Books you just cant find in the Wild 22 22

[Bird]

not weighing in on the debate per se, but I would point out that just because people "dont ever see book X at a comic shop", doesnt mean it didnt used to be in ALL the comic shops, was ordered lots, and now is just not in the content that gets moved around frequently.

 

Most comic shops are NOT re-supplying themselves with 90s books.

 

 

Thats exactly correct sir.

Most comic shops today buy and sell primarily to their buyers. theyre not in the "speculating" market.

Dealers back then were HEAVILY into speculating. We all know that

Chuck was THE KING of Pump n Dump. The absolute king.

He would pick up on trends and pump mercilessly on his monthly newssletters.

On a few occasions he would hit, just like Wizard would, but mostly it was buying books he would know he could dump easily.

 

I think that with you spreading the gospel of 1990s-Chuck Rozanski so many times in these last few messages that you should probably do a thread telling of your discipleship of Chuck.

I like how you're backtracking now, saying that comic shop owners aren't the dealers you are referring to and that you agree that comic shops don't order multiples of comics with the far-off hopes that they sell them for more than cover price.

How many comic shop owners AREN'T dealers? They sell comics, right? So, that would make them a comic dealer.

And, what small percentage of comic show dealers aren't comic shop owners? I don't know many "dealers" who only do shows who could order multiples of comics to stockpile WITHOUT a dealer contract with Diamond (or, at that time, Capital and the small guys like Heroes World and a few other distributors).

If these books are so plentiful, as you say, then why don't we see them show up in comic shops more often?

I mean, at least a few of these shop owners have to be dealers, too, so wouldn't now be the time to bring those rare last issues out into the open for sale while they are so hot? Or, are they still holding onto them so that they can make an even bigger profit years on down the road?

 

I think youre taking this too personal.

Most people who read my comments understood what I was saying. You didnt

No need to read too much into this.

Have a nice day sir

 

I agree relax. Its a discussion here not a personal vindication being right. Soak up the information here this is a lot.

 

I knew several dealers in the 90s that didn't own comics shops. There were plenty of ways to get books back then without owning a comic shop. I was in college and did several shows or flea markets a year without owning a comic shop.

 

There was a guy at Rutgers who sold books out of his dormroom. I was amazed. He got all the new books but you had to order in advance and they came on new comics day. Upperclassmen showed me and when he graduated we found a LCS. I graduated college in 1989.

Edited December 31, 2016 by Bird

[mec3437]

 

Try the Transformer Thread they can tell you more about that book I would think.

 

We don't do variants in this thread. There are others for that.

 

Sorry about that. I didn't actually start on page one of the thread. More like page 6 or something. Won't happen again.

[fastballspecial]

 

Try the Transformer Thread they can tell you more about that book I would think.

 

We don't do variants in this thread. There are others for that.

 

Sorry about that. I didn't actually start on page one of the thread. More like page 6 or something. Won't happen again.

 

Its not a big deal which just like this thread to be variant clear because all the other threads have them. This is a thread where you find a book that you have looking for a long time or cant find it and come here to

 

 

[fastballspecial]

Picked this up yesterday for $1 because I had never seen it before. Spot on NM+ copy. Turns out I guess it is tough to find. Any ash can fans on here tell me about it?

 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2016 by Fastballspecial

[the authority]

Very nice find. I think they made around 2,000 or so of these though I'm not positive. I collect just about everything Gen 13 ( because its plentiful and cheap ) but this book is limited. I've not seen one in person in a long, long time. Congrats

[Aweandlorder]

We don't do variants in this thread

 

[Aweandlorder]

Picked this up yesterday for $1 because I had never seen it before. Spot on NM+ copy. Turns out I guess it is tough to find. Any ash can fans on here tell me about it?

 

 

 

 

Nice! Never seen Gen13 Ash's before...

I know there are a few Maxx ones which were discussed before.

How about this one?

 

 

(image courtesy of user com1cbook)

 

[fastballspecial]

Very nice find. I think they made around 2,000 or so of these though I'm not positive. I collect just about everything Gen 13 ( because its plentiful and cheap ) but this book is limited. I've not seen one in person in a long, long time. Congrats

 

After you have been around for a while looking at books stuff like this stands out because you never see it before. I wasn't sure it was hard to find I just knew I had never seen a copy.

