They're Still Out There! 22 22

[Randall Dowling]

3 hours ago, sfcityduck said:

Clearly a manufacturing "crack" intentionally designed to enhance the artwork.  Nothing to see here.  Move along.

Upon closer inspection, this post is much funnier than I initially thought.  

And yeah, another example of why only a fool would take some of these books out of their current slabs.

[jimbo_7071]

2 hours ago, Randall Dowling said:

Upon closer inspection, this post is much funnier than I initially thought.  

And yeah, another example of why only a fool would take some of these books out of their current slabs.

I actually wanted to buy a Promise Collection book—not a particular book, just any book that fit my collection—so that I could have an example. I tried to find one that I agreed with the grading on. I couldn't find a single book that didn't appear to be badly over-graded.

Edited June 17, 2021 by jimbo_7071

[Mmehdy]

I just thru the entire Promise collection and here are my Best  picks for books for  5K or less plus BP.

1-Captain Flight #4 9.4...the secret is out on this book at 5K, but that not withstanding a great and classic and rare and top graded copy...a winner...all the way.

2-Subby #28 what a great great cover, 9.2 newstand  new at 2.8K...I am very surprised it is not higher.

3- Big All American#1. solid 8.5..I purchased the SF copy waaaayyyy back then...the "wow" factor...way below guide...could be the sleeper of the auction.

4-Marvel Tales #94 in unheard of 9.2..another classic cover at 2.8K

5 Captain Flight #11 9.0 one of the all time greatest covers still at 5K..watch this one

6- All Winners #19 I love the cover and the contents on this book a true classic from Fantasy Masterpieces where I first read it, 9.0 and still at 5K.

 My thoughts on some great books. A lot of money was spend today on Ha.com...probably a record for one day...$9,283,050... that must of taken out some of the potential buyers with those numbers.

 

Edited June 17, 2021 by Mmehdy

[Robot Man]

How many of you will be joining me in front of the window tomorrow?

[Tri-Color Brian]

9 hours ago, sfcityduck said:

 

 

 

 

 

To reiterate my prediction:  $2.74M+ (not shocked if over $3M) for this initial lot.  This will top out the average price per issue for the Billy Wright books, despite the absence of any real mega-keys.  

BUT, let's put that into perspective by asking the question no one is asking yet:  Would you rather have the 8.5 Action 1 or all these Promise books in this first lot?

I'd take the Action 1 also, because it would be less books to restore...

Edited June 18, 2021 by Tri-ColorBrian

[tth2]

7 hours ago, Pantodude said:

Holy Ghosts!  MS5 in 9.8 just went for $264K!  

We've just had our Michael Jordan $728k moment.

[Pantodude]

2 minutes ago, tth2 said:

We've just had our Michael Jordan $728k moment.

Except that is what an MS5 in 9.8 should go for in light what GSXM1 in 9.8 went for.   Like I mentioned elsewhere, at least there is some rationality (and thus comfort) in that.   

[tth2]

11 minutes ago, Pantodude said:

15 minutes ago, tth2 said:

We've just had our Michael Jordan $728k moment.

Except that is what an MS5 in 9.8 should go for in light what GSXM1 in 9.8 went for.   Like I mentioned elsewhere, at least there is some rationality (and thus comfort) in that.   

I feel like we're in 2008, and valuations are now built on derivatives of derivatives.  

[Pantodude]

41 minutes ago, tth2 said:

I feel like we're in 2008, and valuations are now built on derivatives of derivatives.  

It's more like relative value, which works in both directions, unlike derivatives I think.  Book A informs as to Book B, but Book B also informs at to Book A.  Seems pretty rational to me, since no book is sold in a vacuum.    

Edited June 18, 2021 by Pantodude

[jimbo_7071]

17 minutes ago, Pantodude said:

It's more like relative value, which works in both directions, unlike derivatives I think.  Book A informs as to Book B, but Book B also informs at to Book A.  Seems pretty rational to me, since no book is sold in a vacuum.    

