General discussion thread - keep the other threads clean 29 29

[Red84]

Maybe I should state my own view: I have nothing whatever against flipping. The deceptive part of this approach to me is that quoting GPA is presumably meant to provide potential buyers with some insight into FMV.

 

A price paid in a CLink auction -- rather than, say, a price paid in a private deal -- seems like a better indication of FMV than somewhat dated GPA data.

 

Granted, buyers ought to be able to do their own research, particularly when, as here, the CLink sale was recent enough to still be on their site. But the approach seems dodgy to me and I would be reluctant to buy from a seller who uses it.

 

Still not ok. Nothing wrong with flipping or asking more than you paid. Using GPA to intentionally deceive potential buyers is slimy.

[wombat]

AS long as the GPA data being stated is accurate I have no issue with the above examples.

[IntoAnother]

If you are going to cite data cite it correctly.

 

If you are going to make statements in your sales thread, make sure they are accurate.

 

BUT

 

The buyer cant expect the seller to do all the work.

 

Here's a scenario I've seen sometimes...

 

Buyer lists his GA 6.0 whatever for GPA price saying "not a lot of sales... one sale in grade in last 24 months, so I'm listing it for that" whatver...

 

what he doesn't mention is that a half grade higher (6.5) just sold on HA (and is listed in GPA) for for 30% less that the GPA record for his grade (which would make one think the market is correcting downward on his book).

 

Does he have to disclose the market sales of all of the grades around his book?

 

I say no. State the GPA info for your book in your grade and just leave it at that. No need to song and dance it, just let the book sell itself.

 

I can see your point (and Robert's) that as long as you quote GPA accurately, there is no problem. I would say, though, that if you know there is a recent CLink sale at a much lower price or other recent sales in higher grades at lower prices, then I think quoting GPA becomes questionable.

 

After all, what's the point of quoting GPA in a sales thread? Presumably the point is to argue that the GPA values quoted reflect current FMV in order to put your asking price in context. If, in fact, you know that GPA does not accurately reflect current FMV, then I think the more forthright approach is to avoid quoting it.

 

I agree that if the information a seller is providing is not the whole truth and the seller knows this due to the books purchase history, then the truth that works in the sellers favor is best to be left out. It is on any buyer to do homework when buying a book but I feel the boards hold a higher standard and I appreciate that.

 

For example, If I see a book that I have been looking for that doesn't surface often and see GPA quoted that assists a quick sale, I may take that information as fact and pull the trigger faster out of fear of missing the book. That is a example that may not come up often, but even that being the case I do not see it as an acceptable practice.

 

[Logan510]

This is probably going to be an unpopular opinion, but after all the years of being here and all the shenanigans, I honestly feel like buyers should just do whatever due diligence they are going to do, and either buy or don't buy. What the other guy paid for his copy should have no bearing on anything.

 

If every error of omission leads to the villagers lighting the torches, where does it all end? Doesn't the buyer either want it at the price, or he doesn't? Doesn't the buyer bear some responsibility to check the public data?

 

I'm not talking about fraud or active misleading. Just not being "comprehensive" in your info.

 

Don't mind me, it's beautiful weather, but taxes have me . . .

Go pop open a Stroh's and put a sock in it.

 

 

translation = STFU

 

And how much did you pay for that Hulk 181 you have listed?

 

:shrug:

 

I paid what the seller was asking

 

Great answer

[Logan510]

Flippers gonna flip

[VintageComics]

Speaking of price disclosure, any thoughts on this one?

 

I've seen people snag a book on CLink at an apparently well below FMV price and promptly list it for sale on the board at a higher price. No problem so far, but sometimes the seller quotes GPA to show how the price he is asking is at FMV or below.

 

Since CLink doesn't report prices to GPA, GPA will be missing the most relevant price info -- namely, the price at which this very copy has just sold.

 

Ok sales strategy? Kinda dodgy? Never buy from a guy who would do this dodgy?

 

The problem is in agreeing what is a 'reasonable' representation of data. For some people GPA is enough. For others it isn't.

 

I had a few common moving books for sale a while back and quoted GPA prices (averages, not cherry picked data).

 

Then someone decided to start posting comments and links to Clink sales prices in my selling thread because apparently the books were going cheaper there and they didn't like my GPA data. I didn't bother checking Comiclink but felt like I was being accused of cherry picking data, which I wasn't.

 

Did I do anything wrong? I don't think so. GPA or GoCollect are both reputable sites that collect large enough quantities of sales data for common books and IMO should be sufficient to please the average buyer.

