A Dealer is a flipper 3 3

[Westy Steve]

Hey guys,

I have an interesting ethical question for you. I am trying to build up a business as a dealer. So I am setting up at shows, trying to build an audience on Facebook etc.

Like most of you here, I like looking through comic book ads on eBay and in the sales forum here etc.

How would you feel if someone like me was offering a desirable comic book to you at a good price. But when you looked up past sales on eBay to get a feel for what the market value of the comic book was, you noticed that the comic you’re interested in buying was purchased at a much better price. (Presumably by me).  Like really recently. 
 

If you’re still getting a “good” price on it, does it bother you that I recently bought it at a “great” price to flip it on a public site like EBay?  Is that somehow different than if I bought it from Joe Schmoe at wholesale?

Just curious. 

Edited March 15, 2023 by Westy Steve

[PopKulture]

For me, it would have no bearing on my decision on whether to buy it from you or not. All that matters is the price you're asking at that point and the price I'm willing to pay (and how far apart we are).  The only thing I'll never do is buy on the Bay from dealers who outbid me directly on other auctions (usually group lots). In that case, I will not support and underpin my direct competition. 

The latter has happened to me at least a dozen times the past few years, often on lots of books that are each in the $3 to $20 value range: things like Dells, Gold Keys, Charltons, etc. They are not high-demand books, but if a dealer can get them at the right price and stick them in their eBay store for $9.99 to $24.99, enough of them eventually sell to reinforce that business model. Often these auctions originate with non-comics sellers like a family member or friend with some knowledge and common sense listing books in similar lots of perhaps a dozen or more. It seems for a few weeks, you can win a few of these auctions before a few fairly decent-sized dealers become your competition and then, well, the fun gets sucked out of the room pretty quickly...  

Edited March 15, 2023 by PopKulture

[thehumantorch]

Wouldn't bother me.  If you find a deal out in the wild buy it and do what you want with it.  Often good deals are found by guys willing to work hard and search them out.

A dealer's reputation for fair prices, accurate grading, and general honesty and likeability are important to me.

[PopKulture]

On 3/14/2023 at 9:01 PM, Westy Steve said:

I have an interesting ethical question for you...

Additionally, there is effectively zero* ethical grey area here: if you paid a dollar for a comic that you want - or get - $2,500 for, then it's your good fortune.

The previous seller had every opportunity to maximize their net and somehow did not. If you choose to go rearward along this transaction trail and offer the original seller more money, then that is on you and your good conscience, and will in turn be their good fortune. 

*  (I'm sure someone here will however concoct a scenario where you ripped off a little old lady (harder to do on the Bay), so I'll then default to that "effectively zero" hedge...)

Edited March 15, 2023 by PopKulture

[SpideyFein]

There are people on here who do both- buy on here/FB/IG and sell on eBay and vice-versa. I think we are all used to to it by now and everybody is trying to get a deal. Our hobby gets pricey. If you are patient and find the deals, that’s a beautiful thing.
 

My biggest issue with this would be hyping up your post/sale (I’ve seen a few here) stating you’re giving the buyer the greatest deal around and that the book is “ready to take off” or explode. Meanwhile your potential sellers can do a quick eBay search and find you just bought it 2-3 weeks ago for much cheaper and see a downward trend on GPA. That being said, I would say buy and sell as you please, but leave the hype train out if it’s a public, recent purchase. I of course understand hype and FOMO sell books, so sellers are going to do as they please. 
 

As @thehumantorch said, honesty is very important. 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 3/14/2023 at 10:24 PM, thehumantorch said:

Wouldn't bother me.  If you find a deal out in the wild buy it and do what you want with it.  Often good deals are found by guys willing to work hard and search them out.

A dealer's reputation for fair prices, accurate grading, and general honesty and likeability are important to me.

This 

[MattTheDuck]

I buy from people on here all the time who have recently purchased a book and are selling it to me.  I know it's marked up - I don't expect people on here - whether they are "dealers" or "a business" or just a guy like me - to take a loss. I've told them as much. I can only think of one time where I felt like I overpaid as I ended up with a book with undisclosed damage. Every other transaction has been positive.

If I want books at the price you and others are buying them I am going to need to work a whole lot harder at finding them out in the wild. Time also has a value.

[Grendel72]

On 3/15/2023 at 10:01 AM, Westy Steve said:

 

If you’re still getting a “good” price on it, does it bother you that I recently bought it at a “great” view price to flip it on a public site like EBay?  Is that somehow different than if I bought it from Joe Schmoe at wholesale?

Just curious. 

Wouldn't bother me at all. It's part and parcel. Since you asked the qn, would it bother you if you were a potential buyer ? 

