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KAMALA KHAN
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Started by carter3175,

879 posts in this topic

ygogolak

ygogolak

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

That is the regular 3rd print, yes. The b&w is the 3rd print sketch. I don't really have another good example off the top of my head as to another time as to when they did a variant for a later printing, but so far I have 4 sources that say it's the 3rd print variant and I don't see any that say 1st print, besides maybe eBay listings:

Midtown

MCS

CCL

CBR

 

You guys know there are two different covers for the 3rd print, right? That's why one of them has a different UPC, to distinguish it from the "other" 3rd print cover.

 

That's what we're discussing. Some believe it's a first print variant.

Edited by ygogolak
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revat

revat

Posted
Posted

 

That is the regular 3rd print, yes. The b&w is the 3rd print sketch. I don't really have another good example off the top of my head as to another time as to when they did a variant for a later printing, but so far I have 4 sources that say it's the 3rd print variant and I don't see any that say 1st print, besides maybe eBay listings:

Midtown

MCS

CCL

CBR

 

You guys know there are two different covers for the 3rd print, right? That's why one of them has a different UPC, to distinguish it from the "other" 3rd print cover.

 

That's what we're discussing. Some believe it's a first print.

 

they all got their info from the same place, who all got it wrong. It's not a third print. It's a sketch variant. CGC recognizes it as a sketch variant, NOT a 3rd print.

 

All the other reprints say 2nd, 3rd, 4th, print etc, and have the UPC 112, 113, 114, etc.

 

Why would this one be different and be an unlabeled 3rd print when another one already exists? Is there a corresponding unlabeled 2nd print too? All the other variants are labeled 121, 131, etc...

 

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ygogolak

ygogolak

Posted
Posted

 

That is the regular 3rd print, yes. The b&w is the 3rd print sketch. I don't really have another good example off the top of my head as to another time as to when they did a variant for a later printing, but so far I have 4 sources that say it's the 3rd print variant and I don't see any that say 1st print, besides maybe eBay listings:

Midtown

MCS

CCL

CBR

 

You guys know there are two different covers for the 3rd print, right? That's why one of them has a different UPC, to distinguish it from the "other" 3rd print cover.

 

That's what we're discussing. Some believe it's a first print.

 

they all got their info from the same place, who all got it wrong. It's not a third print. It's a sketch variant. CGC recognizes it as a sketch variant, NOT a 3rd print.

 

All the other reprints say 2nd, 3rd, 4th, print etc, and have the UPC 112, 113, 114, etc.

 

Why would this one be different and be an unlabeled 3rd print when another one already exists? Is there a corresponding unlabeled 2nd print too? All the other variants are labeled 121, 131, etc...

 

So when Midtown was selling them pre-order and new they put the wrong information on their website? There wasn't a sketch cover solicited in Previews (see CBR listing), so how did it end up getting distributed?

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Mike's Rack

Mike's Rack

Posted
Posted
Check out the dealer adds in Overstreets from the late '70's. Hulk 180 used to sell for 4x what 181 sold for. Things like this change, especially over the long haul and especially on heavily speculated books. This thread displays a distinct lack of insight into the hobby. :preach:

 

Here's some insight.

 

OSPG 78-79 is the first time wolverine is listed, no 180 listed, says 181 1st appearance of wolverine: $1.20

Was not until 81-82 that they changed listing to include 180 and 181 seperate in the guide, both @ $12.00.

 

By 1986, 180: $10.00 181: $27.50

 

Never really saw that 4x value anywhere, but I might have been asleep for all of 1984.

 

feel bad for all those crazy speculators in 1984 that lost out on those stacks of 180 they bought.

 

Anyway, back to Kamala...

Thanks for the info, now check the dealers ads selling the books for the actual selling prices. The guide has always been a guide. The point is this stuff is not set in stone and the "market has spoken" jargon won't apply if the market changes it's mind. I'm set on all of these books, I don't care who wins. I just think its too early to call the game.

 

 

The game was over months ago on CM 17 2nd, you just were not participating when it happend.

 

The point is the market does not change it's mind when a book gets the 200+ prices that CM 17 2nd has hit. The "market" already has decided on this book, when it was selling for $10-20 (3-6x cover) for MONTHS last year until December, than the market decided to make it a $200+ book.

