The Official Doctor Strange Movie Thread 0

[Unca Ben]

My objection in this discussion is when the phrase "political correctness" is used as a catch-all pejorative by people who want to convey that whatever it is that they disagree with is in some way unnecessary.

luckily that didnt happen, and in this case it was used correctly by people identifying something wrong happening in our society.

 

 

It is unto itself a judgment on the validity of a point-of-view.

The PC charge is often used to silence discussion by marginalizing differing opinions and to blithely dismiss concerns as frivolous.

 

The bolded part is what Political Correctness does, yes.

 

In some matters, this misuse of the term can blur the boundaries between free speech and offensive speech.

 

Being polticially correct about the term polticially correct is funny Can't say I have seen that one before. Good thing in this case people were speaking about how PC-ness is used as a bludgeon to push agendas, and silence valid concerns, not what you are attempting to describe.

 

 

As for creating new diverse characters instead of race or gender swapping established characters like Nick Fury or the Ancient One, I'd be fine with that if Marvel had shown it could create any good, new, long-lived characters in recent times.

 

Your "fineness" is not relevant. Assuming that diversity is needed, something not necessarily shown to be true...making new quality characters and placing them center stage, is the CORRECT way to do it.

 

Making quality compelling characters is not easy, but certainly can be done by choosing quality writers, and giving them the freedom to be creative.

 

Potential failure is not a reason not to try, and certainly not a reason to justify retcon'ing existing characters.

 

Oh brother.

 

I’m sorry that a change in skin color, or gender for that matter, is offensive to you.

 

In my view skin color and gender are not overall defining characteristics.

What’s important to me is that Marvel Studios secure the best actor they can for the role while maintaining the inner quality of the character rather than limiting themselves to a sectarian choice.

 

The world is not the same as the 1960’s society these characters originally catered to. Circumstances and times have changed.

The Marvel Cinematic Universe is bringing forth characters in a more diverse world than the parochial America that these Marvel Comics characters were created for.

 

That some vague “PC Police” group with an agenda is demanding these changes is a phobic idea which borders on paranoia since there’s been no backlash to the predominantly all-white cast of other popular franchises like Harry Potter, Tolkien, or Twilight.

 

 

Those who remain dogmatic in their views of these iconic characters will be left behind and relegated to impotently standing on the sidelines spouting invective with frothy emotionalism while these reinterpreted characters of color and diversity march towards the cultural institutions of Stage and Screen.

 

I’ve seen this last stand of partisan expression before, and it’s usually punctuated with pejorative and insult like “sheep”, “stupid”, “Gaypublic”, “crybabies” and so on.

In the past the words may have been different, but the intent was the same.

 

Another characteristic of individuals with this dogmatic myopia is the ability to turn it around in their minds so they are the ones being wronged for being defenders of some imagined purity of purpose; only they know what’s correct, and despite their preemptive name-calling and slurs they are the ones being “bullied”.

 

It’s my final post on the subject, no insults to those that view it differently, and frankly it’s no longer worth my time.

The movies will go on, female or male ancient mystic, or not.

I will be watching and enjoying these movies all along the way.

 

[Chip Cataldo]

In my view skin color and gender are not overall defining characteristics.

What’s important to me is that Marvel Studios secure the best actor they can for the role while maintaining the inner quality of the character rather than limiting themselves to a sectarian choice.

So, if Kathy Bates were cast instead you'd have no problem?

 

Seriously, this whole discussion is ridiculous. They should stay true to the character. Part of what makes the Ancient One his own character is that he's a wizened old Asian man.

[CBT]

It's ludicrously paranoid to think that there's a "vocal minority of PC witch hunters" who are somehow influencing Marvel's movie-casting decisions.

 

That is not what was said...

 

I realize it's a loaded statement, so break it apart:

 

1.) "The people that actually care about Political Correctness are a small, vocal minority of the population."

 

There is nothing paranoid about such a statement, nor ludicrous, in fact I would say it is self-evidently true, and indisputable.

 

2.) "Said people are participating in witch hunts"

 

A witch hunt implies unjustly accusing someone of doing something gravely wrong, when nothing bad has actually happened at all. That is a very apt description of what goes on in the media, from the vocal minority mentioned in 1.).

Mostly its to bait people into reading/watching their news story, and those of a similar political ideology then just repeat and regurgitate the mantras...

 

3.) "who are somehow influencing Marvel's movie-casting decisions."

 

This is the part that you invented and added to the statement. "Somehow" is a complete fallacy as the above quoted statement was part of a conversation where two separate "how"s were stated very clearly. I said that big company's bow down to the shrill crying PC crowd because they would rather drink the kool-aid than risk bad PR or a hit to their bottom line. Nothing "paranoid" about that, also pretty straight forward and obvious.

 

[CBT]

I’m sorry that a change in skin color, or gender for that matter, is offensive to you.

 

This is the second time you have taken a backhanded attempt to accuse me of something that is extremely untrue. I ignored it the first time, this time I will simply just say, watch your baseless accusations/mouth.

