Incredible Hulk #181 - is it *that* red-hot? 17 17

[I am not Glenda]

20 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

Yes, but does it really make that much sense when history has shown us time and time again that these movie amd media related hype books that are driven up into the stratosphere for a short period of time in almost every single case falls back down to Earth by the time the movie comes out.    

Have to disagree, I remember when the 1st Deadpool was announced ( Ryan did the mini promo). CGC 9.8 WP jumped over night from $300/400 to $800/1000+ With high grade raw's selling for as low as $50/100 in my shop one week to $300 the next. After the movie & the hype as expected it dropped, but not back down to pre movie levels but to around last years pre Covid norm of about $750/800. This tends to be the trend, look at the IM 55's sales history and numerous other books that jumped  due to "movie hype" Yes there is pre movie high but in most cases the books settle at a significant higher price then their pre movie hype number. I also suspect we will see the same trend with todays crazy hyper market, using DP as example again if pre Covid a 9.8 avg was $800 & today the book is trending at $2800/3000.....I bet it settles in at 2k when life get back to being somewhat normal for most of us, which is still a big jump from pre Covid prices, but that's just 100% speculation, if enough NEW money comes into the hobby and stays in the game who the hell know ?

[DTM700]

27 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

Yes, but does it really make that much sense when history has shown us time and time again that these movie amd media related hype books that are driven up into the stratosphere for a short period of time in almost every single case falls back down to Earth by the time the movie comes out.    

I would argue that this is not an absolute truth for every book. Quality media will help a book retain its value and following. The book might see a correction, sure, but will also create a stronger attachment with the audience.

Their are books/media however, where pump and dump is rampant. Especially since anyone can blog, tweet, post a book to oblivion for hype and FOMO.

[lou_fine]

9 minutes ago, I am not Glenda said:

45 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

Yes, but does it really make that much sense when history has shown us time and time again that these movie amd media related hype books that are driven up into the stratosphere for a short period of time in almost every single case falls back down to Earth by the time the movie comes out.    

Have to disagree, I remember when the 1st Deadpool was announced ( Ryan did the mini promo). CGC 9.8 WP jumped over night from $300/400 to $800/1000+ With high grade raw's selling for as low as $50/100 in my shop one week to $300 the next. After the movie & the hype as expected it dropped, but not back down to pre movie levels but to around last years pre Covid norm of about $750/800. This tends to be the trend, look at the IM 55's sales history and numerous other books that jumped  due to "movie hype" Yes there is pre movie high but in most cases the books settle at a significant higher price then their pre movie hype number.

Yes, you are definitely 100% correct here, as I really should have qualified my broader statement that although we definitely do see a significant drop back in prices from the peak movie hype levels, they do drop back, but never back down to their initial starting point before the initial movie hype.  

So, this kind of robust market for movie related hype books usually works out better for speculators and flippers who enjoys timing the market and can get out in time, as opposed to collectors who enjoys spending time in the market.  

[I am not Glenda]

3 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

Yes, you are definitely 100% correct here, as I really should have qualified my broader statement that although we definitely do see a significant drop back in prices from the peak movie hype levels, they do drop back, but never back down to their initial starting point before the initial movie hype.  

So, this kind of robust market for movie related hype books usually works out better for speculators and flippers who enjoys timing the market and can get out in time, as opposed to collectors who enjoys spending time in the market.  

Could not agree more or have said it better   

 

Edited March 27, 2021 by I am not Glenda

[The Man Without Beer]

1 hour ago, Pantodude said:

Oh, but you can do that with EVERY book...what's the point!    

Just a PSA for the thread....thats all. All good.

[MGsimba77]

3 hours ago, lou_fine said:

Yes, you are definitely 100% correct here, as I really should have qualified my broader statement that although we definitely do see a significant drop back in prices from the peak movie hype levels, they do drop back, but never back down to their initial starting point before the initial movie hype.  

So, this kind of robust market for movie related hype books usually works out better for speculators and flippers who enjoys timing the market and can get out in time, as opposed to collectors who enjoys spending time in the market.  

