Showcase #4 9.8 on Comic Connect - sold for 15k

[burntboy]

Can't come to grips with the blind hatred for this book. There are just tons of known restored books out there. Just look at GPA for older keys that are slabbed and the number of restored books jumps off the screen.

 

Given that, I'd be interested in where someone draws the line between what is acceptable and what is a Pariah?

 

This book seems to have had a ton of work done based on the resto notes on the slab, but when is too much?

 

DK's comment about the book being little more than a coverless copy with a reprinted cover rings true in many ways but unless one knows how much of the cover and interior have been redone, I'm just back at where do you draw the line?

 

Is the disdain due to the price it draws? What would a coverless copy with a reprinted cover be worth? What about a coverless copy with a married cover?

 

And lastly, why did the discussion focus mainly on the SC4 which sold for $15k vs. the Hulk 1 that sold for around 3X's as much. Didn't see a thread devoted to the Hulk like this one?

 

[Sqeggs]

Can't come to grips with the blind hatred for this book. There are just tons of known restored books out there. Just look at GPA for older keys that are slabbed and the number of restored books jumps off the screen.

 

Given that, I'd be interested in where someone draws the line between what is acceptable and what is a Pariah?

 

This book seems to have had a ton of work done based on the resto notes on the slab, but when is too much?

 

DK's comment about the book being little more than a coverless copy with a reprinted cover rings true in many ways but unless one knows how much of the cover and interior have been redone, I'm just back at where do you draw the line?

 

Is the disdain due to the price it draws? What would a coverless copy with a reprinted cover be worth? What about a coverless copy with a married cover?

 

And lastly, why did the discussion focus mainly on the SC4 which sold for $15k vs. the Hulk 1 that sold for around 3X's as much. Didn't see a thread devoted to the Hulk like this one?

 

Pieces were added but most of the original cover is there. The book is in the no-man's land between what is and what isn't acceptable in restoring a book. But some people are greatly exaggerating the extent of the work done.

[Mark 1]

I don't have disdain for the book. We see restoration of great works of art and they make them look brand new. Same could be said for this book.

 

I wouldn't buy it but I don't have anything against the book or the owner for buying it.

 

I do have a problem with the buyer immediately flipping it when it's probably not even in his hands yet. And, the hyperbole in his auction is a bit much about it.

 

And, the interesting thing about these 9.8 resto books is anyone can send another book to the restoration company (IGB) and have another 9.8. Let's just crank out 9.8s....we'll see how much they are worth when more and more come to market.

 

 

[burntboy]

Thanks to sgeggs and mark for their comments. I found both interesting/informative...

 

 

[VintageComics]

Harry, most people don't dislike restored books.

 

It's just that with these IGB restored books little is known about them as they are new and as which many new things that not much is known about, many people tend to focus on the negative.

[StuporMan]

I don't have disdain for the book. We see restoration of great works of art and they make them look brand new. Same could be said for this book.

 

I wouldn't buy it but I don't have anything against the book or the owner for buying it.

 

I do have a problem with the buyer immediately flipping it when it's probably not even in his hands yet. And, the hyperbole in his auction is a bit much about it.

 

And, the interesting thing about these 9.8 resto books is anyone can send another book to the restoration company (IGB) and have another 9.8. Let's just crank out 9.8s....we'll see how much they are worth when more and more come to market.

 

 

I don't think anything happened with this auction that would get people stampeding to get their comics restored. IMHO it looks like this was worth more in its original condition (whatever that was).

[Mark 1]

 

 

I don't think anything happened with this auction that would get people stampeding to get their comics restored. IMHO it looks like this was worth more in its original condition (whatever that was).

 

That's a good point.

 

It certainly didn't pay off for the SC4. The Hulk 1 on the other hand went for much more.

[Silver Surfer]

Harry, most people don't dislike restored books.

 

It's just that with these IGB restored books little is known about them as they are new and as which many new things that not much is known about, many people tend to focus on the negative.

 

Plus I don't think CGC has fully embraced the restoration techniques when it comes grading out the final product so skepticism is expected.