 

Your problem is that you clearly have a lot of baggage with this issue, and with past arguments, and you are trying to unload it in this conversation.

 

Firstly, never at any point in time did I say something was offensive to me personally. Secondly, the issue is changing characters in a significant way, regardless of the way in which they are changed. It's not about gender or race, its about either using the existing characters, or using something related to them but different.

 

In my view skin color and gender are not overall defining characteristics.

 

Your opinion is wrong. Those things are a very important part of who someone is, and to say they have no impact on that person, is insulting and degrading to all genders, races, and orientations, equally.

 

 

What’s important to me is that Marvel Studios secure the best actor they can for the role while maintaining the inner quality of the character rather than limiting themselves to a sectarian choice.

 

While what's important to you is not what the discussion is about, I will point out, that choosing the best actor is what Marvel has done an outstanding job at doing, and what is important to most fans, myself included.

Furthermore, Marvel has shown that being true to the source material is the way to have success and produce good films. Which is why the sectarian limitations have only been imposed on supporting characters like Nick Fury and not main characters like in Fox's Fantastic Four

 

 

 

The world is not the same as the 1960’s society these characters originally catered to. Circumstances and times have changed.

 

No one has said it is, the world is not the same as when any of the literary classics were written either. Good stories are good stories, good characters are good characters, that is why these stories and characters from the 40s-60s are still so successful and loved today.

 

 

The Marvel Cinematic Universe is bringing forth characters in a more diverse world than the parochial America that these Marvel Comics characters were created for.

 

Which is why, as I said, they should (and are) be creating new and compelling characters, and placing them center stage in comics and movies.

 

 

 

That some vague “PC Police” group with an agenda is demanding these changes is a phobic idea which borders on paranoia since there’s been no backlash to the predominantly all-white cast of other popular franchises like Harry Potter, Tolkien, or Twilight.

 

Nothing vague or paranoid about obvious truths as outlined in other posts in this thread. Sorry that stating the truth has clearly offended you.

 

Those who remain dogmatic in their views of these iconic characters will be left behind and relegated to impotently standing on the sidelines spouting invective with frothy emotionalism while these reinterpreted characters of color and diversity march towards the cultural institutions of Stage and Screen.

 

your anger and bias is showing. Marvel is and will continue to keep these iconic characters true to their creation, and will not change main characters to pander to crybaby PC loons

 

 

 

 

I’ve seen this last stand of partisan expression before, and it’s usually punctuated with pejorative and insult like “sheep”, “stupid”, “Gaypublic”, “crybabies” and so on.

In the past the words may have been different, but the intent was the same.

 

First, I am Canadian, so I am not a part of any of your imagined partisanship. My party, is Objective Truth, our opponent is Subjective Truth, aka lies being foisted as truth. I have used the word sheep, stupid, and crybaby, but the word you insert that I have bolded was said by no one.

That is another one of your backhanded accusations that are baseless, and also strongly against the forum rules.

 

 

Another characteristic of individuals with this dogmatic myopia is the ability to turn it around in their minds so they are the ones being wronged for being defenders of some imagined purity of purpose; only they know what’s correct, and despite their preemptive name-calling and slurs they are the ones being “bullied”.

 

As I said before, there is a lot of personal baggage and past fights you seem to be carrying with you. Marvel has done a good job so far of appeasing the PC bleeters by only altering supporting roles. They have now reached a point where the Universe is big enough they can actually bring in more diverse characters without having to mess up existing ones. All-in-all, I would give them a 9/10 in staying true to the source material as much as possible, while also keeping the small vocal minority PC crowd satiated.

 

 

It’s my final post on the subject, no insults to those that view it differently, and frankly it’s no longer worth my time.

 

well, you did have lots of backhanded insults, but peace out.

 

 

The movies will go on, female or male ancient mystic, or not.

I will be watching and enjoying these movies all along the way.

 

So say we all, and yes, female Ancient One is infinitely preferable to Dr. Stephanie Strange, which Fox would probably have given us.

[Unca Ben]

I’ve seen this last stand of partisan expression before, and it’s usually punctuated with pejorative and insult like “sheep”, “stupid”, “Gaypublic”, “crybabies” and so on.

In the past the words may have been different, but the intent was the same.

 

First, I am Canadian, so I am not a part of any of your imagined partisanship. My party, is Objective Truth, our opponent is Subjective Truth, aka lies being foisted as truth. I have used the word sheep, stupid, and crybaby, but the word you insert that I have bolded was said by no one.

That is another one of your backhanded accusations that are baseless, and also strongly against the forum rules.

 

I said I wouldn't post anymore on this subject, but I 'll make an exception to respond to your claim, as I don't want to be accused of breaking forum rules.

 

Go back and read yesterday's posts. It was said - it's easy to find, go back one page, hit Ctrl F and search for the word.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt (which is something you might want to learn to do) and figure you just missed it.

The word may be against forum rules, so you might want to address that with the person who posted it.