Carol Danvers? I don't remember how MSH #13 and Ms. Marvel 1 made out?

[lou_fine]

9 hours ago, MGsimba77 said:

Carol Danvers? I don't remember how MSH #13 and Ms. Marvel 1 made out?

Not sure about Ms. Marvel 1, but I imagine most likely same downward trajectory as MSH 13 and probably par for the course when it comes to hot movie hype driven books.  

For the record, it looks like the 2nd highest graded copy of MSH 13 and 1 of 7 at the  time in CGC 9.6 sold at CL for a rather astounding $31,111 back in November of 2018.  This was then eventually followed by the single highest 9.8 graded copy (i.e. Federal Hill Copy) sold once again in a CL Auction nearly 2 years later in August of 2020 for the slightly lower amount of $31,000.  This was then followed by the sale of another CGC 9.6 graded copy (now 1 of 8 in this grade) just last month for $16,450.  

So, a definite downward trend it might appear, although when it comes to the current set of crazed deep pocketed FOMO buyers who have found this marketplace of ours seemingly just this month, that last sale is probably like a lifetime ago, and any new 9.6 copy might just go for way more than $30K by now.  

Edited March 28, 2021 by lou_fine

[drotto]

It seems reasonable that prices may fall back 10% or even 20%, but I think it is unlikely to be completely erased. I see others mentioning Deadpool or Ms. Marvel, Yeah these did come off the highs, but were not completely erased.  Another difficult thing to know when a movie is released is how well it will hold up over time. Again these two films are excellent examples.  One of the reasons Deadpool has held up better is we have had two strong films, especially the first one. So the residual good, and continued viewings have helped to maintain the comics value. Ms Marvel took a much harder hit, because the movie had much more of a mixed reception, has a  lower reservoir of goodwill, and to this point has less staying power. I think this has impacted the comics value.

[Pantodude]

Perhaps.  But Ms. Marvel is a legit Disney fav (and the first movie was an indisputable blockbuster), and there will definitely be at least another movie, and she will definitely be the badass of that movie (if not the MCU going forward).   That alone suggests its relative underperformance compared to other keys in 9.8 is unwarranted.  But even if, in general, the book in most grades is less of a fan fav for now, the book in a 9.8 is legit undervalued because 9.8s make up only 5.3% of the many universal slabs.   Compare with every other book of a character of that much current prominence with 9.8 populations (percentage of total-wise) like that.  Shazam #1 is in the same boat of seemingly being undervalued despite his proven popularity with children and thus [EDITED: Warner Bros], and also being on WB's concrete near-term movie plans.   Both seem like pricing quirks destined to be corrected (i.e., by catching up) sooner or later.     

Edited March 28, 2021 by Pantodude

[ADAMANTIUM]

13 minutes ago, Pantodude said:

Perhaps.  But Ms. Marvel is a legit Disney fav (and the first movie was an indisputable blockbuster), and there will definitely be at least another movie, and she will definitely be the badass of that movie (if not the MCU going forward).   That alone suggests its relative underperformance compared to other keys in 9.8 is unwarranted.  But even if, in general, the book in most grades is less of a fan fav for now, the book in a 9.8 is legit undervalued because 9.8s make up only 5.3% of the many universal slabs.   Compare with every other book of a character of that much current prominence with 9.8 populations (percentage of total-wise) like that.  Shazam #1 is in the same boat of seemingly being undervalued despite his proven popularity with children and thus Disney, and also being on Disney's concrete near-term movie plans.   Both seem like pricing quirks destined to be corrected (i.e., by catching up) sooner or later.     

the 6's have it

[Pantodude]

6 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

the 6's have it

Hey there.  The above snippet is all I see of your post except for that huge image that got superimposed (blocking the rest of your text)!  

Edited March 28, 2021 by Pantodude

[ADAMANTIUM]

3 minutes ago, Pantodude said:

9 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

the 6's have it

Hey there.  The above snippet is all I see of your post except for that huge image that got superimposed (blocking the rest of your text)!  

