and confirming that I'm me ( sounds funny ).

The Obadiah Oldbuck with the yellow cover is the prize of them all, and I don't know who owns it. Of the 8 estimated copies of Oldbuck in the world, it is the only known copy with this thin additional cover. I guess you could say it is a highly desirable "variant". I am on a mission to add it to my collection if it ever surfaces for sale.

[showcase4]

Hard to compare 2 comic books to each other, when you think 1 of the 2 isn't even a comic book. It looks like there is long way to go for the Victorian and Platinum Age markets to get their just repsect, appreciation, and investor participation on a larger scale. What do you guys think it would take for this to happen?

 

You will never have large scale investor participation in this area (while I think there is already respect for their place in history). They will continue to be looked upon as precursors to the modern comic book. Similar to how titles like Comic Monthly and The Funnies (1929 version) are perceived - links to modern comics, but not true comics in and of themselves.

Fortunately, with the titles that you are concentrating on, their doesn't need to be any "large scale investor participation" as the rarity of the books means that you only need a couple more people like yourself to enter and see increasing prices.

Will this happen? Very hard to say. I remember buying stacks of "Victorian" era comics/books/magazines in the late 80s through mid 90s at fantastic prices thinking the same thing - only a little bit of interest needs to be shown here for these books to go up dramatically. It didn't happen then and I really don't see it happening now. It's very hard for a group of 75+ year old comics which have never been hot to all of a sudden have a surge in demand.

 

so, you met me 10+ years ago and showed me some high grade silver, eh? Hope I bought something from you...great memory. I did have on my office wall at the time cut-outs of all the keys I wanted....like a goals board .

 

As for your comments, I agree it would not be realistec for comics from this era to have a sudden surge in demand . I have always predicted slow, steady growth over the next 10-15 years. ....even then, it will take some more research to fill in some holes of what was actually printed between 1842 and 1933 -ish, and it will take a few more guys like me each year or so who are willing to pay big bucks for previously not so big bucks books. I can tell you that I only buy keys from this time period, as they are always in VERY high demand by fellow collectors of this era...when I sell from time to time, I also specialize in the high demand keys. If there were 4,000-6,000? different comic books printed in this 91 year time period, I am ONLY buying/selling about 25 of them, over and over again....just the biggest and the best!

[esquirecomics]

Hard to compare 2 comic books to each other, when you think 1 of the 2 isn't even a comic book. It looks like there is long way to go for the Victorian and Platinum Age markets to get their just repsect, appreciation, and investor participation on a larger scale. What do you guys think it would take for this to happen?

 

You will never have large scale investor participation in this area (while I think there is already respect for their place in history). They will continue to be looked upon as precursors to the modern comic book. Similar to how titles like Comic Monthly and The Funnies (1929 version) are perceived - links to modern comics, but not true comics in and of themselves.

Fortunately, with the titles that you are concentrating on, their doesn't need to be any "large scale investor participation" as the rarity of the books means that you only need a couple more people like yourself to enter and see increasing prices.

Will this happen? Very hard to say. I remember buying stacks of "Victorian" era comics/books/magazines in the late 80s through mid 90s at fantastic prices thinking the same thing - only a little bit of interest needs to be shown here for these books to go up dramatically. It didn't happen then and I really don't see it happening now. It's very hard for a group of 75+ year old comics which have never been hot to all of a sudden have a surge in demand.

 

I'm pretty much in agreement here. One really doesn't need wide interest for Victorian/Platinum books to create a real niche market as with GA/SA. Just a few strong collectors. In the long term I believe these books are great investments. The more they become history, the more collectors (and I am not restricting this to comic collectors) will show an interest. And if not, so what. They are great books!

[FlyingDonut]

Hard to compare 2 comic books to each other, when you think 1 of the 2 isn't even a comic book. It looks like there is long way to go for the Victorian and Platinum Age markets to get their just repsect, appreciation, and investor participation on a larger scale. What do you guys think it would take for this to happen?

 

You will never have large scale investor participation in this area (while I think there is already respect for their place in history). They will continue to be looked upon as precursors to the modern comic book. Similar to how titles like Comic Monthly and The Funnies (1929 version) are perceived - links to modern comics, but not true comics in and of themselves.

Fortunately, with the titles that you are concentrating on, their doesn't need to be any "large scale investor participation" as the rarity of the books means that you only need a couple more people like yourself to enter and see increasing prices.

Will this happen? Very hard to say. I remember buying stacks of "Victorian" era comics/books/magazines in the late 80s through mid 90s at fantastic prices thinking the same thing - only a little bit of interest needs to be shown here for these books to go up dramatically. It didn't happen then and I really don't see it happening now. It's very hard for a group of 75+ year old comics which have never been hot to all of a sudden have a surge in demand.

 

I'm pretty much in agreement here. One really doesn't need wide interest for Victorian/Platinum books to create a real niche market as with GA/SA. Just a few strong collectors. In the long term I believe these books are great investments. The more they become history, the more collectors (and I am not restricting this to comic collectors) will show an interest. And if not, so what . They are great books!

 

The "so what" is the whole point of this insipid thread. Platinum Age and Victorian Age books - as an investment of any kind? Ridiculously bad. There aren't any buyers for them outside of a VERY small pool of people.

