Page Quality on CGC Books

[namisgr]

I believe page quality is a better reflection of preservation than the grade.

I put a lot of value into the page quality. As a Rule of Thumb, White pages usually go for a 10% or more premium, while CR/OW go for a discount.

You are correct that it has been debated. It is a matter of personal preference but

for me, I want WHITE pages.

Your white pages now were off-white to white pages yesterday and could very well be cream to off-white pages tomorrow.

 

Unless they're perfectly white/snow white. I'm sure we've all seen raw comics where the pages were as white as the day they were first printed. It's unfortunate CGC has chosen not to divide page quality scoring in such a way that identifies these exceptional, truly white examples.

[sufunk]

I believe page quality is a better reflection of preservation than the grade.

I put a lot of value into the page quality. As a Rule of Thumb, White pages usually go for a 10% or more premium, while CR/OW go for a discount.

You are correct that it has been debated. It is a matter of personal preference but

for me, I want WHITE pages.

Your white pages now were off-white to white pages yesterday and could very well be cream to off-white pages tomorrow.

 

Not true.

 

I'd like to see pics of the white pages book that resumed to a cow, much less the Many, MANY examples of this. Oh, and also the many, many cow that resubbed to whites (thumbs u

 

 

 

 

 

[Timmay]

I have 2 resubs on their way to CGC right now, one a ow/w and one white. We'll see what they come back.

 

By definition, a resub is hoping for a differed result but to imply that PQ is completely arbitrary, is a little much.

 

I have a SA book I subbed that I was floored at how white the pages were. White like copy paper white. Came back OW/W.

[DrWatson]

We can apply the Schmell Whiteness Scale:

 

1.) Ultra White

 

2.) Bleach White

 

3.) Bone White

[Timmay]

Chrisco37 resubbed a LT/OW book that came back OW.

[namisgr]

We can apply the Schmell Whiteness Scale:

 

1.) Ultra White

 

2.) Bleach White

 

3.) Bone White

 

Well, these ol' bones ain't so damn white any more.

 

How about:

 

4.) Snow white (and the 7 graders)

[DrWatson]

I believe page quality is a better reflection of preservation than the grade.

I put a lot of value into the page quality. As a Rule of Thumb, White pages usually go for a 10% or more premium, while CR/OW go for a discount.

You are correct that it has been debated. It is a matter of personal preference but

for me, I want WHITE pages.

Your white pages now were off-white to white pages yesterday and could very well be cream to off-white pages tomorrow.

 

Not true.

 

I'd like to see pics of the white pages book that resumed to a cow, much less the Many, MANY examples of this. Oh, and also the many, many cow that resubbed to whites (thumbs u

 

 

Page quality changes all the time on resubs. It goes up. It goes down. Believe what you want, Cochise. It makes no difference to me. (thumbs u

[DrWatson]

We can apply the Schmell Whiteness Scale:

 

1.) Ultra White

 

2.) Bleach White

 

3.) Bone White

 

Well, these ol' bones ain't so damn white any more.

Have you thought about a resub?

[sufunk]

I believe page quality is a better reflection of preservation than the grade.

I put a lot of value into the page quality. As a Rule of Thumb, White pages usually go for a 10% or more premium, while CR/OW go for a discount.

You are correct that it has been debated. It is a matter of personal preference but

for me, I want WHITE pages.

Your white pages now were off-white to white pages yesterday and could very well be cream to off-white pages tomorrow.

 

Not true.

 

I'd like to see pics of the white pages book that resumed to a cow, much less the Many, MANY examples of this. Oh, and also the many, many cow that resubbed to whites (thumbs u

 

 

Page quality changes all the time on resubs. It goes up. It goes down. Believe what you want, Cochise. It makes no difference to me. (thumbs u

 

AKA, you dont have any actual examples (thumbs u

 

yes, it goes up and down just like grades. Once in a blue moon, there is also a HUGE PQ difference on a resub the same way there is with grades like the legendary 4.0 that became a 9.0. That is not the norm like you make it out.

 

To say that a white pages could "VERY WELL" be a cow on a resub is NOT accurate. That implies it happens all the time. It doesn't.