We're still finding original-owner Golden Age collections. How many original-owner Bronze Age collections are still out there? It's a matter of time before there are 100 MS5s in 9.8 in the census.

[delekkerste]

1 hour ago, tth2 said:

We've just had our Michael Jordan $728k moment.

[sfcityduck]

1 hour ago, Pantodude said:

Except that is what an MS5 in 9.8 should go for in light what GSXM1 in 9.8 went for.   Like I mentioned elsewhere, at least there is some rationality (and thus comfort) in that.   

WTF?  Ghost Rider is greater than or = to New X-Men?  You and I live in different universes.  The two books can't be compared to one another on any basis.  The first appearance of Ghost Rider is more equivalent to the first appearance of Son of Satan or Shang Chi than anything.  GSXM 1 is the foundation book for one of the greatest and most influential character franchises of all time, certainly of the bronze, copper, and modern eras (until Marvel tried to embrace Inhumans).  Ghost Rider was an attempt to capitalize on Easy Rider/Hells Angel biker culture, sort of like blackploitation or the attempts to cash in on the popularity of Bruce Lee movies or Disco, which failed by the early 80s (and failed again on revival(s)).  Ghost Rider was made into a movie which was critically panned but made a modest amount of money, earning an even worse sequel.  X-Men, in contrast, led to 13 major motion pictures (the fifth highest grossing film series), all of which made money and some of which were quite good.  I see no comparison between MS 5 and GSXM 1.  Not sure why anyone wants MS 5.  I can name 100+ Marvel books I'd rather have and would pay more money for, and many other Bronze/Copper books which would rate higher with me.  This auction result is going to end up in the crazy town file index.  

But, hey, to each his own.

For the $264K, I'd rather have purchased all of these items:

* Whiz 1 3.0 (white) $78K - Better movie, more pop culture and historical relevance, harder book to find, presented really well, and no flood going to hit the market to drive down prices;

* Archies Madhouse original art for first Sabrina the Teenage Witch appearance $114K - tough call, who has more pop culture relevance?  I dunno, but how many SA first appearance story original art groups can you get?

* The 3 foot by 2 foot Charlie Brown baseball art $19K - great to put up on a wall, huge piece, rare Schulz presentation piece which captures the essence of a pop culture icon.

* ShockSS 6 $26.4K - A much better 9.8 I think;

* Winsor McCay Dream of the Rarebit Fiend drug trip sunday $26.4K - one of the greatest and most creative artists ever at the height of his powers in 1904.

And I would have $1,200 left over to buy my friends a really nice dinner to celebrate all the great acquisitions! 

 

Edited June 18, 2021 by sfcityduck

[Scrooge]

1 minute ago, sfcityduck said:

Not sure why anyone wants MS 5. 

I thought the "What I collect is good / What you collect is trash" theme was strictly reserved to Comics General 

[sfcityduck]

2 minutes ago, Scrooge said:

I thought the "What I collect is good / What you collect is trash" theme was strictly reserved to Comics General 

Everyone is entitled to their preferences.  No belittling intended.  But, this auction result is so inexplicable to me that I feel like Wonko the Sane in Douglas Adam's "So Long and Thanks For All the Fish" who decides the world is crazy when he  picks up a box of toothpicks and realizes that it has a paragraph of instructions on how to use them.  

[LordRahl]

7 minutes ago, sfcityduck said:

WTF?  Ghost Rider is greater than or = to New X-Men?  You and I live in different universes.  The two books can't be compared to one another on any basis.  The first appearance of Ghost Rider is more equivalent to the first appearance of Son of Satan or Shang Chi than anything.  GSXM 1 is the foundation book for one of the greatest and most influential character franchises of all time, certainly of the bronze, copper, and modern eras (until Marvel tried to embrace Inhumans).  Ghost Rider was an attempt to capitalize on Easy Rider/Hells Angel biker culture, sort of like blackploitation or the attempts to cash in on the popularity of Bruce Lee movies or Disco, which failed by the early 80s (and failed again on revival(s)).  Ghost Rider was made into a movie which was critically panned but made a modest amount of money, earning an even worse sequel.  X-Men, in contrast, led to 13 major motion pictures (the fifth highest grossing film series), all of which made money and some of which were quite good.  I see no comparison between MS 5 and GSXM 1.  Not sure why anyone wants MS 5.  I can name 100+ Marvel books I'd rather have and would pay more money for, and many other Bronze/Copper books which would rate higher with me.  This auction result is going to end up in the crazy town file index.  