 

Your comparison of these mysterious "dealer ads" means nothing, even if you had some to show, they are ads, not completed sales, and the guide was THE definitive source until the mid 90's when trackable internet sales came along. You seem to toot your own horn about your "insight", but shows you are WAY behind in understanding the current market of today. What you or I think has nothing to do with the market, we can try to predict it , but you can never control it, our only option is to just go along for the ride, or don't get in the boat in the first place. I made the smart move of buying a ticket when they were $20, could have been the wrong move, but luckily I was right and my $20's are now $200.

I'll try to read your post in the most gracious way possible, my comment about insight wasn't directed at you. I didn't intent to offend anyone and I would like to believe that you didn't either.

Overstreet 11 (1981):

 

12B3DF48-727E-4A94-ADA8-CE4D43B4D534_zpssyd6ujgo.jpg

 

 

 

the "definitive source" lists 180 at $12.00 in NM and 181 and 182 at $5.25 (closer to 2X):

 

 

82D56D4B-599F-456F-8B92-C164AC457F61_zpsf1tso84x.jpg

 

 

The dealer ads are not mysterious, it's Steve Geppi's ad, and it shows an even greater discrepancy $15.00 for the 180 and $1.20 for the 181:

 

 

787ED9E8-C820-45B1-ADFF-154BC8553FC8_zpsxt25pily.jpg

 

 

 

 

I would argue that Geppi's ad better reflects the marketplace, because he had some actual skin in the game (selling 181 at about 20% of the guide price) but that's not my point. The point I'm trying to express, (and the reason that I'm spending the time posting this and cluttering up this thread) is that these things can change and have changed in the past. Also, don't assume that I missed the boat on this or that I'm biased because I am invested in one book. I have more of the 17 2nd than I do the point one. I've done very well with that book. I'm not saying that things will change but I don't think it is accurate to say that these things can never change and have never in the past, when they have. To me, such comments appear to be an attempt to manipulate the market toward one book over the other. It's too early to call the game on this one (shrug)

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revat

revat

Posted
Posted

 

That is the regular 3rd print, yes. The b&w is the 3rd print sketch. I don't really have another good example off the top of my head as to another time as to when they did a variant for a later printing, but so far I have 4 sources that say it's the 3rd print variant and I don't see any that say 1st print, besides maybe eBay listings:

Midtown

MCS

CCL

CBR

 

You guys know there are two different covers for the 3rd print, right? That's why one of them has a different UPC, to distinguish it from the "other" 3rd print cover.

 

That's what we're discussing. Some believe it's a first print.

 

they all got their info from the same place, who all got it wrong. It's not a third print. It's a sketch variant. CGC recognizes it as a sketch variant, NOT a 3rd print.

 

All the other reprints say 2nd, 3rd, 4th, print etc, and have the UPC 112, 113, 114, etc.

 

Why would this one be different and be an unlabeled 3rd print when another one already exists? Is there a corresponding unlabeled 2nd print too? All the other variants are labeled 121, 131, etc...

 

So when Midtown was selling them pre-order and new they put the wrong information on their website? There wasn't a sketch cover solicited in Previews (see CBR listing), so how did it end up getting distributed?

 

actually what I meant to say was.... whoops I'm wrong. It doesn't make any sense as to why they did it, or why they named it like that, or why the UPC is like that (although I guess they didn't have a choice), but it looks like that sketch variant is in fact a 3rd print. I'm not sure if its a sketch variant of the 3rd print, or a separate 3rd print that happens to be a sketch variant (although the point is likely moot).

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MadGenius

MadGenius

Posted
Posted

 

That is the regular 3rd print, yes. The b&w is the 3rd print sketch. I don't really have another good example off the top of my head as to another time as to when they did a variant for a later printing, but so far I have 4 sources that say it's the 3rd print variant and I don't see any that say 1st print, besides maybe eBay listings:

Midtown

MCS

CCL

CBR

 

You guys know there are two different covers for the 3rd print, right? That's why one of them has a different UPC, to distinguish it from the "other" 3rd print cover.

 

That's what we're discussing. Some believe it's a first print variant.

It's defnitely a 3rd print, not a 1st print variant. I remember when it was solicited and it could be had for cover price at the time of release.

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Rip

Rip

Posted
Posted (edited)

Now you have me curious if its some kind of error in the issue. Overstreet often made errors in the early guides. Not to mention it's often just plain wrong with unrealistic prices even in the early 80's.

I'll explain:

Price Guide 10 (1979/1980) lists only 181 as the first app. at $3.75 and no breakout for 180 still at $1.20.

