Don Rosa Poll - Pedigree or Collection?

[Aman619]

listening to "modern" radio, you mean! this was the old times..

[Darthdiesel]

Bah... i've crahpped out more 9.8s

 

 

Too bad they were common "bronze" poopings! I'll Paypal you some cash, can you poop out another Flash #1 in 9.6?

 

 

Is that a challenge? don't make me go into my cupboards!

[Shield]

Bah... i've crahpped out more 9.8s

 

 

Too bad they were common "bronze" poopings! I'll Paypal you some cash, can you poop out another Flash #1 in 9.6?

 

 

Is that a challenge? don't make me go into my cupboards!

 

Sure enough - you'd poop out a nice juicy Edgar Church condition copy of Action #1 - then just SHOVE IT INTO YOUR CUPBOARDS!

 

Seriously, it's a challege. I'll paypal you a nice bran muffin and a decaf coffee!

 

(Crickets chirping in NW Australia, where Mushroom is trying to figure out how to backpeddal on his inaccurate statements!) Hey 'shroom, maybe the Dingo ate your baby!

[Shield]

listening to "modern" radio, you mean! this was the old times..

 

True! Of course I have an extensive collection of 1940's music in .mp3 format..good stuff!

[The Black Hand ®]

 

I think we get the point....

 

Whew! The point being when you get into a debate with Shield, do your homework.

[Shield]

The only reason I went crazy on him is because his "facts" were way off, and he was putting down a man on his death bed. Saying he couldn't be bothered with getting rid of his collection. Horrible.

[Aman619]

why cant it be a Pedigree from a later era? Is it HIS fault all of the books we now consider keys were published BEFORE he began accumulating his pristine well cared for collection of EVERY comics ever sold (except 2 publishers??)

What are you getting so worked up for? You make it sound like some grave injustice has occurred and that his collection should be burned because it doesn't qualify for pedigree status. Just because it's not a "pedigree" doesn't mean it's not a great collection. The high grades and high prices Don is achieving shows that collectors place plenty of value on his books.

 

And in fact, the fact that the keys were published before he began accumulating his collection DOES make all the difference in the world. How many people were carefully storing their comic collections before 1964? The answer is apparently not many, otherwise why would people have such a hard time finding HG copies? How many people were storing their comic collections in 1965? Apparently, a whole lot, because the number of HG copies from 1965 and later is exponentially higher.

 

Flipped around, you are stating that if there are no more key books after 1964, then that means there can be no more Pedigree collections??

Yes! Although actually my point is more about collecting habits rather than keys. It just so happens that many of the early keys are hard to find in HG because they were produced before good preservation really caught on.

 

PS - - I dont own any of them... I just argue that its complete, its high grade and theyre fabulous!!

I don't disagree. But that's "all" they are.

 

Lets see 20 more such collections turn up. THEN we can know for sure that "everybody" was putting away equal collections. Maybe they are out there.... I dont think THIS one should be penalized on the ASSUMPTION of being run-of-the-mill.

I have no doubt that there are at least 20 similar late SA/early BA collections out there, and they probably will continue to turn up. However, I would also point out that a lot of similar quality collections have already emerged, they just weren't marketed as such and trickled out piecemeal. Or do you think all those 9.4 and higher copies of so many late SA books existed in isolation?

 

Do I sound worked up?? thats funny, because I thought the same thing about Shields replies to MY posts!!

So maybe I ratcheted up my reply to his reply in kind. Im finding it increasingly hard to believe we are lal so far apart on this.

 

You guys are outright AGEISTS!! To me, in the the continuum of the comics collecting business, comics DO become more plentiful in grade as time approached the present. But you both fail to appreciate the middle ages of comics history. You want to stop the clock in 1964 or 5. Im saying that as time keeps moving on, thats becoming an elitist position. Understandable sure, cause GA and SA are much scarcer to find HG runs in OO collections. But Rosas books encompass the period immediately following the Sacred Eras. Maybe I cant convince either of you, but I have nno problem with Rosa Pedigree status. And it IS an official Pedigree as was posted earlier since CGC puts it on the label. Course thats just one opinion...

[Mushroom]

The only reason I went crazy on him is because his "facts" were way off, and he was putting down a man on his death bed. Saying he couldn't be bothered with getting rid of his collection. Horrible.

 

You sir make me sick..........

 

I did not cast any aspersions against Edgar Church at all and the fact that you turned my comments into a personal attack on a man I don't know I find personally offensive. The purpose of my post was to show that your sugar coated version of the church pedigree has no basis in fact. Nobody talked to Edgar church, nobody knew his motivations or what he intended to happen with the collection.

