Marvel has lost its way

[aerischan]

I have a hard time reading stuff on a computer monitor.

 

Sit in an armchair, with a drink of your choice, and use a large iPad Pro to read your comics.

This for me. The sole reason I bought my first iPad back in 2011 was to continue feeding my manga addiction. Real estate is expensive in my area and spending $$$/mo for bigger housing or climate controlled storage isn't a workable solution.

 

There are still things I want physical copies of but since space is at a premium, I have to be selective with the things I buy. For most of my reading, digital is fine (either purchased or Marvel Unlimited).

 

Bonus, with the iPad, you don't have to worry about eating and reading at the same time. Even spilled drinks are okay as long as the liquid is just on the large glass and doesn't get inside any of the grooves or ports.

[herc2000]

You can buy the reprint of Hulk 181 for cheap as well ;-)

 

Also, if you don't care about the value of them and only buying to read, then you surely don't have to worry about bagging and boarding them??? (so no extra cost)

 

For me, you buy comics to read, but I want a return on my investment if I choose too, I also like the fact that one issue every so often might become valuable, Walking Dead's. NYX etc etc

 

It's very clever to be able to sell things to people, where they don't actually have anything physically. I mean, a comic cost money to print, post out etc where a virtual one is just a few clicks and costs them nothing to make apart from the labor of the original art.

 

Why have ornaments, sculptures, belongings of any kind, when we can just have pictures on our Ipads, might as well have bare homes but for a bed and a chair.

 

To me a comparison would be to buy some land in Oakland, which I can walk through, sell on, yeah I might get mud on my shoes in the process which I have to clean off sometimes, or I might have to deal with rubbish someone has dumped there...

 

OR

 

I could pay the same amount of money for some land on MARS, not worry about getting my shoes dirty, or having to maintain it, I can just sit back in front of the fire and look at pictures on my Ipad?

 

Boy technology makes some of us lazy, I think the human race will end up like the characters in Wallie where we just are fat blobs that float around on hovering wheel chairs unable to use our legs, .

 

 

;-(

[dupont2005]

I don't personally know anyone who buys digital comics, maybe that's a bigger thing in the US than the UK?

 

Anyone interested in a 9.8 (digital) Hulk 181 with white pages? Only a fraction of the real deal, $500, .

 

Yeah it might be good for just a quick read, but in my opinion, comic book collectors should want the real thing, even for modern comics. I mean surely you want to possibly have a return on your $3-$20 investment, rather than it just being something virtual in cyberspace of no value or collectability?

 

I want something physical to show for my money, surprises me some others don't think the same :-(

You can buy a single issue for $4, and you KNOW it's going to be worth a whole nickel after you carefully bag and board it and store it for two decades.

 

Or you can buy a Humble Bundle and get hundreds of comics for a dollar. They're still worth nothing, but they also cost nothing. And I don't have to store them, they go with me everywhere, and I can read them in the dark.

[dupont2005]

 

What companies plan, and what happens, often don't jive. Like here. Marvels market share has plummeted. There are no new readers coming in.

Marvel hasn't lost sales, it's just that DC gained sales.

 

 

Marvel is really losing market share not total sales which was correctly already stated. DC decided to adopt a faster frequency for reboots and are now in the game.

 

 

I find it rather puzzling that most people are saying that Marvel is losing market share to DC, and yet the following Mayo article for April 2016 sales indicate that Marvel's market share is virtually double what DC's market share is.

 

I thought for awhile there several years ago, that Marvel and DC's market shares were almost the same with Marvel having just a slight lead.

 

 

There are countless articles online about what a great year for sales Marvel is having in 2016. Here's one, from April, but it still represents Q1, and we barely finished Q2 so I assume not too much has changed

 

http://www.cbr.com/mayo-report-marvels-marvelous-april-sales-dcs-rebirth-what-they-mean-to-retailers/

 

Rebirth did well for DC. They've been market share leaders for maybe 2 or 3 months now? Of course it will go back to normal soon though.

[fastballspecial]

I don't personally know anyone who buys digital comics, maybe that's a bigger thing in the US than the UK?

 

Anyone interested in a 9.8 (digital) Hulk 181 with white pages? Only a fraction of the real deal, $500, .