 

And I just genuinely didn't think to check Clink. I mean, you start with one site and then can go in a zillion different directions and still not please everyone. I thought I was doing my due diligence when I supplied fair, GPA averages. No good deed goes unpunished.

 

I'm fine with GPA or GoCollect data (averages and not just cherry picking) and I'm also OK with a seller not disclosing where he may have gotten a steal on a book he's flipping. Because again, where do you draw the parameters?

 

That's just my personal

 

If I'm spending the dough I expect to do my own homework on a purchase.

 

 

 

[sacentaur]

Roy, I don't think you did anything wrong at all in the above described scenario.

 

Agreed that a seller needn't disclose what they paid for a book - it's irrelevant, either their asking price is reasonable or not.

 

In the specific case that Tony and I were referring to, the seller did cherry pick GPA data to give the impression that they were offering a 'bargain price' on the book, when in fact the opposite was true (as indicated by more recent GPA sales plus the fact that the seller had just bought the book in a CLink auction a few weeks earlier and was now trying to flip it for 50% more, aided by the cherry picked GPA).

 

There are some fine lines to be sure, and of course buyers should do their homework. However, when a seller is disingenuous and attempts to mislead the buyer, that's where I draw the line.

 

 

[VintageComics]

And that is why I qualify my post by using the term GPA averages and not cherry picking data.

 

I agree with you guys.

 

[THE_BEYONDER]

Once upon a time we'd just flame the offender into oblivion.

 

Are lynchings now frowned upon?

[thehumantorch]

And that is why I qualify my post by using the term GPA averages and not cherry picking data.

 

I agree with you guys.

 

Roy,, As long as you don't deliberately deceive someone or cherry pick data it's fine. Your job is to list the book and find a buyer. It's the buyer's job to determine if the price works for him.

 

And if someone finds books selling cheaper at one auction site over another and can profit from it more power to him. That's the reward for knowing the market and the venues better than the average bear.

[jsilverjanet]

And that is why I qualify my post by using the term GPA averages and not cherry picking data.

 

I agree with you guys.

 

Roy,, As long as you don't deliberately deceive someone or cherry pick data it's fine. Your job is to list the book and find a buyer. It's the buyer's job to determine if the price works for him.

 

And if someone finds books selling cheaper at one auction site over another and can profit from it more power to him. That's the reward for knowing the market and the venues better than the average bear.

 

Translation = Roy needs a haircut

[slym2none]

And that is why I qualify my post by using the term GPA averages and not cherry picking data.

 

I agree with you guys.

 

Roy,, As long as you don't deliberately deceive someone or cherry pick data it's fine. Your job is to list the book and find a buyer. It's the buyer's job to determine if the price works for him.

 

And if someone finds books selling cheaper at one auction site over another and can profit from it more power to him. That's the reward for knowing the market and the venues better than the average bear.

 

 

 

 

-slym

[NP_Gresham]

When someone is asking double of GPA on raw books, is it bad form to PM an offer well under the ask? (around GPA)

I usually keep my offers within +/or/- 10%, so I usually just skip those sellers, just not sure if it is ok to send the offer.

[I like pie]

I don't think its bad form at all. I would first ask if there's wiggle room in the asking price and subtly reference GPA pricing. Doesn't hurt to ask.

[comix4fun]

I don't think its bad form at all. I would first ask if there's wiggle room in the asking price and subtly reference GPA pricing. Doesn't hurt to ask.

 

 

 

In terms of "wiggle room" if they guy is pricing raws at 200% GPA he's going to have to do a full on watusi to get into the realm of reality.

[I like pie]

I don't think its bad form at all. I would first ask if there's wiggle room in the asking price and subtly reference GPA pricing. Doesn't hurt to ask.

 

 

 

In terms of "wiggle room" if they guy is pricing raws at 200% GPA he's going to have to do a full on watusi to get into the realm of reality.

 

I just thought it may be better etiquette then, "Hey dummy, do you want to sell the book or not?"

[jsilverjanet]

[ChiSoxFan]

[Jeffro.]

Not accusing this seller of any wrong doing except maybe a lack of common sense.

No returns on slabbed books and yet uses a small, blurry scan with some glare for good measure

 

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9297998#Post9297998

[CAHokie]

At least you only have to pay a 4% fee for the convenience of using Pay Pal and the seller getting his money immediately! Is PP really up to 4% now?