I just pointed it out.

 

You are the one who insults. You are the one with an agenda. You are the one with the baggage.

And in this instance, you are the one who was wrong. Perhaps it's you who should "watch your mouth."

 

P.S. you might want to look up "sectarian" and "partisan".

Judging by your response, either you misunderstood what I said, misspoke yourself, or the words don't mean what you think they mean.

 

 

[cousin itt]

I still think it's more likely that swinton is up for the part of death. That would be great casting. This ancient one rumor is either just a mistake by the press or misdirection. They need a "death" for the infinity war movies, and I'm pretty sure death has been confirmed for the Dr. Strange movie. Just seems like the more obvious fit.

Edited May 29, 2015 by cousin itt

[Chip Cataldo]

I still think it's more likely that swinton is up for the part of death. That would be great casting. This ancient one rumor is either just a mistake by the press or misdirection. They need a "death" for the infinity war movies, and I'm pretty sure death has been confirmed for the Dr. Strange movie. Just seems like the more obvious fit.

Hadn't thought of this. It'd be perfect.

 

[revat]

Ive seen this last stand of partisan expression before, and its usually punctuated with pejorative and insult like sheep, stupid, Gaypublic, crybabies and so on.

In the past the words may have been different, but the intent was the same.

 

First, I am Canadian, so I am not a part of any of your imagined partisanship. My party, is Objective Truth, our opponent is Subjective Truth, aka lies being foisted as truth. I have used the word sheep, stupid, and crybaby, but the word you insert that I have bolded was said by no one.

That is another one of your backhanded accusations that are baseless, and also strongly against the forum rules.

 

I said I wouldn't post anymore on this subject, but I 'll make an exception to respond to your claim, as I don't want to be accused of breaking forum rules.

 

Go back and read yesterday's posts. It was said.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt (which is something you might want to learn to do) and figure you just missed it.

The word may be against forum rules, so you might want to address that with the person who posted it.

I just pointed it out.

 

You are the one who insults. You are the one with an agenda. You are the one with the baggage.

And in this instance, you are the one who was wrong. Perhaps it's you who should "watch your mouth."

 

P.S. you might want to look up "sectarian" and "partisan".

Judging by your response, either you misunderstood what I said, misspoke yourself, or the words don't mean what you think they mean.

 

 

for the record, I was the first one who brought up 'gaypublic'.

 

There was a funny line in a 30 Rock episode when Jack (a zealous conservative) referred to California as the "People's Gaypublic of Drugifornia".

 

That's what this discussion made me think of, that some people might think that Hollywood has nothing better to do all day than push (or cower under) liberal social agendas. I'm not naïve enough to think that never happens, but I'm fairly confident that when it comes to megablockbusters (or hopefuls), that simply is not the case. Its about benjamins, adding more than they subtract with each action.

 

 

Given that I don't want to veer near politics, I will say again that I'm very certain its GREED that drives these movie decisions, not a moral compass (for right or wrong). So congratulations to us all

 

 

[Unca Ben]

Sorry about bringing you into this.

Mea culpa.

I will back off, now.

[TupennyConan]

It might be just me but I always thought the Vision sucked.

 

 

I once misattributed this sentiment to fingh, a fellow Vision enthusiast. He was fit to be tied.

 

Oh, I know he loves the Viz.

 

Vision sucks.

 

[kdoginohio]

and robot body Arnim Zola,

 

PS - If they had f'ed with the Vision, I would be singing a different tune.

Robot? I prefer to consider him a Twonky.

As for The Vision, give them time. It is Marvel, after all.

[BizarroChuck]

I still think it's more likely that swinton is up for the part of death. That would be great casting. This ancient one rumor is either just a mistake by the press or misdirection. They need a "death" for the infinity war movies, and I'm pretty sure death has been confirmed for the Dr. Strange movie. Just seems like the more obvious fit.

 

 

Actually I think it's Clea...

Edited May 31, 2015 by BizarroChuck

[Mr. Hog]

That would be good too...

[Chip Cataldo]

No way. Clea is supposed to be curvy & sexy.

[BizarroChuck]

So is every female comic book character ever

[gadzukes]

No way. Clea is supposed to be curvy & sexy.

 

Maybe she'll be the "Ancient Clea"

 

[Unca Ben]

So is every female comic book character ever

 

That's one thing I liked about the early issues of New Mutants and Valiant's original Harbinger with Zephyr.

The young women weren't all drawn like superhero versions of sexualized jail bait.

[kdoginohio]

What about Joel Grey? Enjoyed his part in Remo Williams. Very Ancient One like.

[Comicopolis]

[Bosco685]

Doctor Strange Comic-Con Action Figure Set Revealed

 

With Marvel Studios launching a Doctor Strange movie next year comes word of a Hasbro exclusive Comic-Con Doctor Strange Marvel Legends action figure set, which is actually based on the comics.

 

The set will be available at this Summer's Comic-Con for $99.99 and available through the online Hasbro Shop for a limited time.