[sacentaur]

It's just that with these IGB restored books little is known about them as they are new and as which many new things that not much is known about, many people tend to focus on the negative.

 

Roy, you make it sound like the negativity is coming from ignorance and I'm afraid that you have it backwards.

 

For a variety of reasons, the IGB books are being seen as recreations (and in some notable cases, inaccurate recreations), not restorations.

 

Then to have the books marketed as "Better than new!" is both disingenuous and insulting, reeking of snake-oil salesmanship.

 

CGC has made the call not to legitimatize these recreations, and "many people" tend to agree (including me).

[NewWorldOrder]

It's just that with these IGB restored books little is known about them as they are new and as which many new things that not much is known about, many people tend to focus on the negative.

 

Roy, you make it sound like the negativity is coming from ignorance and I'm afraid that you have it backwards.

 

For a variety of reasons, the IGB books are being seen as recreations (and in some notable cases, inaccurate recreations), not restorations.

 

Then to have the books marketed as "Better than new!" is both disingenuous and insulting, reeking of snake-oil salesmanship.

 

CGC has made the call not to legitimatize these recreations, and "many people" tend to agree (including me).

 

Correct.

 

I have no problem with most restored comic books (besides trimming), but these Voldemort 9.8's are frankenstein epic pieces of garbage.

[NewWorldOrder]

Can't come to grips with the blind hatred for this book. There are just tons of known restored books out there. Just look at GPA for older keys that are slabbed and the number of restored books jumps off the screen.

 

Given that, I'd be interested in where someone draws the line between what is acceptable and what is a Pariah?

 

This book seems to have had a ton of work done based on the resto notes on the slab, but when is too much?

 

DK's comment about the book being little more than a coverless copy with a reprinted cover rings true in many ways but unless one knows how much of the cover and interior have been redone, I'm just back at where do you draw the line?

 

Is the disdain due to the price it draws? What would a coverless copy with a reprinted cover be worth? What about a coverless copy with a married cover?

 

And lastly, why did the discussion focus mainly on the SC4 which sold for $15k vs. the Hulk 1 that sold for around 3X's as much. Didn't see a thread devoted to the Hulk like this one?

 

Pick which one you want to discuss, both to me are worth less than an X-Force #1 in CGC .5 incomplete grade.

 

These books are a spit in the face to anyone who has a shred of comic book dignity in our hobby.

 

 

 

 

[StuporMan]

I have no problem with most restored comic books (besides trimming),

 

Same here.

 

but these Voldemort 9.8's are frankenstein epic pieces of garbage.

 

I don't get this...I think I was away from the boards for a while when the thing happened. Can you give me a taste of why they're garbage or will the thread get shut down?

 

 

[Mark 1]

I have no problem with most restored comic books (besides trimming),

 

Same here.

 

but these Voldemort 9.8's are frankenstein epic pieces of garbage.

 

I don't get this...I think I was away from the boards for a while when the thing happened. Can you give me a taste of why they're garbage or will the thread get shut down?

 

 

The main issues is CGC won't grade these books. Voldemort made the decision that they will grade them.

 

Some have strong feelings about that...

[*matterus023*]

''CGC has made the call not to legitimatize these recreations, and "many people" tend to agree (including me).''

 

This has been said in many different ways many times. I except I could of missed the public post where CGC said they would not grade these anymore.

 

Please can someone show me that post or some evidence at all to back this up. If you can't then stop droaning on about the same point with nothing to back it up and get back to talking about the more interesting side of restoration. Some on here including myself would like to learn new things. Not listen to seemingly angry people who have nothing but hatred in their hearts.

 

This thread has got out of control and shows a lack of class that some of the things said haven't been taken down.

 

 

[Gotham Kid]

I'd like to clarify a few things that Emily brought up concerning CGC's position. CGC did have a concern with several of the books submitted to us earlier this year for reasons previously posted in this thread. I gave Matt and Emily time and advice to guide them in the right direction. Up to the point we stopped receiving submissions there were issues with the work, reflected in our assigning either B or C classifications. A decision was going to be made whether to stop taking books that exhibited questionable work, but submissions ceased.