 

If i'm wrong, post the numerous instances of whites becoming cows and vice versa. Short of that, you're wrong. Sorry (thumbs u

[Mark 1]

[namisgr]

Books do change two page quality units on resubmission a surprising number of times.

 

Perhaps the best known example is the famous FF #1 that went from a 9.4 ow to a 9.6 white.

[DrWatson]

I believe page quality is a better reflection of preservation than the grade.

I put a lot of value into the page quality. As a Rule of Thumb, White pages usually go for a 10% or more premium, while CR/OW go for a discount.

You are correct that it has been debated. It is a matter of personal preference but

for me, I want WHITE pages.

Your white pages now were off-white to white pages yesterday and could very well be cream to off-white pages tomorrow.

 

Not true.

 

I'd like to see pics of the white pages book that resumed to a cow, much less the Many, MANY examples of this. Oh, and also the many, many cow that resubbed to whites (thumbs u

 

 

Page quality changes all the time on resubs. It goes up. It goes down. Believe what you want, Cochise. It makes no difference to me. (thumbs u

 

AKA, you dont have any actual examples (thumbs u

 

yes, it goes up and down just like grades. Once in a blue moon, there is also a HUGE PQ difference on a resub the same way there is with grades like the legendary 4.0 that became a 9.0. That is not the norm like you make it out.

 

To say that a white pages could "VERY WELL" be a cow on a resub is NOT accurate. That implies it happens all the time. It doesn't.

 

If i'm wrong, post the numerous instances of whites becoming cows and vice versa. Short of that, you're wrong. Sorry (thumbs u

Fine, I'm wrong. I've never resubbed any books. Resub away.

[mt1000]

jeez its just PQ everyone's so serious

[Foolkiller]

I guess my feeling is this, if you've been trying to buy books based on pq then basically you're fooling yourself, since it's a lot of guess work and is quite arbitrary. Both Haspel and Borock have both told me how ridiculous they think it is that people chase page quality.

 

In addition, if you're trying to get a book at a discount with ow/w pages instead of white, you're crazy. cr/ow v. white, that I buy. But on say, 50s DCs, cr/ow is the norm and perfectly acceptable.

[sufunk]

Books do change two page quality units on resubmission a surprising number of times.

 

Perhaps the best known example is the famous FF #1 that went from a 9.4 ow to a 9.6 white.

 

Im not disputing that, of course it does just like grades. My dispute is acting like PQ is irrelevant since a white pages could "very well" become c/ow on a resub. That isn't accurate.

 

Yes, I agree that PQ is more likely to change than grades and more likely to have a greater change but whites aren't changing to cows and vice versa every day. That's a once ina blue moon change if it's ever even happened.

[Foolkiller]

Books do change two page quality units on resubmission a surprising number of times.

 

Perhaps the best known example is the famous FF #1 that went from a 9.4 ow to a 9.6 white.

 

Im not disputing that, of course it does just like grades. My dispute is acting like PQ is irrelevant since a white pages could "very well" become c/ow on a resub. That isn't accurate.

 

Yes, I agree that PQ is more likely to change than grades and more likely to have a greater change but whites aren't changing to cows and vice versa every day. That's a once ina blue moon change if it's ever even happened.

 

I guess my point -- as I said above -- is your assumption the original designation given was 100% accurate. They're not scrutinizing it that closely. In fact, it was so meaningless to Borock, that he didn't want PQ designation on the label at all (which I'd disagree with) but that should give you an idea of how much emphasis and effort they put on it.

[sufunk]

I believe page quality is a better reflection of preservation than the grade.

I put a lot of value into the page quality. As a Rule of Thumb, White pages usually go for a 10% or more premium, while CR/OW go for a discount.

You are correct that it has been debated. It is a matter of personal preference but

for me, I want WHITE pages.

Your white pages now were off-white to white pages yesterday and could very well be cream to off-white pages tomorrow.

 

Not true.

