CGC- Explain how Black Flag unreleased books already have identical census and only 10s? 3 3

[speedcake]

Don't buy them. This is the easiest problem to solve.

Just don't buy them.

[Dr. Balls]

On 8/12/2022 at 5:49 AM, shadroch said:

I expect nothing from them and they still disappoint me. I stopped sending them books years ago, but bought and sold their product.  As of this moment, I'm reevaluating  my holdings.   The fish rots from the head down.

I'm pretty much here. Since I've come back into the fold, I am stunned by the TATs - when I left, people were complaining about 45 day TAT on Economy Tiers. Now, with the whole selling grades fiasco - I don't think I'll ever spend a dime on a CGC graded modern. Which is easy to say, because I'm not superhot on Moderns anyway. But if the mentality continues (and it will), it will end up affecting other eras.

I heard about the insanity around graded bronze age stuff during the pandemic. This whole issue could be the tip of the iceberg if people start digging more. Encapsulated comic books are a related cousin to Fine Art: Authenticated, tamper-proof pieces of pop culture that can be considered "alternative investments". The Fine Art business is rife with sketchy, scammy, money-laundering dirtbags - you think adding some Crypto and the overzealous nature of comic book collectors wouldn't turn a good company bad?

This scenario is the first very high profile warning sign of things to come. Like Janet has said, people have been talking about it for years, and they have - I remember hearing it. But this is a big bust that everyone can see - when you end up being this sloppy that your mistakes are this public, it's generally a sign that it's been going on for awhile.

[jaybuck43]

On 8/12/2022 at 12:14 PM, Dr. Balls said:

I'm pretty much here. Since I've come back into the fold, I am stunned by the TATs - when I left, people were complaining about 45 day TAT on Economy Tiers. Now, with the whole selling grades fiasco - I don't think I'll ever spend a dime on a CGC graded modern. Which is easy to say, because I'm not superhot on Moderns anyway. But if the mentality continues (and it will), it will end up affecting other eras.

I heard about the insanity around graded bronze age stuff during the pandemic. This whole issue could be the tip of the iceberg if people start digging more. Encapsulated comic books are a related cousin to Fine Art: Authenticated, tamper-proof pieces of pop culture that can be considered "alternative investments". The Fine Art business is rife with sketchy, scammy, money-laundering dirtbags - you think adding some Crypto and the overzealous nature of comic book collectors wouldn't turn a good company bad?

This scenario is the first very high profile warning sign of things to come. Like Janet has said, people have been talking about it for years, and they have - I remember hearing it. But this is a big bust that everyone can see - when you end up being this sloppy that your mistakes are this public, it's generally a sign that it's been going on for awhile.

Here's the thing though... The FBI brought down the sports memorabilia business about 20 years ago.  Bill Huges ADMITTED PSA knew the t-206 was trimmed when they graded it.  Mastro himself admitted he altered the card.  Goldin was involved in faking signatures and selling them etc.  Yet at the national two weeks ago, the place was packed, PSA had a line down the aisle, Goldin was there etc.  People don't care, a scandal happens, and then we move on.  It's all about the $$$

[Dr. Balls]

On 8/12/2022 at 10:22 AM, jaybuck43 said:

Here's the thing though... The FBI brought down the sports memorabilia business about 20 years ago.  Bill Huges ADMITTED PSA knew the t-206 was trimmed when they graded it.  Mastro himself admitted he altered the card.  Goldin was involved in faking signatures and selling them etc.  Yet at the national two weeks ago, the place was packed, PSA had a line down the aisle, Goldin was there etc.  People don't care, a scandal happens, and then we move on.  It's all about the $$$

You are right. People don't care. The dirtbags that get caught serve some time and the guys around them get a little poo splattered on them. Couple years later, it's like it never happened. And that's likely what's going on at CGC. And it means nothing to me, it's my daily entertainment. My collection doesn't hinge on CGC. I enjoyed being a believer in the brand, but this episode is pretty damning. I'll keep my CGC books, and I'll buy CGC books, but thinking that they are higher quality, more accurately graded or more thorough than CBCS or PGX is out the window at this point.

Edited August 12, 2022 by Dr. Balls

[october]

On 8/12/2022 at 11:22 AM, jaybuck43 said:

Here's the thing though... The FBI brought down the sports memorabilia business about 20 years ago.  Bill Huges ADMITTED PSA knew the t-206 was trimmed when they graded it.  Mastro himself admitted he altered the card.  Goldin was involved in faking signatures and selling them etc.  Yet at the national two weeks ago, the place was packed, PSA had a line down the aisle, Goldin was there etc.  People don't care, a scandal happens, and then we move on.  It's all about the $$$

The high profile scandals in cards are unreal. I just heard that BBCE authenticated a resealed 86/87 Fleer box that was ripped live by "influencers". This on top of the high profile Pokemon box that was faked. That hobby is infested with lowlifes, scammers and thieves. JE and Danny writ large. 