 

 

[Couchy81]

How about Venom #1 (2011) 4th printing. Some of the later printings like the 3rd and this pink 4th printing aren't even listed on Comichron, unless I missed them. 2nd printing is under 5k according to the site. I found it in a flea market vendors bin, first time I've seen one.

 

 

 

[fastballspecial]

How about Venom #1 (2011) 4th printing. Some of the later printings like the 3rd and this pink 4th printing aren't even listed on Comichron, unless I missed them. 2nd printing is under 5k according to the site. I found it in a flea market vendors bin, first time I've seen one.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2016 by Fastballspecial

[Kyle R.]

Picked this up yesterday for $1 because I had never seen it before. Spot on NM+ copy. Turns out I guess it is tough to find. Any ash can fans on here tell me about it?

 

 

 

 

 

Nice ! I've been looking for Gen13 & Wildcats ashcans. That one is tough to find.

[fastballspecial]

Picked this up yesterday for $1 because I had never seen it before. Spot on NM+ copy. Turns out I guess it is tough to find. Any ash can fans on here tell me about it?

 

 

 

 

 

Nice ! I've been looking for Gen13 & Wildcats ashcans. That one is tough to find.

 

I have never seen a Wildcats ashcan, but I will add it to my list did they have several or is one more common then the other?

 

[the blob]

Soooo many dealers bought last issues in the 90s because at the time the cat was already out of the bag and dealers knew these will sell at a premium. Chuck R used to advertise this in EVERY newssletter.. Even NM#100 :facepalm:

Now if youre talking she-hulk, you really wanna find this one:

 

 

I strongly disagree with the statement that "soooo many dealers bought last issues in the 90s because at the time the cat was already out of the bag and dealers knew these will sell at a premium." I don't know many DEALERS who subscribed to the Mile High Comics newsletter. A comic like NM 100 was ordered heavily, because it was heading into X-Force 1. A comic like Conan the Barbarian 275 was not ordered heavily. Neither was Ghost Rider 93 -- because retailers didn't know it was the last issue.

Those last issues are rare because those series' sales numbers had dropped so low that they were past Marvel's cutoff point and no one was ordering them.

I don't know a single retailer who bought to speculate on last issues at that time -- or many who do that now. When no one is buying a comic, retailers don't increase their orders for speculative purposes that far in the future. I mean, some of these ARE JUST NOW INCREASING IN PRICE, meaning a lot of retailers would have had to have gambled on the long game instead of wanting to make the fast profit and were stuck with back stock they either didn't sell or tried selling at cheap prices to make room for more stock that sold quickly.

Retailers don't sit on new comics for two decades with the hopes that they will eventually increase in value. They want to sell new comics now to make their money as quickly as they can. So, to say that a lot of retailers bought last issues doesn't make any sense and the fact that there are so few of these last issues in back issue bins in shops is proof that the print runs on those final issues were very low.

 

I think youre confusing dealers with flippers today. Dealers like Chuck, till this day, have stock to sell. Thats their business, theyre not some kid in a basement buying books to flip on eBay.

Dealers dont buy from dealers, just like Chuck, there were many other comic book shop owners that ordered heavily on these final issues because they knew they could price them accordingly.

That does not mean that they are rare as much as it doesnt mean that they are worthless.

The point is, that what you are saying was a known fact EVEN back in the 90s

 

By the time most of those books were published many shops were in a bad way financially and had been burned over ordering a lot of early 90s books. The markets for modern marvel titles as back issues was terrible. My local shop was not ordering extras of any new books to sell as back issues, every week he was praying enough rack books sold and enough file customers showed up for their books (rather than leaving him with 3 months if books to dump in his 25 cent box). Conan 275 I found in his 25 cent box. There wasn't a real market for last issues unless they were special or transitioned into something. If I'm wrong, show me a wizard article pumping last issues. Remember, there was no ebay, shops were closing right and left.