 

No one is arguing that they aren't great books. I think Yellow Kid 1-5 are phenomenal. That's never been the point.

[esquirecomics]

Hard to compare 2 comic books to each other, when you think 1 of the 2 isn't even a comic book. It looks like there is long way to go for the Victorian and Platinum Age markets to get their just repsect, appreciation, and investor participation on a larger scale. What do you guys think it would take for this to happen?

 

You will never have large scale investor participation in this area (while I think there is already respect for their place in history). They will continue to be looked upon as precursors to the modern comic book. Similar to how titles like Comic Monthly and The Funnies (1929 version) are perceived - links to modern comics, but not true comics in and of themselves.

Fortunately, with the titles that you are concentrating on, their doesn't need to be any "large scale investor participation" as the rarity of the books means that you only need a couple more people like yourself to enter and see increasing prices.

Will this happen? Very hard to say. I remember buying stacks of "Victorian" era comics/books/magazines in the late 80s through mid 90s at fantastic prices thinking the same thing - only a little bit of interest needs to be shown here for these books to go up dramatically. It didn't happen then and I really don't see it happening now. It's very hard for a group of 75+ year old comics which have never been hot to all of a sudden have a surge in demand.

 

I'm pretty much in agreement here. One really doesn't need wide interest for Victorian/Platinum books to create a real niche market as with GA/SA. Just a few strong collectors. In the long term I believe these books are great investments. The more they become history, the more collectors (and I am not restricting this to comic collectors) will show an interest. And if not, so what . They are great books!

 

The "so what" is the whole point of this insipid thread. Platinum Age and Victorian Age books - as an investment of any kind? Ridiculously bad. There aren't any buyers for them outside of a VERY small pool of people.

 

No one is arguing that they aren't great books. I think Yellow Kid 1-5 are phenomenal. That's never been the point.

 

Dan, all someone needs is one buyer. When you are talking about such rare books as these, that might typically number less than 20 copies in existence, and perhaps as few as 3-5, you don't need a large pool from which to draw from. The fact is the availability of the books is especially limited. Steve's purchase of OO for $20k could turn into $35k tomorrow with the right buyer, or it might be $10k. Maybe it would be one or the other next year, or ten years from now.

 

These are subjective opinions on a speculative market that can fluctuate greatly. And all it needs is one or two new entries from a particularly bold and wealthy collector to push it forward.

[showcase4]

"The "so what" is the whole point of this insipid thread. Platinum Age and Victorian Age books - as an investment of any kind? Ridiculously bad. There aren't any buyers for them outside of a VERY small pool of people."

 

 

 

 

Actually, if you know what you are doing, and know the market, they can be one of the greatest investments out threre. Case in point:

 

The '06 Overtsreet Price Guide references 2 recent sales for 'The Yellow Kid in McFadden's Flats'. I was involved in both of those transactions. In 2004, I bought a cover detached, about to fall apart fair 1.0 for $2,901. I spent $1,250 and had the book tied up for 13 months to have a very high level professional restoration of this key, and it came out beautiful....just stunning! I sold that book as a VF restored in 2005 for $10,500. So, in 13 months, I turned a $4,151 investment ( book price + restoration cost) into a $6,349 profit ( $10,500 sales price - $4,151 cost = $6,349)

 

The reason I was able to do that, and with confidence, is I knew the demand for the book, I know a great restoration expert, I know how to sell and market as an Ebay power seller, and I knew that $2,901 for a fair 1.0 was a good price for a YK in McFadden's Flats. It is all about expertise within your market, and experience. The ONLY real difference between my market and the SA/GA market, is when I sell, I may have just 2 or 3 buyers. When you go to sell an All American 16 or Pep 22, you may have as many 200 or 2,000 potential buyers...everything else is the same...a great comic book is a great comic book.

[buttock]

"The "so what" is the whole point of this insipid thread. Platinum Age and Victorian Age books - as an investment of any kind? Ridiculously bad. There aren't any buyers for them outside of a VERY small pool of people."

 

 

 

 

Actually, if you know what you are doing, and know the market, they can be one of the greatest investments out threre. Case in point:

 

The '06 Overtsreet Price Guide references 2 recent sales for 'The Yellow Kid in McFadden's Flats'. I was involved in both of those transactions. In 2004, I bought a cover detached, about to fall apart fair 1.0 for $2,901. I spent $1,250 and had the book tied up for 13 months to have a very high level professional restoration of this key, and it came out beautiful....just stunning! I sold that book as a VF restored in 2005 for $10,500. So, in 13 months, I turned a $4,151 investment ( book price + restoration cost) into a $6,349 profit ( $10,500 sales price - $4,151 cost = $6,349)

 

The reason I was able to do that, and with confidence, is I knew the demand for the book, I know a great restoration expert, I know how to sell and market as an Ebay power seller, and I knew that $2,901 for a fair 1.0 was a good price for a YK in McFadden's Flats. It is all about expertise within your market, and experience. The ONLY real difference between my market and the SA/GA market, is when I sell, I may have just 2 or 3 buyers. When you go to sell an All American 16 or Pep 22, you may have as many 200 or 2,000 potential buyers...everything else is the same...a great comic book is a great comic book.

 

Wait, you're an Ebay powerseller? How interesting, why haven't you mentioned this before...