 

I'd like to see pics of the white pages book that resumed to a cow, much less the Many, MANY examples of this. Oh, and also the many, many cow that resubbed to whites (thumbs u

 

 

Page quality changes all the time on resubs. It goes up. It goes down. Believe what you want, Cochise. It makes no difference to me. (thumbs u

 

AKA, you dont have any actual examples (thumbs u

 

yes, it goes up and down just like grades. Once in a blue moon, there is also a HUGE PQ difference on a resub the same way there is with grades like the legendary 4.0 that became a 9.0. That is not the norm like you make it out.

 

To say that a white pages could "VERY WELL" be a cow on a resub is NOT accurate. That implies it happens all the time. It doesn't.

 

If i'm wrong, post the numerous instances of whites becoming cows and vice versa. Short of that, you're wrong. Sorry (thumbs u

Fine, I'm wrong. I've never resubbed any books. Resub away.

 

Since you're the master of resubs and without question right, it should be pretty easy to post the pics of this everyday occurence of cows becoming white and whites becoming cows. I'm sure its happened to you dozens of times alone (thumbs u

 

Post away

[sufunk]

Books do change two page quality units on resubmission a surprising number of times.

 

Perhaps the best known example is the famous FF #1 that went from a 9.4 ow to a 9.6 white.

 

Im not disputing that, of course it does just like grades. My dispute is acting like PQ is irrelevant since a white pages could "very well" become c/ow on a resub. That isn't accurate.

 

Yes, I agree that PQ is more likely to change than grades and more likely to have a greater change but whites aren't changing to cows and vice versa every day. That's a once ina blue moon change if it's ever even happened.

 

I guess my point -- as I said above -- is your assumption the original designation given was 100% accurate. They're not scrutinizing it that closely. In fact, it was so meaningless to Borock, that he didn't want PQ designation on the label at all (which I'd disagree with) but that should give you an idea of how much emphasis and effort they put on it.

 

When did i ever say or even imply that PQ was "100% accurate"

 

I've admitted from the 1st it can change just like grades and even more so. Just not nearly as drastically or as often as some are implying. To say that white pages is meaningless because it could "very well" be a cow on a resub is accurate? Are you agreeing with that Foolkiller?

[Foolkiller]

I don't know how often it changes or doesn't, but I imagine it could have some real variance. I can't say how often it has happened, but I've resubbed 5 books recently and they all moved one unit (up or down).

 

That's a completely unscientific sampling and I'm not arguing that point.

 

My only point is very simple:

 

The notion that the original designation was completely accurate is a myth. Haspel will tell you it's a very arbitrary distinction between ow/w and white. He sees little wrong with cr/ow as well. The PQ is an added layer to the resub game as well as a premium for label chasers. That's it. They're pretty up front about telling you this too.

[DrWatson]

I believe page quality is a better reflection of preservation than the grade.

I put a lot of value into the page quality. As a Rule of Thumb, White pages usually go for a 10% or more premium, while CR/OW go for a discount.

You are correct that it has been debated. It is a matter of personal preference but

for me, I want WHITE pages.

Your white pages now were off-white to white pages yesterday and could very well be cream to off-white pages tomorrow.

 

Not true.

 

I'd like to see pics of the white pages book that resumed to a cow, much less the Many, MANY examples of this. Oh, and also the many, many cow that resubbed to whites (thumbs u

 

 

Page quality changes all the time on resubs. It goes up. It goes down. Believe what you want, Cochise. It makes no difference to me. (thumbs u

 

AKA, you dont have any actual examples (thumbs u

 

yes, it goes up and down just like grades. Once in a blue moon, there is also a HUGE PQ difference on a resub the same way there is with grades like the legendary 4.0 that became a 9.0. That is not the norm like you make it out.

 

To say that a white pages could "VERY WELL" be a cow on a resub is NOT accurate. That implies it happens all the time. It doesn't.

 

If i'm wrong, post the numerous instances of whites becoming cows and vice versa. Short of that, you're wrong. Sorry (thumbs u

Fine, I'm wrong. I've never resubbed any books. Resub away.

 

Since you're the master of resubs and without question right, it should be pretty easy to post the pics of this everyday occurence of cows becoming white and whites becoming cows. I'm sure its happened to you dozens of times alone (thumbs u

 

Post away

I don't keep before and after scans. However, page quality is very volatile. It's not static. It's a little more than an after thought to the graders at CGC. Don't take my word for it. I don't care.