 

Yeah it might be good for just a quick read, but in my opinion, comic book collectors should want the real thing, even for modern comics. I mean surely you want to possibly have a return on your $3-$20 investment, rather than it just being something virtual in cyberspace of no value or collectability?

 

I want something physical to show for my money, surprises me some others don't think the same :-(

 

This is an excellent point and one that I actually wrestled with before subscribing to Marvel Unlimited. I buy and collect Spider-man... I am only interested in reading on a one and done basis everything else. The fact is that if I were to actually buy the issues that I read I would be stuck with comics sitting in boxes that I would have no long term love or use for that would only get me on average about 25-50 cents on the dollar if that. There would be a lot more wasted space of more nonsense.

 

However... at $70? a year and at a price of $4 a comic... As soon as I have read around 20 issues PER YEAR it is already paying for itself. If I read through 100 issues a year... that would have cost me $400 in the stores for stuff that I would have to then TRY to sell and maintain.

 

No thanks... I will buy my ASM to keep up the collection, spend $70 to read everything else and then put that money toward an extra Golden Age book or two and not spend my life tripping over boxes of comics.

 

After you pay 50% online for your books you can easily donate them to Goodwill or other charities. I understand your reasoning for not wanting them.

 

I just cant bring myself to turn my back on my monthly hobby. I don't feel bad about buying TPBs, but I will never buy digital.

 

 

 

[Icculus308win]

Reading this thread makes me really want to read Marvel moderns.

Never quite understood being different just for the sake of being different.

Why does Marvel feel they need to reinvent (so drastically and so radically) a perfectly good wheel

[dupont2005]

After you pay 50% online for your books you can easily donate them to Goodwill or other charities. I understand your reasoning for not wanting them.

 

I just cant bring myself to turn my back on my monthly hobby. I don't feel bad about buying TPBs, but I will never buy digital.

 

 

I used to feel the same way, and there are still plenty of series I like to collect in floppy. Just not really anything modern that isn't small press. I like to buy copper and bronze age comics still, but my moderns can be digital. I don't pay full price for digital comics at all though. I wait for sales, buy Humble Bundles, and keep an eye on the free sections all the time.

[aerischan]

If you want to keep the comics in good condition (even without regard to resale value), I don't think there are other options except to bag and board. I hate spine creases, damaged corners, warping, etc. Besides, it's hard to beat Marvel Unlimited in value for titles I'll only ever read once. Even at 50 cents a pop for printed comics, for the same cost as an annual Marvel Unlimited subscription, that's just ~12 comics a month or ~140 a year. Also, if you have good backup practices (minimum 3 copies with at least 1 offsite), it'll be hard to lose a purchased digital comic book. Even at 5 copies per comic, that's roughly 10,000-40,000 individual issues in quintuplicate in just 115 cubic inches of space.

 

I don't think your example with land is directly comparable. Land is by nature a tangible good while the content in comics is intellectual property. It's possible to still enjoy the comic/story even when it's in a different media.

 

Mind, the upside with land on Mars is there are currently no property taxes. I reckon there are quite a number of real estate speculators that overpaid for worthless pieces of land and are now stuck with annual property taxes.

 

I'm now realizing I'm a very bad fit for this board. I joined for the wealth of information regarding proper comic book storage (for the few series I do collect in floppies for personal enjoyment). Ultimately though, I care more for the content rather than the physical medium. I should probably go back to lurking.

[Buzzetta]

I don't personally know anyone who buys digital comics, maybe that's a bigger thing in the US than the UK?

 

Anyone interested in a 9.8 (digital) Hulk 181 with white pages? Only a fraction of the real deal, $500, .

 

Yeah it might be good for just a quick read, but in my opinion, comic book collectors should want the real thing, even for modern comics. I mean surely you want to possibly have a return on your $3-$20 investment, rather than it just being something virtual in cyberspace of no value or collectability?

 

I want something physical to show for my money, surprises me some others don't think the same :-(

 

This is an excellent point and one that I actually wrestled with before subscribing to Marvel Unlimited. I buy and collect Spider-man... I am only interested in reading on a one and done basis everything else. The fact is that if I were to actually buy the issues that I read I would be stuck with comics sitting in boxes that I would have no long term love or use for that would only get me on average about 25-50 cents on the dollar if that. There would be a lot more wasted space of more nonsense.

