A super find! 6 6

[2Sunny]

On 10/29/2021 at 1:10 AM, Juno Beach said:

You sound much older than 55

Hah, too funny.  I have been accused of seeming older than I am since I was in Fifth Grade.  It's my curse for sure.  I'm on FB so you can have a long gander at my life if you're bored

Edited October 29, 2021 by Joe Peck

[kav]

On 10/28/2021 at 10:09 PM, Joe Peck said:

Ahhh, this is part of the learning.  If you look at threads on this board you will find that people have actually gone to the length of buying a graded book from MyComicBookShop and then sending it back to them and they graded it down one level from a 7.0 to a 6.0 and this hasn't just been documented once, but so many times that some people on this board decided to stop using them.  Point here is not to put down that site as they provide excellent books and service, and I have purchased quite a few books from them.  The point is that Grading is HIGHLY subjective in this hobby, but we have all come to agree with CGC's system and from what I can tell by buying 8's and 7's that were CGC'd and comparing that to 8's and 7's from MyComicBookShop I think I learned a great deal.

 

As to this particular book I feel quite strongly that people are overlooking two simple facts. One: the primary defect showing is spine roll.  Pressing will eliminate most of that.  Second:  Now tonight on closer inspection I realize there is zero foxing.  Any perceived foxing is a product of the photo and not found in real life.  There is however a major defect I didn't show in the photo on the back cover and that may be the grading undoing of this book if it doesn't come off in cleaning as it is a 1/4 inch ink smudge on the back.  But, I am very eager to learn a) if it can be cleaned or b) how CGC grades such a smudge.

So show me one of those books that MCS overgraded.  My experience is MCS undergrades significantly from CGC, and this has been reported many times on the boards.  Your book has significant cover browning, and the cover is made of stronger paper than the pages, and also has a coating.  Thats the main defect.  I would imagine inside pages could also be browning but I would have to see them.

[2Sunny]

On 10/29/2021 at 1:23 AM, kav said:

So show me one of those books that MCS overgraded.  My experience is MCS undergrades significantly from CGC, and this has been reported many times on the boards.  Your book has significant cover browning, and the cover is made of stronger paper than the pages, and also has a coating.  Thats the main defect.  I would imagine inside pages could also be browning but I would have to see them.

I'm afraid the internet is playing tricks on communication here.  It is my contention that MCS undergrades significantly as you say.  I was not making the counter argument at all, but the relative grading is less important than the fact that, and this is my newbie opinion that may well be wrong, but I believe I have learned from my very limited sample that CGC hues much closer to the rules outlined in the Overstreet Book in terms of number of flaws and the deduction taken for those flaws.

 

As to the color of the cover, I believe it is original.  Look at the 9.4 available today on Ebay.  The cover is not white. It is a creamy tan.  I could be mistaken on this, but I have no other white covers that have "browned" so I don't think that is likely.  Again, I could be wrong.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/114829330502?hash=item1abc5c8846:g:aYUAAOSwf~tgsY7A

Edited October 29, 2021 by Joe Peck

[kav]

On 10/28/2021 at 10:35 PM, Joe Peck said:

I'm afraid the internet is playing tricks on communication here.  It is my contention that MCS undergrades significantly as you say.  I was not making the counter argument at all, but the relative grading is less important than the fact that, and this is my newbie opinion that may well be wrong, but I believe I have learned from my very limited sample that CGC hues much closer to the rules outlined in the Overstreet Book in terms of number of flaws and the deduction taken for those flaws.

 

As to the color of the cover, I believe it is original.  Look at the 9.4 available today on Ebay.  The cover is not white. It is a creamy tan.  I could be mistaken on this, but I have no other white covers that have "browned" so I don't think that is likely.  Again, I could be wrong.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/114829330502?hash=item1abc5c8846:g:aYUAAOSwf~tgsY7A

yes I misunderstood your comment-I was just remembering your initial comment:
"In the two weeks since pulling my box down I have bought about 40 comics online from MyComicShop and Ebay.  Some CGC, most raw and all in the range of 7.0 and up.  Using those graded copies to support my understanding of grading as well as the Overstreet Book I can tell you for 100% certain this copy is a 7.5 at a minimum after a clean and press".  which suggest they overgrade.  And stating the book is a 7.5 I seriously doubt MCS would give it that grade.
as far as other books-they are white.  They did not come off the press with browning:

[2Sunny]

Here's a photo of the pages.  What are your thoughts?

