STAR WARS : The Force Awakens SPOILER Discussion

[JayT]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

[crassus]

I guess I think it was a mistake also in this version to go with the Vader-lite villain. To me it was a weak choice.

 

Maybe. But it was also a very believable choice in the context of the Star Wars mythos. Han and Leia conceiving a Force-sensitive child who venerates his grandfather, the baddest dude in the known universe, rings true to me. In fact, I kind of like the set-up of the First Order being glorified groupies of the Empire, Emperor especially Vader.

 

I'll grant you that, given the choice of the villain, it was executed consistently. As another Boardie (above, somewhere) called him, "petulant", he certainly acted like a problem child.

 

I am thankful the world of troubled youth does not have access to the "dark side of the force". Imagine all the narcissistic and self-absorbed super villains!

 

Although nowadays they would probably be too busy on their phones taking pictures of themselves to do any real damage...

 

 

[bb8]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

 

If anyone is overpowered, it's Rey, as has been noted. What she was able to do to Kylo Ren with no training makes me only imagine what would happen in a duel after her training is complete. Are they setting up the villain to be the underdog? And an unlikable underdog at that? The dynamic between the two could be problematic moving forward.

[Key Largo Comics]

Just a hologram. Could be 3 inches tall for all we know.

[JayT]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

 

If anyone is overpowered, it's Rey, as has been noted. What she was able to do to Kylo Ren with no training makes me only imagine what would happen in a duel after her training is complete. Are they setting up the villain to be the underdog? And an unlikable underdog at that? The dynamic between the two could be problematic moving forward.

 

I'm not really sure about that. I totally get the reaction to it, but like I said above, baby Anakin was doing incredible things with zero training. It was intuitive, and when we are introduced to Rey I think it's set up how capable she is, when she is pulling Finn out of the fire, a trained soldier.

 

I'm not sure what the true nature of Rey is, I'm not sure what the concept of "the force awakens" exactly means and how it might effect what Rey is by the next movie.

 

 

That said, I do agree that we should never see a Rey that's less capable than we have already seen. They've set her bar, and I'm intrigued what they are going to put in front of her.

 

I actually saw it of more of a balance of Kylo NOT being an end product yet and Rey perhaps simply being more powerful innately and accepting what's been calling to her. In the film we see Kylo actually resisting the call.

 

MY question would be why hasn't Luke just took this dude out a long time ago, but that's not a problem as much as a reason to want to watch the next film. I have a lot of confidence in Rian Johnson as a director and writer (he's doing both), so I think any obvious question will be answered.

[Broke as a Joke]

The problem with Disney controlling the franchise right now is less is more. With plans on putting out a Star Wars related movie once a year for the next 20 years, there is no need for them to explain anything or get in depth on a certain aspect of the plot because they can find a way to milk it later. Loose plot holes and unfulfilling storylines will probably be the norm from here on out.

[NewWorldOrder]

The problem with Disney controlling the franchise right now is less is more. With plans on putting out a Star Wars related movie once a year for the next 20 years, there is no need for them to explain anything or get in depth on a certain aspect of the plot because they can find a way to milk it later. Loose plot holes and unfulfilling storylines will probably be the norm from here on out.

 

Yes and that is obviously a good thing.

 

Waiting 3 years in between movies is way too long.

 

SW is a space opera so they should make it so. More, more, more every year.

[drotto]

I actually liked that the final light saber fight came across as somewhat raw and like the fighters were not especially skilled. This rang true for people that would have been less trained than Jedi from the top of their power. I actually did not like the fights from the prequels. As others have said those prequel fights were over choreographed video games.

 

I also hope that doing the Starkiller base is just taking the super weapon the ridiculous end. Going from killing a planet with one blast, to killing whole star systems with one blast. Now they have taken the Deathstar to the extreme we can now move on from the big weapon contest.

[comix4fun]

 

The new bad guy...Why is he 50 feet tall? Is that just because it was a hologram??

 

 

Classic overcompensating.

 

He also drives a red convertible vette.