 

However... at $70? a year and at a price of $4 a comic... As soon as I have read around 20 issues PER YEAR it is already paying for itself. If I read through 100 issues a year... that would have cost me $400 in the stores for stuff that I would have to then TRY to sell and maintain.

 

No thanks... I will buy my ASM to keep up the collection, spend $70 to read everything else and then put that money toward an extra Golden Age book or two and not spend my life tripping over boxes of comics.

 

After you pay 50% online for your books you can easily donate them to Goodwill or other charities. I understand your reasoning for not wanting them.

 

I just cant bring myself to turn my back on my monthly hobby. I don't feel bad about buying TPBs, but I will never buy digital.

 

 

Not for me. Even at 50% off cover price, Marvel Unlimited is worth it. I can easily turn my back on what I consider wasted purchases and use that money toward a GA book. (Now what you value as waste is different from what I value as waste so to each their own.) I used to talk to another boardie on a regular basis and that boardie would talk about how he wished he could buy certain back issues... meanwhile he was literally spending $150-200 a month on new comics. Cut out the new books, buy Marvel Unlimited or wait for a sale on other stuff and after 6 months (after digital fees) you have $1000 to play with toward that back issue you really wanted.

 

I just didn't get it and I still don't.

[Prince Namor]

 

What companies plan, and what happens, often don't jive. Like here. Marvels market share has plummeted. There are no new readers coming in.

Marvel hasn't lost sales, it's just that DC gained sales.

 

 

Marvel is really losing market share not total sales which was correctly already stated. DC decided to adopt a faster frequency for reboots and are now in the game.

 

 

I find it rather puzzling that most people are saying that Marvel is losing market share to DC, and yet the following Mayo article for April 2016 sales indicate that Marvel's market share is virtually double what DC's market share is.

 

I thought for awhile there several years ago, that Marvel and DC's market shares were almost the same with Marvel having just a slight lead.

 

 

There are countless articles online about what a great year for sales Marvel is having in 2016. Here's one, from April, but it still represents Q1, and we barely finished Q2 so I assume not too much has changed

 

http://www.cbr.com/mayo-report-marvels-marvelous-april-sales-dcs-rebirth-what-they-mean-to-retailers/

 

 

Based on Comichron's Diamond numbers, Marvel's market share, especially thanks to Star Wars, soared past DC's as the New 52 continued to fall, getting as high as 47% to 25% (April 2016)

With ReBirth, DC has pretty quickly reversed it.

August 2016 (4 months later), it shows DC at 44% to Marvel at 32%.

[Ryan.]

You can buy the reprint of Hulk 181 for cheap as well ;-)

 

Also, if you don't care about the value of them and only buying to read, then you surely don't have to worry about bagging and boarding them??? (so no extra cost)

 

For me, you buy comics to read, but I want a return on my investment if I choose too, I also like the fact that one issue every so often might become valuable, Walking Dead's. NYX etc etc

 

It's very clever to be able to sell things to people, where they don't actually have anything physically. I mean, a comic cost money to print, post out etc where a virtual one is just a few clicks and costs them nothing to make apart from the labor of the original art.

 

Why have ornaments, sculptures, belongings of any kind, when we can just have pictures on our Ipads, might as well have bare homes but for a bed and a chair.

 

To me a comparison would be to buy some land in Oakland, which I can walk through, sell on, yeah I might get mud on my shoes in the process which I have to clean off sometimes, or I might have to deal with rubbish someone has dumped there...

 

OR

 

I could pay the same amount of money for some land on MARS, not worry about getting my shoes dirty, or having to maintain it, I can just sit back in front of the fire and look at pictures on my Ipad?

 

Boy technology makes some of us lazy, I think the human race will end up like the characters in Wallie where we just are fat blobs that float around on hovering wheel chairs unable to use our legs, .

 

 

;-(

 

Some comics I read digitally. Some I collect the physical copy. Not sure where that puts me on the laziness scale.

[dupont2005]

 

Some comics I read digitally. Some I collect the physical copy. Not sure where that puts me on the laziness scale.