[2Sunny]

Look at the A in Capt's head and then look at the cover.  I do not believe the A would be white and the cover brown if this was an aging issue.  I think the pictures you posted may suffer from repeated internet and software automated adjustments. It is my contention that the cover was a creamy white/tan.  Perhaps there are printing differences as well.  Again . . . I could be wrong.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Joe Peck

[greggy]

@kav

@BlowUpTheMoon

[zzutak]

On 10/28/2021 at 11:40 AM, Joe Peck said:

$100 for a grading lesson is worth it to me.

My schedule is pretty open through the end of the year. 

[shadroch]

On 10/28/2021 at 10:50 PM, Joe Peck said:

Here's a photo of the pages.  What are your thoughts?

 

I'm going to guess that you are unaware that those cards were printed wrong and recalled.They are utterly useless.  They were a great idea but misprinted. Did you notice there is no cream color on your card?

Edited October 29, 2021 by shadroch

[shadroch]

I wish I could say I was surprised Gemstone is still selling this garbage twenty years after admitting they were misprinted and even Overstreet said they were not up to contemporary standards but I guess there are always unsuspecting newcomers that unknowingly will waste their money on things. 

[thehumantorch]

On 10/27/2021 at 8:52 PM, Joe Peck said:

I'm not getting rich or anything of that nature, but I pulled out a box of comics that I've been keeping for more than 40 years, and I was disappointed to realize that the majority of my holdings are 7 and below, BUT just now I found a Captain America 154 which is a "Key" AND it MIGHT make a 9+.  I'm tickled pink!!!  Definitely will send this in to CGC in my second round, and no intention of selling. but I''m just happy to have something decent in my collection.  It does have spine roll, but I know a good press and clean will solve that!

Joe, cleaning and pressing will help this book but it has tears at the staples and other unimprovable defects.  Sorry, but it will never be a 9.0 or better.

[MyNameIsLegion]

@Joe Peck it's seems pretty obvious you are getting some enjoyment out of using your submissions to CGC as an academic pursuit to dial in your grading skills and I commend that. What should not be overlooked, and this may be part of your reasoning as well: If you send enough books in with a range of conditions, paper quality and specific defects, you are building your own grading reference library.  I bought a store collection once that had random slabs of non-key books from 2.0 to 9.8. At first I was like WTF is this guy doing wasting money slabbing these books? But as a store owner the guy wanted to get a feel for what CGC's grading tendencies were so he could better estimate grades of books he might submit in the future or how to sell raws at the appropriate price and grade. Hell, write it off as a business expense.  

CGC has their quirks and biases- you will find the older and rarer the book, the more forgiving they are of certain defects that would categorically be downgraded on a modern book. Conversely, they will punish you on staple rust, which is largely a non-issue for moderns. Have fun with your grading exercise, and if you need tips on how to remove a comic from a slab, there are youtube videos for that.  You want to do that carefully. Best of luck to you.  

[universal soldier]

On 10/29/2021 at 12:56 AM, Joe Peck said:

Looks like my first test will get done pretty quick.  I sent a box of 10 comics (that I intend to sell) in last week and they are already opened and being scheduled for grading.  Here's my guess for each:

Action Comics 261 - 4.0

Action Comics 263 - 4.5

Adventure Comics 260 - 5.5

Brave And Bold 36 - 6.0

Brave and Bold 44 - 6.5

Detective Comics 272 - 3.5

Detective Comics 277 - 5.0

Detective Comics 278 - 4.0

Justice League 5 - 4.0

Justice League 13 - 5.5

 

Please post the results once you get them back (hopefully before 2023...)