[JaySlim]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

 

If anyone is overpowered, it's Rey, as has been noted. What she was able to do to Kylo Ren with no training makes me only imagine what would happen in a duel after her training is complete. Are they setting up the villain to be the underdog? And an unlikable underdog at that? The dynamic between the two could be problematic moving forward.

 

I believe Snoke says its time to complete Ren's training as well.

 

I think the next time they meet it will be a lot more intense and he'll have with more than just a scar on his face to show for it.

[CrocHntr]

Finally saw the movie today. I really enjoyed it overall. I liked the pace, the mix of established characters and new, and it really felt like a classic Star Wars film. Yes, the various throwbacks to the original 3 did give it a reboot type feel, but I appreciate being able to make those connections, and it really appealed to my entire family (including my kids and wife's parents who have never seen a Star Wars film before).

 

A couple of thoughts:

 

Finn seemed like a throw-away character for me. Over-acting at times, and overall just not very memorable . I can't see him carrying any future movies.

 

The death of Han Solo was very anticlimactic for me. Probably because I've known that Harrison Ford always wanted his character killed off in the original trilogy. So a bigger surprise would have been to actually keep Han Solo alive, even if his importance in future films diminishes. Of course, the rest of my family thought Han's death was shocking, so this is obviously just the grumbling of a hardened fanatic

 

Now that Han is gone, where is the character chemistry / humor going to come from for future movies? Finn and Rey certainly aren't funny (and I don't think Finn has any chemistry anyway), and lord knows they can't just rely on droids and aliens (a la Jar Jar) to provide the humor. Maybe Poe gets a stronger part and adds some depth. Luke and Rey will make great protagonists, but I'm afraid future movies will sorely miss the Han Solo type chemistry that has made all the other movies great...

 

Anyway, I'm already looking forward to seeing it again.

 

 

 

 

[rjrjr]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

 

If anyone is overpowered, it's Rey, as has been noted. What she was able to do to Kylo Ren with no training makes me only imagine what would happen in a duel after her training is complete. Are they setting up the villain to be the underdog? And an unlikable underdog at that? The dynamic between the two could be problematic moving forward.

 

Kylo is going to undergo training as well. Snoke asked Hux to retrieve Kylo Ren and bring him back so he can complete his training.

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

was it Han that mentioned to Rey and Finn that "an apprentice" or "Luke's apprentice" had destroyed his Jedi School? Wondering if it may have been Rey as a child, not Kylo Ren. It would be another way to explain why she was dropped off on Jakku back in the day.

 

 

Oooo...I like this!

[RockMyAmadeus]

was it Han that mentioned to Rey and Finn that "an apprentice" or "Luke's apprentice" had destroyed his Jedi School? Wondering if it may have been Rey as a child, not Kylo Ren. It would be another way to explain why she was dropped off on Jakku back in the day.

 

No. Rey was maybe 4 years old when she was dropped off on Jakku. I can't see her destroying any other Jedi at that age.

 

Also, they showed Kylo Ren destroying Luke's Jedi Academy in the flashback scene when Rey touched the lightsaber for the first time. (The scene where Ren is surrounded by the other guys in black and there are dead bodies all over the place).

 

I have highly placed sources who have told me Jar Jar Binks is Rey's father. There's actually a cut scene where Rey, right before mind tricking the storm trooper, says "Me so forcey, justa watcha this."

 

[miraclemet]

Finn seemed like a throw-away character for me. Over-acting at times, and overall just not very memorable . I can't see him carrying any future movies.

 

 

 

you arent ascribing bad acting to the times when Finn the character was trying to act cool, or act like he knew what was going on, or act not scared right? Cause those times I think it was an intentional choice of the actor to have Finn "over act" since he was trying to be something he wasnt.

 

 

[Aces]

I just saw it.

 

I'll address some of the points brought up on the last 35 pages.

 

I did like the movie, it was basically a throw back to 3 and 4 (which is good btw).

 

The main character. A little too perfect? Yes.

Flaws make people seem more real.

 

But I had no problem with her "force powers".

 

1) Her ability to mind control a storm-trooper is like a level 1 Jedi power.

The guys are brainwashed from day one to follow orders.

 

2) In her battle again Kylo Ren he was badly wounded (shot by Chewy) so she had a handicap.