You can look through the ads in X-Men and all through 1980 (Check most Marvel Comics Around Oct 1980 for example). Only Hulk 181 sells for a breakout price at $3.50 (Moondance Comics Ad)

 

Now in 1981 in the price guide Hulk 180 is listed at $12.00 (and as the first apperance) 181 is $5.25

Yet looking at the ads in various Marvel books, for example FF 232-233 of July/Aug 1981 lists Hulk 181 at $10.00, Hulk 180 is $2.00 (Moondance comics)

Later in Oct 1981 (FF 235 for example) Mile High Comics Has Hulk 181 at $10 and 180 at $5

 

In 1982 Moondance's next ads start around March 1982 and has Hulk 181 at $25 and 180,182 at $15.00

 

In Sep.1982 (Fantastic Four 246 for example) Mile High comics ad has Hulk 180 for $11 and Hulk 181 for $16

 

Then Price Guide 13 (1983/84) lists 181 at $20 and 180 at $6.00 and Geppi was selling 181's at $20 and 180's at $7.50.

 

Aside from that Overstreet I can't find another example of Hulk 180 selling for more. Does anyone have an Overstreet 12? Mine is missing. Edit: Nevermind Overstreet 12 has Hulk 181 at $16 and 180 at $6

 

Now I'm not saying it didn't happen but I can't find anything showing this quick flip flop of Hulk 180 "selling" for more than 181 aside from that Overstreet/Geppi Ad you list. I'd be glad to dig up some other price lists and dealers catalogs as well, which I believe I own.

For Example Penny Ranch a large dealer from the 80's (had ads in Overstreet) has a Jan 1st 1982 Catalog for Hulk 180,182 at $7.50 in VF/Mint and 181 at $25.00 VF/Mint.

(In the early 1981 MH catalog Hulk 181 was $20 and $5 for $180)

 

 

 

Edited by Rip
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revat

revat

Posted
Posted
So Is it a 3rd print or a 1st print? MCS has it as a third print?

 

yes 3rd. but sketch variant third print. but its not labeled as such anywhere including the upc or the bottom (like the yellow cover 3rd print). But it was originally solicited and sold as such (for some reason), nor does CGC recognize it as a 3rd print.

 

I can only guess that at some point Marvel made a rash decision or the publisher made some type of error or an odd combination of both, as this seems like a pretty rare situation.

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THB

THB

Posted
Posted

Looking at MCS they have these release dates by the issues......

 

1A - published 4/2014

1B - published 4/2014

1C - published 4/2014

1D - published 4/2014

1E - published 5/2014 (2nd print)

1F - published 6/2014 (3rd print)

1G - published 4/2014 (the issue in question)

 

so what gives???????

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Lonzilla

Lonzilla

Posted
Posted

I had one a while back, listed it and was told it was a 3rd print by someone who sent me a pic of theirs that was slabbed and noted as a 3rd print by CGC.

The upc reads as a 1st print and it didn't say 3rd print anywhere inside, so I was thinking that either Marvel messed up twice on the book, or CGC messed up on the label.

It's worth noting that I got it for cover price at a shop that had the standard 1st printing on the wall for $15. So, I'd say 3rd print for that sketch variant is probably right.

 

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Mike's Rack

Mike's Rack

Posted
Posted

 

Now you have me curious if its some kind of error in the issue. Overstreet often made errors in the early guides. Not to mention it's often just plain wrong with unrealistic prices even in the early 80's.

I'll explain:

Price Guide 10 (1979/1980) lists only 181 as the first app. at $3.75 and no breakout for 180 still at $1.20.

You can look through the ads in X-Men and all through 1980 (Check most Marvel Comics Around Oct 1980 for example). Only Hulk 181 sells for a breakout price at $3.50 (Moondance Comics Ad)

 

Now in 1981 in the price guide Hulk 180 is listed at $12.00 (and as the first apperance) 181 is $5.25

Yet looking at the ads in various Marvel books, for example FF 232-233 of July/Aug 1981 lists Hulk 181 at $10.00, Hulk 180 is $2.00 (Moondance comics)

Later in Oct 1981 (FF 235 for example) Mile High Comics Has Hulk 181 at $10 and 180 at $5

 

In 1982 Moondance's next ads start around March 1982 and has Hulk 181 at $25 and 180,182 at $15.00

 

In Sep.1982 (Fantastic Four 246 for example) Mile High comics ad has Hulk 180 for $11 and Hulk 181 for $16

 

Then Price Guide 13 (1983/84) lists 181 at $20 and 180 at $6.00 and Geppi was selling 181's at $20 and 180's at $7.50.