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1529065

Edited August 12, 2022 by october

[jcjames]

On 8/12/2022 at 4:49 AM, shadroch said:

So the company that assigned fake grades to invisable comics now appears to be selling grades to fake comics. 

I often say that if you lower your expectations enough, CGC will eventually meet your standards.

I expect nothing from them and they still disappoint me. I stopped sending them books years ago, but bought and sold their product.  As of this moment, I'm reevaluating  my holdings.   The fish rots from the head down.

[BlowUpTheMoon]

On 8/12/2022 at 7:19 AM, Ryan. said:

I'll be at the Boston show today. 

Start a live Boston Comic-Con thread.  Keep us updated. 

[BlowUpTheMoon]

On 8/11/2022 at 6:32 PM, Gatsby77 said:

Is it possible to do 9.9 pre-screens?

Nope. Only a 9.8 or less pre-screen. 

[ttfitz]

On 8/11/2022 at 5:00 PM, Bird said:

1, 3, 6 isn't the fibonacci sequence...maybe cgc calls it the fistomoney sequence...the rest of us just get the fistyo'self sequence

Props for getting your catchphrase in there.

[davidpg]

An official CGC response has been given in the main thread.

[DavidTheDavid]

On 8/12/2022 at 6:19 AM, Ryan. said:

I'll be at the Boston show today. If anyone wants to discuss life, philosophy and the meaning of acetate in today's society, come find me. I'll be the one in a t-shirt and wearing a backpack. Can't miss me.

Ah, I wish I was there. I want czarface swag.

[Ed Hanes]

With the amount of volume that CGC does with everyone else ..all of us regular collectors, regular sellers and signature collectors...seems any grading/encapsulation of acetate covers amounts to a sand pebble on Venice beach with regard to volume...I am confused as to all of this hype over possible corruption within CGC when the amount of possible profit is so miniscule...don't we get enough of this in the news?

[Phill the Governor]

@CGC Mike This thread needs a response from CGC.

[electricprune]

On 8/12/2022 at 12:57 PM, BlowUpTheMoon said:

Nope. Only a 9.8 or less pre-screen. 

This might be an interesting topic all by itself.

[Iconic1s]

On 8/11/2022 at 3:43 PM, MattTheDuck said:

I wonder if we aren't heading toward a market in which publishers submit hundreds or thousands of books for slabbing hot off the printing presses and then out to the market at a marked-up price.

The 9.9’s and 10 is what gets me. I recently obtained a sealed case of 125 of the same book. Had the crazy idea of submitting them all for a 9.9 pre-screen (hoping to MAYBE get one 9.9) but then saw that CGC only pre-screens up to 9.8.

For Black Flag to only have like 10 total books in the census and all these 9.9’s and 10’s they’d have had to submit loads of books and then crack and turn in the labels for everything that didn’t get 9.9 or 10 which would statistically have been hundreds if not thousands of books.

Super shady stuff going on here between CGC and Black Flag!

Either that or they are just really good at adding staples and covers to books!   I wonder how far up in CGC this craziness goes!?

Just super depressing  i chased a CGC 9.9 for two years to get my hands on it, and now these guys at CGC and Black Flag make me wonder why I wasted my time!  At least that book was graded in 2005, before Influencers et al gamed the system  

 

[Iconic1s]

On 8/12/2022 at 11:27 AM, Dr. Balls said:

You are right. People don't care. The dirtbags that get caught serve some time and the guys around them get a little poo splattered on them. Couple years later, it's like it never happened. And that's likely what's going on at CGC. And it means nothing to me, it's my daily entertainment. My collection doesn't hinge on CGC. I enjoyed being a believer in the brand, but this episode is pretty damning. I'll keep my CGC books, and I'll buy CGC books, but thinking that they are higher quality, more accurately graded or more thorough than CBCS or PGX is out the window at this point.

I feel like yelling…’can I get an Amen!’

Nicely said!

[Axelrod]

On 8/12/2022 at 12:57 PM, BlowUpTheMoon said:

Nope. Only a 9.8 or less pre-screen. 

Unless you are a "prominent member of the collecting community," I'll bet.  

[Toz]

On 8/12/2022 at 1:09 PM, davidpg said:

An official CGC response has been given in the main thread.

Too much to look through.Got a link?

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 8/12/2022 at 7:33 PM, Toz said:

Too much to look through.Got a link?

 

[leadkern]

this is just insane. so the original cover means nothing to the grading? so any battered comic can have an acetate cover stapled to it and suddenly become a 10.0?

Did Clayton draw that insanely-error-riddled acetate cover? I didn't even see any 'artwork' on it.