About halfway

[fastballspecial]

I don't personally know anyone who buys digital comics, maybe that's a bigger thing in the US than the UK?

 

Anyone interested in a 9.8 (digital) Hulk 181 with white pages? Only a fraction of the real deal, $500, .

 

Yeah it might be good for just a quick read, but in my opinion, comic book collectors should want the real thing, even for modern comics. I mean surely you want to possibly have a return on your $3-$20 investment, rather than it just being something virtual in cyberspace of no value or collectability?

 

I want something physical to show for my money, surprises me some others don't think the same :-(

 

This is an excellent point and one that I actually wrestled with before subscribing to Marvel Unlimited. I buy and collect Spider-man... I am only interested in reading on a one and done basis everything else. The fact is that if I were to actually buy the issues that I read I would be stuck with comics sitting in boxes that I would have no long term love or use for that would only get me on average about 25-50 cents on the dollar if that. There would be a lot more wasted space of more nonsense.

 

However... at $70? a year and at a price of $4 a comic... As soon as I have read around 20 issues PER YEAR it is already paying for itself. If I read through 100 issues a year... that would have cost me $400 in the stores for stuff that I would have to then TRY to sell and maintain.

 

No thanks... I will buy my ASM to keep up the collection, spend $70 to read everything else and then put that money toward an extra Golden Age book or two and not spend my life tripping over boxes of comics.

 

After you pay 50% online for your books you can easily donate them to Goodwill or other charities. I understand your reasoning for not wanting them.

 

I just cant bring myself to turn my back on my monthly hobby. I don't feel bad about buying TPBs, but I will never buy digital.

 

 

Not for me. Even at 50% off cover price, Marvel Unlimited is worth it. I can easily turn my back on what I consider wasted purchases and use that money toward a GA book. (Now what you value as waste is different from what I value as waste so to each their own.) I used to talk to another boardie on a regular basis and that boardie would talk about how he wished he could buy certain back issues... meanwhile he was literally spending $150-200 a month on new comics. Cut out the new books, buy Marvel Unlimited or wait for a sale on other stuff and after 6 months (after digital fees) you have $1000 to play with toward that back issue you really wanted.

 

I just didn't get it and I still don't.

 

For me and just me I feel like I turn my back on the medium in general going digital. I am very selective in what moderns I read, but I do read them and order accordingly or stop by my local shop depending on the book. I also buy at huge sales as well. I am selective who I buy from too. Granted my modern buying is way down. The content isn't what it used to be, but I still feel the need to support.

 

I still buy back issues all the time to fill holes, flip some and sell off some I have had for 30+ years for my kids education. To me and again only me I grew physically reading comics. I credit those comics with a lot of successes reading wise. I feel like a turn my back on the medium entirely by going digital.

 

I am not a set collector I really feel for those collectors. I just like good stories I can still sit down, read and enjoy and recommend. I am well passed paying top dollar for any modern book.

 

That type of cost you are laying is really excessive and using that example I don't blame you.

 

[RockyMullins]

I've been collecting comics since the mid 70's, and joined CGC boards several years ago to read the posts, and buy the occasional book or two.

 

Something I've noticed is the opinions here vs some of the boards on Facebook for comics are so different. These boards tend to have the more experienced collector, and business owners. You should see the difference on the Facebook pages...it lends me perspective on what newer collectors are buying and collecting overall. Many of them seem to think the new Marvel books are good....maybe because, in their inexperience, they think change = collectability = $

 

 

[Buzzetta]

I've been collecting comics since the mid 70's, and joined CGC boards several years ago to read the posts, and buy the occasional book or two.

 

Something I've noticed is the opinions here vs some of the boards on Facebook for comics are so different. These boards tend to have the more experienced collector, and business owners. You should see the difference on the Facebook pages...it lends me perspective on what newer collectors are buying and collecting overall. Many of them seem to think the new Marvel books are good....maybe because, in their inexperience, they think change = collectability = $

 

 

The difference between the Facebook groups and the boards are that those Facebook groups only allow active participants who align with the group creator's vision in comic books.

 

The CGC boards allow for most anyone to come and express their comments and opinions on the state of the industry. Sure there are time that the mods layeth the smacketh down on certain conversations but in my opinion they are pretty lenient compared to the Facebook group.