She wasn't exactly leaping from tree tops, just swinging the light saber.

 

Other than these two instances when did she have any powers (not counting visions and being able to detect emotions in people)?

 

The main plot.

OK, it was a rehash of IV.

 

The old characters.

Luke (cameo with no dialog) - jury is still out. 8 will be his story

Han and chewy - Both did a great job. The death scene was a little melodramatic but I guess that would be expected.

Leia - wow - Most disappointing part of the movie.

 

Special effects - I didn't find the 3D that impressive.

But I got the last seat in the house: Front row on the end.

I suspect that's the worst place for 3D.

 

 

[Hawkman]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

 

If anyone is overpowered, it's Rey, as has been noted. What she was able to do to Kylo Ren with no training makes me only imagine what would happen in a duel after her training is complete. Are they setting up the villain to be the underdog? And an unlikable underdog at that? The dynamic between the two could be problematic moving forward.

 

 

- rey is luke's daughter. there's no question about this. the clues were sprinkled throughout the movie: 1) when she's chilling in the desert and puts on the fighter pilot helmet for fun. it's a rebel alliance helmet, very possibly the exact same one luke wore in IV. 2) luke's lightsaber is calling to her. she's a skywalker. 3) for you guys complaining that R2 woke up at a really convenient time, think about what happened in that scene. who walked into the room for the first time? yep, rey. JJ isn't an insufficiently_thoughtful_person. his explanation that R2 just took a while to boot up or whatever is obviously a lie to protect the reveal in VIII that luke programmed R2 to run in low power mode until rey arrived. you could say that R2 was... awakened.

 

- speaking of awakening, those of you complaining that finn and rey defeated kylo ren too easily didn't watch the movie. first of all, finn-- who was a stormtrooper trained in combat-- held his own for about two minutes before nearly being killed. rey, on the other hand, eventually put ren on his back. how? she's just a random force-sensitive girl from jakku who's never been trained, right? wrong. the first scene that finn sees her, she gets in a fight with two or three grown men. before he can even get to her to help, she's used her staff or whatever it was to put both/all of them down. she's not just a random girl from jakku, guys. she's been trained. her vision in maz's basement may very well have not been a vision at all, but suppressed memories. someone took her to jakku, force-wiped her memory and left her. that someone is likely luke and he probably did it to protect her from ren and his knights, but we won't get the full story till VIII. fine, but i'm right about this.

 

- again, the movie is titled "the force awakens." things that are awakened have to first be put to sleep. if rey was only learning about the force for the first time in this movie, it would be titled "the force discovered," but it's not. the force is with rey. she's been trained. R2 in sleep mode throughout the movie is a parallel for rey in sleep mode. my favorite scene in the movie is the interrogation between ren and rey. he tries to force-pull thoughts out of her mind, but what he doesn't realize is that he's opening a door that swings both ways. suddenly the things rey is capable of start coming back to her, and she starts force-reading him. suddenly she knows who darth vader is and what the significance of that is. a random girl from jakku. come on, guys.

 

[Hawkman]

MY question would be why hasn't Luke just took this dude out a long time ago

 

 

that would drive him to the dark side of the force.

[CAHokie]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

 

If anyone is overpowered, it's Rey, as has been noted. What she was able to do to Kylo Ren with no training makes me only imagine what would happen in a duel after her training is complete. Are they setting up the villain to be the underdog? And an unlikable underdog at that? The dynamic between the two could be problematic moving forward.

 

 

- rey is luke's daughter. there's no question about this. the clues were sprinkled throughout the movie: 1) when she's chilling in the desert and puts on the fighter pilot helmet for fun. it's a rebel alliance helmet, very possibly the exact same one luke wore in IV. 2) luke's lightsaber is calling to her. she's a skywalker. 3) for you guys complaining that R2 woke up at a really convenient time, think about what happened in that scene. who walked into the room for the first time? yep, rey. JJ isn't an insufficiently_thoughtful_person. his explanation that R2 just took a while to boot up or whatever is obviously a lie to protect the reveal in VIII that luke programmed R2 to run in low power mode until rey arrived. you could say that R2 was... awakened.