 

YOU DON"T KNOW........it is all fantasy.

 

I would suggest that you stop putting words in my mouth and making slurs about me. Your ignorance and complete disregard for alternative approaches and your lack of understanding of fact makes you a small minded buffoon.......

[tth2]

You guys are outright AGEISTS!! To me, in the the continuum of the comics collecting business, comics DO become more plentiful in grade as time approached the present. But you both fail to appreciate the middle ages of comics history. You want to stop the clock in 1964 or 5. Im saying that as time keeps moving on, thats becoming an elitist position. Understandable sure, cause GA and SA are much scarcer to find HG runs in OO collections. But Rosas books encompass the period immediately following the Sacred Eras. Maybe I cant convince either of you, but I have nno problem with Rosa Pedigree status. And it IS an official Pedigree as was posted earlier since CGC puts it on the label. Course thats just one opinion...

I'm not an age-ist, I'm a scarce-ist. However, the two happen to go hand in hand quite often.

 

Look, if you hold true to your principles, then over the next 10-25 years I hope you'll be ready to recognize a zillion new pedigrees as zillions of ultra-HG, complete Copper and Modern collections are brought out. If you don't, then you'll have all the Copper and Modern collectors accusing you of being a BA elitist ageist.

[Shield]

The only reason I went crazy on him is because his "facts" were way off, and he was putting down a man on his death bed. Saying he couldn't be bothered with getting rid of his collection. Horrible.

 

You sir make me sick..........

 

I did not cast any aspersions against Edgar Church at all and the fact that you turned my comments into a personal attack on a man I don't know I find personally offensive. The purpose of my post was to show that your sugar coated version of the church pedigree has no basis in fact. Nobody talked to Edgar church, nobody knew his motivations or what he intended to happen with the collection.

 

YOU DON"T KNOW........it is all fantasy.

 

I would suggest that you stop putting words in my mouth and making slurs about me. Your ignorance and complete disregard for alternative approaches and your lack of understanding of fact makes you a small minded buffoon.......

 

 

Of course it would make anyone sick to be so completely dominated in a heated discussion. Sorry to have shown you the errors of your ways in such an unforgiving manner. You last post is a laughable backpedal. That's the best you've got? Go back and read your own posts, such as

 

Are you re-writing history now shield..... Church didn't do this great collection thing of buying and preserving ephemera ....he lucked out. To be honest I know he was doing this reference thing but he was also damn lazy and probably couldn't be bothered dumping it . Please don't try and paint him as a saint.....

 

and

 

and how the hell would you know........

 

He was an illustrator.... he actually cut up some books .... the books he bought he just shoved in cupboards .....he didn't contact anybody to say that he had this massive collection that he lovingly preserved.... you are the crazy one... show me the evidence that he knowingly and with forethought determined he would protect these books for later generations or did the conditions and his lack of interest in reading the material and the geographics make for a great result......

 

well???

 

and as for your absolute prejudice around GA....well that kind of snobbery is not very becoming.

 

With all those collectors doing the same thing as Don Rosa...well where the hell are they. They must be owned by rich people who don't need the money that CGC has driven for HG books.

 

I've proven basically everything YOU'VE said as being factually incorrect. Wake me up when you have a better rebuttal - I guarantee you know you're wrong.

 

You're the one with the lack of understanding for facts, and I don't need to call you names, like a buffoon. You're doing quite a good job showing your lack of knowledge about the Church collection. Anything above in bold is either flat out wrong or something I've proven in my last few posts. It's ok, 'shroom, go read the link I've provided from the Mile High website, since obviously you're not reading what I've posted above.

 

Mushroom=PWN3D.

[Shield]

I'm not an age-ist, I'm a scarce-ist. However, the two happen to go hand in hand quite often.

 

Look, if you hold true to your principles, then over the next 10-25 years I hope you'll be ready to recognize a zillion new pedigrees as zillions of ultra-HG, complete Copper and Modern collections are brought out. If you don't, then you'll have all the Copper and Modern collectors accusing you of being a BA elitist ageist.

 

I too am a scarce-ist!

 

Great post by the way, tth2. Any comments on our friend Mushroom's posts about Edgar Church?

[FFB]

The only reason I went crazy on him is because his "facts" were way off, and he was putting down a man on his death bed. Saying he couldn't be bothered with getting rid of his collection. Horrible.

 

You sir make me sick..........

 

I did not cast any aspersions against Edgar Church at all and the fact that you turned my comments into a personal attack on a man I don't know I find personally offensive. The purpose of my post was to show that your sugar coated version of the church pedigree has no basis in fact. Nobody talked to Edgar church, nobody knew his motivations or what he intended to happen with the collection.