 

You can actually complain about a CGC graded book here. Over on the Facebook groups if you say anything that even suggests that CGC did something wrong or how they could improve you are chastised and banned.

 

You are right in they are also drinking 90's Kool Aid thinking that every modern variant will fund their grandchildren's education.

 

 

 

 

 

[comicquant]

Doing this months orders.

 

Wow Marvel. Just wow.

 

I'm back collecting after a 20 year hiatus and from my perspective everything has changed. Of all the changes the biggest disappointment for me personally has been the deviation from what I was used to when it comes to character lines and titles. However, there is a reason for it... They can produce these new titles quickly, cheaply and most importantly, digitally. The are now able to instantly gauge a titles viability within a market. We're witnessing the maturation of an industry thats always been a little late to the game. I think it will all work itself out and my guess is we'll eventually like what floats to the top.

[dupont2005]

I've been collecting comics since the mid 70's, and joined CGC boards several years ago to read the posts, and buy the occasional book or two.

 

Something I've noticed is the opinions here vs some of the boards on Facebook for comics are so different. These boards tend to have the more experienced collector, and business owners. You should see the difference on the Facebook pages...it lends me perspective on what newer collectors are buying and collecting overall. Many of them seem to think the new Marvel books are good....maybe because, in their inexperience, they think change = collectability = $

 

I think part of it could be younger fans don't remember a time when Marvel and DC didn't have ridiculous company wide crossovers twice a year. When nothing had a variant cover. When characters stayed dead for the most part. When comics didn't get renumbered. Not even when they changed titles. Tales To Astonish became Incredible Hulk but they didn't use it as an excuse to slap a new #1 on fifteen variant covers after an eight month event leading up to the change. Back when there was one Avengers title and one X-Men title. So for people who don't remember a time when comics were sold on the merits of their contents and were always sold on the merits of their eventual value as a collectors item because it's a first issue, or someone died again, or there's a new TV show, it won't bother them.

 

The other part is old people think everything new sucks. I'm guilty. I hate new cars, I hate new music, I hate new movies. I hate CGI, I hate sequels and reboots. I hate new comics, I hate reality TV. I hate celebrities who are famous because of Youtube or Vine or Instagram or a sex video that was "leaked" after they hired a professional pornographer to film it for them. I even hate the news and don't give a mess what Miley Cyrus did or who Johnny Depp is divorcing. There was a time you had to buy a tabloid mag to even know that stuff, now it's being told through every major news outlet.

 

Went on a little rant here, but yeah that's why young people don't hate new comics.

[rjrjr]

I don't personally know anyone who buys digital comics, maybe that's a bigger thing in the US than the UK?

 

This is not surprising:

 

Pamplets

Trade Paperbacks (about 50% of pamphlets)

Digital (20 - 25% of pamphlets)

 

Digital sales have slowed across the board for everything (books, newspapers, etc.) It is large enough to warrant its continuation, but it is doubtful it will overtake print in my lifetime. And I'm hoping to live another 50 years at least.

 

 

 

 

[rjrjr]

 

What companies plan, and what happens, often don't jive. Like here. Marvels market share has plummeted. There are no new readers coming in.

Marvel hasn't lost sales, it's just that DC gained sales.

 

 

Marvel is really losing market share not total sales which was correctly already stated. DC decided to adopt a faster frequency for reboots and are now in the game.

 

 

I find it rather puzzling that most people are saying that Marvel is losing market share to DC, and yet the following Mayo article for April 2016 sales indicate that Marvel's market share is virtually double what DC's market share is.

 

I thought for awhile there several years ago, that Marvel and DC's market shares were almost the same with Marvel having just a slight lead.

 

 

There are countless articles online about what a great year for sales Marvel is having in 2016. Here's one, from April, but it still represents Q1, and we barely finished Q2 so I assume not too much has changed

 

http://www.cbr.com/mayo-report-marvels-marvelous-april-sales-dcs-rebirth-what-they-mean-to-retailers/

 

 

 

April was 4 months ago. Things have changed in 5-6 months, namely the release of DC Rebirth titles.

[rjrjr]

I was just reading that Marvel's answer to the DC Rebirth titles ... even more hard to chase variants to get retailers to up their orders.