[D2]

It depends. 
 

There is a seller that bought up dozens and dozens of sketch blank covers for prices ranging at $120 to $400, but then relisted them all within a few months at $1,300 to $2,500 each. 

So there is, scoring well on a deal and capitalizing on your gain by selling at the real market value, which I think is fair, and just jacking up the price in hopes to make a sale, which annoys me

[PopKulture]

On 3/14/2023 at 10:57 PM, D2 said:

and just jacking up the price in hopes to make a sale, which annoys me

And then you vote with your wallet and elect not to buy, I assume?  

[southern cross]

[jcjames]

On 3/14/2023 at 7:01 PM, Westy Steve said:

Hey guys,

I have an interesting ethical question for you. I am trying to build up a business as a dealer. So I am setting up at shows, trying to build an audience on Facebook etc.

Like most of you here, I like looking through comic book ads on eBay and in the sales forum here etc.

How would you feel if someone like me was offering a desirable comic book to you at a good price. But when you looked up past sales on eBay to get a feel for what the market value of the comic book was, you noticed that the comic you’re interested in buying was purchased at a much better price. (Presumably by me).  Like really recently. 
 

If you’re still getting a “good” price on it, does it bother you that I recently bought it at a “great” view price to flip it on a public site like EBay?  Is that somehow different than if I bought it from Joe Schmoe at wholesale?

Just curious. 

Absolutely not an issue. Especially if I know I'm still getting a good price on it too. 

I would ASSUME that ANY book a dealer is selling, he got at a much lower price than what he's selling it for. 

Whether he bought a multi-long-box collection for a dime per book and is able to pull a couple keys and semi-keys out to quickly flip to cover the total cost of the deal - or whether he scoured feebay and found a decent deal on a solo book, bought and is now flipping for profit - it's the same thing. 

The dealer is in business to make money. 

 

[dover]

I know of dealers that bid on auctions like ComicLink. They put in lots of bids, at a percentage of GPA value, on books they think have a re-sale potential. I know this as I was told by one dealer specifically and then by finding a book listed on their site that I was the under bidder. The listing was within weeks of the auction, so I am certain that dealer bought it and then listed it on their site. I visit it almost daily. 

I would think any savvy, an un-savvy, dealer would do this. And by dealer, I mean broadly speaking of people trying to buy and sell comics. Buying a book that you think you can sell for more seems like a good opportunity. 

 

[Stefan_W]

I buy comics and resell a lot of them at a higher price. The most important thing is giving people fair prices, which means that you have to be able to find books for an even bigger deal than the deals you offer to buyers. That often means buying in bulk and re-selling the pieces. I dont think people generally care where you get your books so long as they are happy with the prices, grading, etc. 

As a side note, I could caution against re-selling in the same place as you buy. There are local people who buy collections on kijiji or FB and start re-selling the pieces in the same place within a day or two. That just comes across as icky and impacts on a person's reputation, although of course a deal is a deal and at the end of the day people still buy books when they are priced well. 

[eastriver400]

I refuse to pay anything but cover price. If the comic says 20 cents, thats all you are getting out of me. PERIOD. 

 

But seriously, of course not. Who cares what you paid. Markets fluctuate. If you found a sweet deal, you found a sweet deal. Doesn't dictate what that book should now sell for.  

 

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

It 'bothers me' when people are simply obsessed with flipping, because it's clear to me that greed solely drives their business and not a genuine interest in perpetuating the things that make the hobby worthwhile.

Otherwise, flipping is just a thing that cannot/won't be stopped, and I accept that. Other people winning trades doesn't typically affect me.

[Black_Adam]

I know I should say I understand and it wouldn't bother me, but I have been peeved in the past by certain sellers who would scoop up deals on the CGC sales forum and then, soon after, try to resell the comics on these same boards at a hefty markup (and sometimes,  in the case of raws, at a higher grade). 

[ThothAmon]

Only thing that bothers me is dishonesty, otherwise to itch his own. Sometimes a quick flip helps pay for something for the collection but generally buy and hold for decades has been the preferred way to profit. 

[WolverineX]

On 3/15/2023 at 9:15 AM, theCapraAegagrus said:

It 'bothers me' when people are simply obsessed with flipping, because it's clear to me that greed solely drives their business and not a genuine interest in perpetuating the things that make the hobby worthwhile.

Otherwise, flipping is just a thing that cannot/won't be stopped, and I accept that. Other people winning trades doesn't typically affect me.

Welcome to capitalism. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 3/15/2023 at 10:26 AM, WolverineX said:

Welcome to capitalism. 

It's just greed in the free market. Can't eliminate human nature.