[2Sunny]

I sent it in today.  We'll see

 

 

[2Sunny]

On 10/29/2021 at 6:20 PM, MyNameIsLegion said:

@Joe Peck it's seems pretty obvious you are getting some enjoyment out of using your submissions to CGC as an academic pursuit to dial in your grading skills and I commend that. What should not be overlooked, and this may be part of your reasoning as well: If you send enough books in with a range of conditions, paper quality and specific defects, you are building your own grading reference library.  I bought a store collection once that had random slabs of non-key books from 2.0 to 9.8. At first I was like WTF is this guy doing wasting money slabbing these books? But as a store owner the guy wanted to get a feel for what CGC's grading tendencies were so he could better estimate grades of books he might submit in the future or how to sell raws at the appropriate price and grade. Hell, write it off as a business expense.  

CGC has their quirks and biases- you will find the older and rarer the book, the more forgiving they are of certain defects that would categorically be downgraded on a modern book. Conversely, they will punish you on staple rust, which is largely a non-issue for moderns. Have fun with your grading exercise, and if you need tips on how to remove a comic from a slab, there are youtube videos for that.  You want to do that carefully. Best of luck to you.  

Awesome post!   Thank you.  Advice taken for sure.

[Park]

I’d delete/alter your address.

Leave the cc info but ixnay the address.

[2Sunny]

On 10/29/2021 at 10:17 AM, shadroch said:

I wish I could say I was surprised Gemstone is still selling this garbage twenty years after admitting they were misprinted and even Overstreet said they were not up to contemporary standards but I guess there are always unsuspecting newcomers that unknowingly will waste their money on things. 

It was $2 and really I see now it's not "current", but truth is it gives one a relative sense of whiteness with no trouble.  Clearly hobbiests wanted more definition, but that was a really good start and one can discern an opinion of the page color with little trouble without a "cream" reference. 

[2Sunny]

On 10/29/2021 at 10:19 PM, Park said:

I’d delete/alter your address.

Leave the cc info but ixnay the address.

Yeah, I'm the anti-privacy non-freak.  Really I could care less.  In the old days we had these thing called telephone books and that was published and handed out to the whole town, and it published names, phone numbers, and addresses.  Today if you wanted to find Joe Peck you could get my driving record, tax records, and much more with little trouble.   Heck, just go to FB and it's all there as well.  If or when Big Brother goes after me, there won't be a darn thing I can do so for now I will live life without fear.  I walk my dogs in the woods everyday I'm home, but none of my neighbors do.  Why?  They are afraid of getting bitten by ticks and getting Lyme Disease.  I had Lyme Disease in 1995.  I will walk my dogs in the woods until I can't.

Edited October 30, 2021 by Joe Peck

[Park]

On 10/29/2021 at 7:24 PM, Joe Peck said:

Yeah, I'm the anti-privacy non-freak.  Really I could care less.  In the old days we had these thing called telephone books and that was published and handed out to the whole town, and it published names, phone numbers, and addresses.  Today if you wanted to find Joe Peck you could get my driving record, tax records, and much more with little trouble.   Heck, just go to FB and it's all there as well.  If or when Big Brother goes after me, there won't be a darn thing I can do so for now I will live life without fear.  I walk my dogs in the woods everyday I'm home, but none of my neighbors do.  Why?  They are afraid of getting bitten by ticks and getting Lyme Disease.  I had Lyme Disease in 1995.  I will walk my dogs in the woods until I can't.

I hope you like magazines!!

[shadroch]

On 10/29/2021 at 7:21 PM, Joe Peck said:

It was $2 and really I see now it's not "current", but truth is it gives one a relative sense of whiteness with no trouble.  Clearly hobbiests wanted more definition, but that was a really good start and one can discern an opinion of the page color with little trouble without a "cream" reference. 

No, it doesn't. The card was misprinted. What is labeled as white was wrong, as is every other designation.  It is worthless. Worth than worthless if you think it is accurate.