 

In most cases, CBCS gave higher grades and a professional designation. We have not seen the recent restoration outside of the CBCS holders, so I am not sure our issues with earlier work has been resolved.

 

The point of professional restoration is to return a book back to as close to its original state as possible using reversible materials. When work becomes so extensive that it becomes hard to tell what is real and what is recreated, it is impossible to accurately and fairly represent a grade to the market.

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9068016&fpart=5

 

 

[*matterus023*]

I'd like to clarify a few things that Emily brought up concerning CGC's position. CGC did have a concern with several of the books submitted to us earlier this year for reasons previously posted in this thread. I gave Matt and Emily time and advice to guide them in the right direction. Up to the point we stopped receiving submissions there were issues with the work, reflected in our assigning either B or C classifications. A decision was going to be made whether to stop taking books that exhibited questionable work, but submissions ceased.

 

In most cases, CBCS gave higher grades and a professional designation. We have not seen the recent restoration outside of the CBCS holders, so I am not sure our issues with earlier work has been resolved.

 

The point of professional restoration is to return a book back to as close to its original state as possible using reversible materials. When work becomes so extensive that it becomes hard to tell what is real and what is recreated, it is impossible to accurately and fairly represent a grade to the market.

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9068016&fpart=5

 

 

'' A decision was going to be made whether to stop taking books that exhibited questionable work, but submissions ceased. ''

 

So like I say nothing has been said about it. Easy to say oh we were just about to say no more but then they stopped using us.

 

No decision was made so people should stop going on about it. That is the business of CGC not some fools on here. Some think they are supporting CGC with their comments. Trust me people....you are coming off rather immature. Not the type of people I would want representing/defending me anyway

[Sqeggs]

I'd like to clarify a few things that Emily brought up concerning CGC's position. CGC did have a concern with several of the books submitted to us earlier this year for reasons previously posted in this thread. I gave Matt and Emily time and advice to guide them in the right direction. Up to the point we stopped receiving submissions there were issues with the work, reflected in our assigning either B or C classifications. A decision was going to be made whether to stop taking books that exhibited questionable work, but submissions ceased.

 

In most cases, CBCS gave higher grades and a professional designation. We have not seen the recent restoration outside of the CBCS holders, so I am not sure our issues with earlier work has been resolved.

 

The point of professional restoration is to return a book back to as close to its original state as possible using reversible materials. When work becomes so extensive that it becomes hard to tell what is real and what is recreated, it is impossible to accurately and fairly represent a grade to the market.

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9068016&fpart=5

 

 

Good job, Peter. That's the key post as I remember from reading that thread.

 

A couple of points:

 

1. If I'm reading Matt's comments correctly, CGC did initially grade some igb books, although they didn't give them a professional designation as CBCS has done.

 

2. Matt does not state categorically that CGC would not grade the current igb books because none have been submitted and he hasn't seen the books out of their CBCS slabs.

 

So, the statements that CGC has rejected these books appear to be incorrect, at least so far as is publicly known.

[*matterus023*]

If any people on here have bought some of IGB's work, seen it in person, felt it, smelled it, examined it I would love to hear about your personal experiences.

 

Would be great to get some feedback from someone who fits the above.

 

 

[Iceman399]

The point of professional restoration is to return a book back to as close to its original state as possible using reversible materials. When work becomes so extensive that it becomes hard to tell what is real and what is recreated, it is impossible to accurately and fairly represent a grade to the market.

 

Which is why restored books should have 2 grades. What the book is at now (9.8) and what the book was at before the work was done (3.0).

[Mark 1]

The point of professional restoration is to return a book back to as close to its original state as possible using reversible materials. When work becomes so extensive that it becomes hard to tell what is real and what is recreated, it is impossible to accurately and fairly represent a grade to the market.

 

Which is why restored books should have 2 grades. What the book is at now (9.8) and what the book was at before the work was done (3.0).

 

I really like that idea