Edited January 1, 2017 by the blob

[Lazyboy]

Soooo many dealers bought last issues in the 90s because at the time the cat was already out of the bag and dealers knew these will sell at a premium. Chuck R used to advertise this in EVERY newssletter.. Even NM#100 :facepalm:

Now if youre talking she-hulk, you really wanna find this one:

 

 

I strongly disagree with the statement that "soooo many dealers bought last issues in the 90s because at the time the cat was already out of the bag and dealers knew these will sell at a premium." I don't know many DEALERS who subscribed to the Mile High Comics newsletter. A comic like NM 100 was ordered heavily, because it was heading into X-Force 1. A comic like Conan the Barbarian 275 was not ordered heavily. Neither was Ghost Rider 93 -- because retailers didn't know it was the last issue.

Those last issues are rare because those series' sales numbers had dropped so low that they were past Marvel's cutoff point and no one was ordering them.

I don't know a single retailer who bought to speculate on last issues at that time -- or many who do that now. When no one is buying a comic, retailers don't increase their orders for speculative purposes that far in the future. I mean, some of these ARE JUST NOW INCREASING IN PRICE, meaning a lot of retailers would have had to have gambled on the long game instead of wanting to make the fast profit and were stuck with back stock they either didn't sell or tried selling at cheap prices to make room for more stock that sold quickly.

Retailers don't sit on new comics for two decades with the hopes that they will eventually increase in value. They want to sell new comics now to make their money as quickly as they can. So, to say that a lot of retailers bought last issues doesn't make any sense and the fact that there are so few of these last issues in back issue bins in shops is proof that the print runs on those final issues were very low.

 

I think youre confusing dealers with flippers today. Dealers like Chuck, till this day, have stock to sell. Thats their business, theyre not some kid in a basement buying books to flip on eBay.

Dealers dont buy from dealers, just like Chuck, there were many other comic book shop owners that ordered heavily on these final issues because they knew they could price them accordingly.

That does not mean that they are rare as much as it doesnt mean that they are worthless.

The point is, that what you are saying was a known fact EVEN back in the 90s

 

So I guess these few - sorry, many - brilliant, savvy shops that were swimming in cash ordered all the copies of every last issue and all the other poor stores didn't order any? That would explain why, with very few exceptions, any numbers we have show a generally steady decrease in orders until the last issue, which is the lowest ordered of the series or maybe 1% above the lowest.

 

Plus, as was already mentioned, most last issues are not, were not, and never will be worth anything. Certainly not worth buying new at wholesale and holding indefinitely, just hoping to hit the jackpot.

 

There's a term for a store that buys too many items that don't sell quickly: Out of business.

[Bird]

So I don't know who is right or wrong but that Schiffman newsletter from 1994 posted now in CG has a last iissue blurb right there on the front page. So it was a thing in 1994 apparently.

[Michael Browning]

So I don't know who is right or wrong but that Schiffman newsletter from 1994 posted now in CG has a last iissue blurb right there on the front page. So it was a thing in 1994 apparently.

 

There have always been last issue collectors, but last issues' print run numbers don't drop into the low thousands and even hundreds when comic shops and dealers are buying them in bulk to sell 20 years in the future.

Despite the fact that many of these last issues are very hard to find, there aren't many that sell for much more than cover price and many collectors even scoff at PAYING more than cover price for them, despite their rarity.

I was an Overstreet Comic Book Price Guide advisor from 2001 until last year (it is a very time-consuming job to gather data from numerous comic shops) and have been active in comic collecting/selling/trading since 1978, so I've been around a LOT of shops all across the East Coast and I am telling you this: comic shops don't increase their orders as sales fall off, no matter what the future potential of buying a last issue may be.

Case in point: Deadpool 69. It had a super low print run and is terribly hard to find in shops. Very few shops ordered it, despite the fact that it was a last issue and was an issue of Deadpool.

And, I don't care what anyone says, Mile High Comics does NOT buy in bulk with the idea that they can dump the comics. They buy to sell out, just like everyone else does.

No comic shop owner/dealer wants to have back stock sitting around with the possibility of those comics ending up in 50 cent bins - I don't care how large of an operation you're running.