 

Aside from that Overstreet I can't find another example of Hulk 180 selling for more. Does anyone have an Overstreet 12? Mine is missing. Edit: Nevermind Overstreet 12 has Hulk 181 at $16 and 180 at $6

 

Now I'm not saying it didn't happen but I can't find anything showing this quick flip flop of Hulk 180 "selling" for more than 181 aside from that Overstreet/Geppi Ad you list. I'd be glad to dig up some other price lists and dealers catalogs as well, which I believe I own.

For Example Penny Ranch a large dealer from the 80's (had ads in Overstreet) has a Jan 1st 1982 Catalog for Hulk 180,182 at $7.50 in VF/Mint and 181 at $25.00 VF/Mint.

(In the early 1981 MH catalog Hulk 181 was $20 and $5 for $180)

 

 

 

Hmm, good stuff, I'd like to get to the bottom of this, perhaps in the bronze forum hm

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delt569

delt569

Posted
Posted

I dug out my sketch. I could find nowhere where it says 3rd print but it has June 2014 on the inside not April 2014.

 

I also do remember buying it at my LCS and wondering why there were two 3rd prints.

 

18406156871_f82f24a534_z.jpg

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mycomicshop

mycomicshop

Posted
Posted
Looking at MCS they have these release dates by the issues......

 

1A - published 4/2014

1B - published 4/2014

1C - published 4/2014

1D - published 4/2014

1E - published 5/2014 (2nd print)

1F - published 6/2014 (3rd print)

1G - published 4/2014 (the issue in question)

 

so what gives???????

 

Here's what we have in our database:

 

1A, 1B, 1C, and 1D have Diamond item codes from December 2013 (DEC130623,DEC130624,DEC130625,DEC130626), released week of Feb 7, have cover date April. The date listed on our site is the cover date, which is usually a month or two later than when the book actually appears on shelves.

 

1E has a Diamond item code from January 2014 (JAN148035), released week of March 14, has cover date May. 2nd print.

 

1F has a Diamond item code from February 2014 (FEB148201), released week of April 25, has cover date June. 3rd print.

 

1G also has a Diamond item code from February 2014 (FEB148202), and is also marked as having released the week of April 25. Based on that, I changed our cover date from April to June to match 1F. 1G was made available by Diamond and released at the same time as 1F.

 

So yes, we consider 1G to be a 3rd printing even though Marvel didn't label it as such on the cover.

 

 

We aren't always consistent with setting the cover dates for reprints. Sometimes the cover date will be the same as for the original printing, even though the reprint came out months later. This is helpful in cases where the book actually has the date shown on the cover: eg the original says August, and the reprint also says August on the cover even though it came out in December. In other cases, we'll set the cover date on a reprint to indicate the timeframe in which the reprint was available for purchase. That's what I did here with 1G, changing it from April (when the first prints came out) to June (matching 1F, which was released at the same time as 1G).

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MadGenius

MadGenius

Posted
Posted
Looking at MCS they have these release dates by the issues......

 

1A - published 4/2014

1B - published 4/2014

1C - published 4/2014

1D - published 4/2014

1E - published 5/2014 (2nd print)

1F - published 6/2014 (3rd print)

1G - published 4/2014 (the issue in question)

 

so what gives???????

 

Here's what we have in our database:

 

1A, 1B, 1C, and 1D have Diamond item codes from December 2013 (DEC130623,DEC130624,DEC130625,DEC130626), released week of Feb 7, have cover date April. The date listed on our site is the cover date, which is usually a month or two later than when the book actually appears on shelves.

 

1E has a Diamond item code from January 2014 (JAN148035), released week of March 14, has cover date May. 2nd print.

 

1F has a Diamond item code from February 2014 (FEB148201), released week of April 25, has cover date June. 3rd print.

 

1G also has a Diamond item code from February 2014 (FEB148202), and is also marked as having released the week of April 25. Based on that, I changed our cover date from April to June to match 1F. 1G was made available by Diamond and released at the same time as 1F.

 

So yes, we consider 1G to be a 3rd printing even though Marvel didn't label it as such on the cover.

 

 

We aren't always consistent with setting the cover dates for reprints. Sometimes the cover date will be the same as for the original printing, even though the reprint came out months later. This is helpful in cases where the book actually has the date shown on the cover: eg the original says August, and the reprint also says August on the cover even though it came out in December. In other cases, we'll set the cover date on a reprint to indicate the timeframe in which the reprint was available for purchase. That's what I did here with 1G, changing it from April (when the first prints came out) to June (matching 1F, which was released at the same time as 1G).

3rd print. Told ya so. lol

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