But, hey, to each his own.

For the $264K, I'd rather have purchased all of these items:

* Whiz 1 3.0 (white) $78K - Better movie, more pop culture and historical relevance, harder book to find, presented really well, and no flood going to hit the market to drive down prices;

* Archies Madhouse original art for first Sabrina the Teenage Witch appearance $114K - tough call, who has more pop culture relevance?  I dunno, but how many SA first appearance story original art groups can you get?

* The 3 foot by 2 foot Charlie Brown baseball art $19K - great to put up on a wall, huge piece, rare Schulz presentation piece which captures the essence of a pop culture icon.

* ShockSS 6 $26.4K - A much better 9.8 I think;

* Winsor McCay Dream of the Rarebit Fiend drug trip sunday $26.4K - one of the greatest and most creative artists ever at the height of his powers in 1904.

And I would have $1,200 left over to buy my friends a really nice dinner to celebrate all the great acquisitions! 

 

Pretty sure he's factoring in MS5's relative scarcity to GSX1. Only 5 in 9.8 while GSX1 has many more and is much easier to obtain in that grade. I don't think anyone can argue the importance of the books much as you point out as GSX1 is on a whole different planet than MS5 in terms of historical importance. But if you have to have a 9.8 of MS5 you may be waiting a few years to get one whereas a GSX1 can be had any given month if you have the cash.

[Pantodude]

37 minutes ago, jimbo_7071 said:

We're still finding original-owner Golden Age collections. How many original-owner Bronze Age collections are still out there? It's a matter of time before there are 100 MS5s in 9.8 in the census.

Yeah, maybe, but those OOs are too young and no one wants to wait 30 years for that stuff!      Deep pockets are less patient than mere mortals.  Anyway, if and when that happens, relative value should set things right, presumably in the other direction (unless those same OO BA collections include yet additional GSXM1s in 9.8!  ).   

Edited June 18, 2021 by Pantodude

[LordRahl]

24 minutes ago, jimbo_7071 said:

We're still finding original-owner Golden Age collections. How many original-owner Bronze Age collections are still out there? It's a matter of time before there are 100 MS5s in 9.8 in the census.

Well perhaps it is a matter of time, but it will not be in our lifetimes. CGC has been around for 20 years and there are 5 on the census. You think another 95 will magically appear in the next 10-20 years? Unrealistic.

[buttock]

1 hour ago, tth2 said:

I feel like we're in 2008, and valuations are now built on derivatives of derivatives.  

If f'(GSX1) = $70K, then f''(MS5) = $264K.  I think I remember that from Calc 2.  But I can't remember how to integrate.  

[october]

8 minutes ago, LordRahl said:

Pretty sure he's factoring in MS5's relative scarcity to GSX1. Only 5 in 9.8 while GSX1 has many more and is much easier to obtain in that grade. I don't think anyone can argue the importance of the books much as you point out as GSX1 is on a whole different planet than MS5 in terms of historical importance. But if you have to have a 9.8 of MS5 you may be waiting a few years to get one whereas a GSX1 can be had any given month if you have the cash.

This. I personally slabbed two GSXM 1 9.8's, raw copies I bought in collections...which was not a big deal.. Never came close to a MS5 in that shape. Maybe a 9.2? Completely different level of toughness. 

[Pantodude]

23 minutes ago, sfcityduck said:

WTF?  Ghost Rider is greater than or = to New X-Men?  You and I live in different universes.

Or maybe you just misread my post before getting a bit unhinged there?    Anyway, what they said.  Relative scarcity could explain the result, since the difference in 9.8 availability is sooooo extreme.  That's all.    And BTW, it's only 4 MS5s in 9.8.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Pantodude