None of the comic shops I frequent have any of the Valiant last issues, even though that company was churning out gold for the first few years of its existence. They don't have any because they didn't order any and what they did order was for pull lists and reserve customers and those were bought by the customers who were still hanging on and trying to finish out their runs.

Those shops that did have the last issues had, like, maybe, one copy of each, left over in a long box somewhere stuck back under a table. I know that I have only ever found one copy of each of the Valiant last issues in all my years of looking in shops and those went into my collection to fill the holes where MY LCS didn't order them when I was buying them new.

I do, however, see a lot of stuff that was over-ordered like one guy who had 283 copies of Rai 9 and 83 copies of X-Force 2.

[the blob]

By 1996 (and earlier for some) most shops were struggling and just didn't have the extra funds to make long term speculation moves,like that and the market was not paying $5-10 for a copy of ghost rider 63 0r any number of these books. Conan 275 might have picked up a little sooner, I'm not sure, but it's a great cover, a 275 issue run, etc. You can't point to new mutants 100, it's comparing pineapples to apples.

[fastballspecial]

Looked for a long time to find a 1st print of this book

 

 

 

Edited January 1, 2017 by Fastballspecial

[Aweandlorder]

Soooo many dealers bought last issues in the 90s because at the time the cat was already out of the bag and dealers knew these will sell at a premium. Chuck R used to advertise this in EVERY newssletter.. Even NM#100 :facepalm:

Now if youre talking she-hulk, you really wanna find this one:

 

 

I strongly disagree with the statement that "soooo many dealers bought last issues in the 90s because at the time the cat was already out of the bag and dealers knew these will sell at a premium." I don't know many DEALERS who subscribed to the Mile High Comics newsletter. A comic like NM 100 was ordered heavily, because it was heading into X-Force 1. A comic like Conan the Barbarian 275 was not ordered heavily. Neither was Ghost Rider 93 -- because retailers didn't know it was the last issue.

Those last issues are rare because those series' sales numbers had dropped so low that they were past Marvel's cutoff point and no one was ordering them.

I don't know a single retailer who bought to speculate on last issues at that time -- or many who do that now. When no one is buying a comic, retailers don't increase their orders for speculative purposes that far in the future. I mean, some of these ARE JUST NOW INCREASING IN PRICE, meaning a lot of retailers would have had to have gambled on the long game instead of wanting to make the fast profit and were stuck with back stock they either didn't sell or tried selling at cheap prices to make room for more stock that sold quickly.

Retailers don't sit on new comics for two decades with the hopes that they will eventually increase in value. They want to sell new comics now to make their money as quickly as they can. So, to say that a lot of retailers bought last issues doesn't make any sense and the fact that there are so few of these last issues in back issue bins in shops is proof that the print runs on those final issues were very low.

 

I think youre confusing dealers with flippers today. Dealers like Chuck, till this day, have stock to sell. Thats their business, theyre not some kid in a basement buying books to flip on eBay.

Dealers dont buy from dealers, just like Chuck, there were many other comic book shop owners that ordered heavily on these final issues because they knew they could price them accordingly.

That does not mean that they are rare as much as it doesnt mean that they are worthless.

The point is, that what you are saying was a known fact EVEN back in the 90s

 

By the time most of those books were published many shops were in a bad way financially and had been burned over ordering a lot of early 90s books. The markets for modern marvel titles as back issues was terrible. My local shop was not ordering extras of any new books to sell as back issues, every week he was praying enough rack books sold and enough file customers showed up for their books (rather than leaving him with 3 months if books to dump in his 25 cent box). Conan 275 I found in his 25 cent box. There wasn't a real market for last issues unless they were special or transitioned into something. If I'm wrong, show me a wizard article pumping last issues. Remember, there was no ebay, shops were closing right and left.

 

Every shop that was doing bad financially in the 90s AFTER the crash stopped speculating on ALL trends, not just final issues. Also on "collectors item #1 dont miss out on it" false prophets.

Probably that LCS you mentioned as well

[Lazyboy]

Looked for a long time to find a 1st print of this book

 

 

 

How is that a "1st print?"