 

- speaking of awakening, those of you complaining that finn and rey defeated kylo ren too easily didn't watch the movie. first of all, finn-- who was a stormtrooper trained in combat-- held his own for about two minutes before nearly being killed. rey, on the other hand, eventually put ren on his back. how? she's just a random force-sensitive girl from jakku who's never been trained, right? wrong. the first scene that finn sees her, she gets in a fight with two or three grown men. before he can even get to her to help, she's used her staff or whatever it was to put both/all of them down. she's not just a random girl from jakku, guys. she's been trained. her vision in maz's basement may very well have not been a vision at all, but suppressed memories. someone took her to jakku, force-wiped her memory and left her. that someone is likely luke and he probably did it to protect her from ren and his knights, but we won't get the full story till VIII. fine, but i'm right about this.

 

- again, the movie is titled "the force awakens." things that are awakened have to first be put to sleep. if rey was only learning about the force for the first time in this movie, it would be titled "the force discovered," but it's not. the force is with rey. she's been trained. R2 in sleep mode throughout the movie is a parallel for rey in sleep mode. my favorite scene in the movie is the interrogation between ren and rey. he tries to force-pull thoughts out of her mind, but what he doesn't realize is that he's opening a door that swings both ways. suddenly the things rey is capable of start coming back to her, and she starts force-reading him. suddenly she knows who darth vader is and what the significance of that is. a random girl from jakku. come on, guys.

 

This is how I took it as well. Nice synopsis!

[Gatchaman]

I think it's STAR WARS, particularly a STAR WARS saga film, so the antagonist going in was going to be a Force user, and I'd suspect if we were confronted with someone just more amped up than Anakin and Sheev we would all be calling foul over an easy, lazy. overpowered player

 

If anyone is overpowered, it's Rey, as has been noted. What she was able to do to Kylo Ren with no training makes me only imagine what would happen in a duel after her training is complete. Are they setting up the villain to be the underdog? And an unlikable underdog at that? The dynamic between the two could be problematic moving forward.

 

 

- rey is luke's daughter. there's no question about this. the clues were sprinkled throughout the movie: 1) when she's chilling in the desert and puts on the fighter pilot helmet for fun. it's a rebel alliance helmet, very possibly the exact same one luke wore in IV. 2) luke's lightsaber is calling to her. she's a skywalker. 3) for you guys complaining that R2 woke up at a really convenient time, think about what happened in that scene. who walked into the room for the first time? yep, rey. JJ isn't an insufficiently_thoughtful_person. his explanation that R2 just took a while to boot up or whatever is obviously a lie to protect the reveal in VIII that luke programmed R2 to run in low power mode until rey arrived. you could say that R2 was... awakened.

 

- speaking of awakening, those of you complaining that finn and rey defeated kylo ren too easily didn't watch the movie. first of all, finn-- who was a stormtrooper trained in combat-- held his own for about two minutes before nearly being killed. rey, on the other hand, eventually put ren on his back. how? she's just a random force-sensitive girl from jakku who's never been trained, right? wrong. the first scene that finn sees her, she gets in a fight with two or three grown men. before he can even get to her to help, she's used her staff or whatever it was to put both/all of them down. she's not just a random girl from jakku, guys. she's been trained. her vision in maz's basement may very well have not been a vision at all, but suppressed memories. someone took her to jakku, force-wiped her memory and left her. that someone is likely luke and he probably did it to protect her from ren and his knights, but we won't get the full story till VIII. fine, but i'm right about this.

 

- again, the movie is titled "the force awakens." things that are awakened have to first be put to sleep. if rey was only learning about the force for the first time in this movie, it would be titled "the force discovered," but it's not. the force is with rey. she's been trained. R2 in sleep mode throughout the movie is a parallel for rey in sleep mode. my favorite scene in the movie is the interrogation between ren and rey. he tries to force-pull thoughts out of her mind, but what he doesn't realize is that he's opening a door that swings both ways. suddenly the things rey is capable of start coming back to her, and she starts force-reading him. suddenly she knows who darth vader is and what the significance of that is. a random girl from jakku. come on, guys.

 

I agree.