Edited 2 minutes ago by Pantodude

 

9 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

the 6's have it

 I was just remarking about your #666 post count of the above post  it's just for fun  

 

[Pantodude]

3 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

 

 I was just remarking about your #666 post count of the above post  it's just for fun  

 

HAHA!   I didn't realize!  That is COOOOOOL!   But wait...i want to post more, eventually....

Edited March 28, 2021 by Pantodude

[ADAMANTIUM]

1 minute ago, Pantodude said:

HAHA!   I didn't realize!  That is COOOOOOL!   

sure  it differs, if I'm on my tablet I can zoom into the post count easier than laptop  no harm no foul  it's an easy miss...

[lou_fine]

8 hours ago, drotto said:

It seems reasonable that prices may fall back 10% or even 20%, but I think it is unlikely to be completely erased.

I would definitely agree with you about gains not being completely erased because I have not seen a single example of this to date so far.  

On the other hand, I believe some of the drops from their peaks have been by clearly more than 10% and quite likely by even more than 20%.  MSH 13 being the perfect example and possibly also some of the Guardians of the Galaxy related books.  From a GA point of view, I have also heard of drops for More Fun 73 along with the key Wonder Woman issues.  

From a long time collectors point of view though, time tends to heal everything and this definitely includes purchasing mistakes whether they be from over paying for them, over grading, or hidden slight restoration.    

[drotto]

3 minutes ago, lou_fine said:

I would definitely agree with you about gains not being completely erased because I have not seen a single example of this to date so far.  

On the other hand, I believe some of the drops from their peaks have been by clearly more than 10% and quite likely by even more than 20%.  MSH 13 being the perfect example and possibly also some of the Guardians of the Galaxy related books.  From a GA point of view, I have also heard of drops for More Fun 73 along with the key Wonder Woman issues.  

From a long time collectors point of view though, time tends to heal everything and this definitely includes purchasing mistakes whether they be from over paying for them, over grading, or hidden slight restoration.    

My first lesson in collecting was buy only what you can afford, and expect to get stuck with it.

[lou_fine]

1 minute ago, drotto said:

My first lesson in collecting was buy only what you can afford, and expect to get stuck with it.

My lesson in collecting comic books is to buy what you like and enjoy as you are most likely going to be stuck holding it, and if it happens to go up in value, that's just an extra bonus.  

And needless to say, the exact reason why I handed that TMNT 1 back to the LCS owner as fast as I could after he said that he could order me a copy direct from the publisher for only $300.  He must have been out of his mind if he thought I was looney enough to pay him $300 for a fugly doggy doo doo looking POS book that I wouldn't even want for $3, let along 300 big ones.       

[makeminemarvel]

$7,000 for a 6.5 the other day.  OW-W.  Just unbelievable.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Incredible-Hulk-181-CGC-6-5-/133699112363?epid=23035915252&hash=item1f21168dab%3Ag%3AZx8AAOSwjuZgVVnv&nma=true&si=B2xV5%2Fj5xb%2FMboMhcr2MZKclVas%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

The seller has 3 others listed currently.  

Edited March 29, 2021 by makeminemarvel

[csaag]

15 minutes ago, makeminemarvel said:

$7,000 for a 6.5 the other day.  OW-W.  Just unbelievable.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Incredible-Hulk-181-CGC-6-5-/133699112363?epid=23035915252&hash=item1f21168dab%3Ag%3AZx8AAOSwjuZgVVnv&nma=true&si=B2xV5%2Fj5xb%2FMboMhcr2MZKclVas%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

The seller has 3 others listed currently.  

when I go to eBay sold listings, the 6.5 Hulk 181 has 7,999 crossed out and indicates best off accepted.

Tried listing the page source and searching for "TaxEx" to see the accepted price but nothing found.

[Hulksdaddy1]

12 minutes ago, csaag said:

when I go to eBay sold listings, the 6.5 Hulk 181 has 7,999 crossed out and indicates best off accepted.

Tried listing the page source and searching for "TaxEx" to see the accepted price but nothing found.

Works for me. $7000.