 

YOU DON"T KNOW........it is all fantasy.

 

I would suggest that you stop putting words in my mouth and making slurs about me. Your ignorance and complete disregard for alternative approaches and your lack of understanding of fact makes you a small minded buffoon.......

 

 

Of course it would make anyone sick to be so completely dominated in a heated discussion. Sorry to have shown you the errors of your ways in such an unforgiving manner. You last post is a laughable backpedal. That's the best you've got? Go back and read your own posts, such as

 

Are you re-writing history now shield..... Church didn't do this great collection thing of buying and preserving ephemera ....he lucked out. To be honest I know he was doing this reference thing but he was also damn lazy and probably couldn't be bothered dumping it . Please don't try and paint him as a saint.....

 

and

 

and how the hell would you know........

 

He was an illustrator.... he actually cut up some books .... the books he bought he just shoved in cupboards .....he didn't contact anybody to say that he had this massive collection that he lovingly preserved.... you are the crazy one... show me the evidence that he knowingly and with forethought determined he would protect these books for later generations or did the conditions and his lack of interest in reading the material and the geographics make for a great result......

 

well???

 

and as for your absolute prejudice around GA....well that kind of snobbery is not very becoming.

 

With all those collectors doing the same thing as Don Rosa...well where the hell are they. They must be owned by rich people who don't need the money that CGC has driven for HG books.

 

I've proven basically everything YOU'VE said as being factually incorrect. Wake me up when you have a better rebuttal - I guarantee you know you're wrong.

 

You're the one with the lack of understanding for facts, and I don't need to call you names, like a buffoon. You're doing quite a good job showing your lack of knowledge about the Church collection. Anything above in bold is either flat out wrong or something I've proven in my last few posts. It's ok, 'shroom, go read the link I've provided from the Mile High website, since obviously you're not reading what I've posted above.

 

Mushroom=PWN3D.

 

You haven't proved a thing! All you've done is cite Chuck's own fairy tale as proof of what you say, and you didn't even start your sentences with the disclaimer "According to lore and legend," which is required by the laws of all 50 states, Canada, and Mexico.

[Aman619]

You guys are outright AGEISTS!! To me, in the the continuum of the comics collecting business, comics DO become more plentiful in grade as time approached the present. But you both fail to appreciate the middle ages of comics history. You want to stop the clock in 1964 or 5. Im saying that as time keeps moving on, thats becoming an elitist position. Understandable sure, cause GA and SA are much scarcer to find HG runs in OO collections. But Rosas books encompass the period immediately following the Sacred Eras. Maybe I cant convince either of you, but I have nno problem with Rosa Pedigree status. And it IS an official Pedigree as was posted earlier since CGC puts it on the label. Course thats just one opinion...

I'm not an age-ist, I'm a scarce-ist. However, the two happen to go hand in hand quite often.

 

Look, if you hold true to your principles, then over the next 10-25 years I hope you'll be ready to recognize a zillion new pedigrees as zillions of ultra-HG, complete Copper and Modern collections are brought out. If you don't, then you'll have all the Copper and Modern collectors accusing you of being a BA elitist ageist.

 

I think there is a big difference between late SA and Early BA and what is now Crappper and Modern Ages. The "cat" may have been out of the bag on collecting in 1965, but, the guys doing it successfully, thoroughly and meticulously putting aside 9.2 thru 9.6 copies in their runs and preserving them that way for 30 more years is FAR FAR less than those doing it in each succeeding decade. Lots of guys like me kept all our funnybooks too, in "sweet" condition. But nowhere near as nice as the pedigree guys' books. These guys were the exception, the few at the top end of the bell curve. The rest of us kept our books, but read them, moved them, loaned them out, took them to summer camp! etc.

 

And the game was definitely over in mid BA with warehouse finds totally flooding the availability ranks. Meaning not only were many of the SOLD copies preserved, but the UNSOLD ones were too! Ironically in better condidion than the ones bought off the racks by archivist collectors.

 

If Rosa 60s books are as nice as his BA books??? No question this is a special Pedigree collection.

[Aman619]

And as for being a scarcist, I do not think having scarce books has ever been a criteria for a Pedigree. Just a side benefit of many of them.

[Shield]

You haven't proved a thing! All you've done is cite Chuck's own fairy tale as proof of what you say, and you didn't even start your sentences with the disclaimer "According to lore and legend," which is required by the laws of all 50 states, Canada, and Mexico.

 

[Aman619]

I somehow thought FFB always leaned toward believing Chucks tale, or giving him the benefit of the doubt? Either way, I am glad he is one of us NOT on the Chuckwagon of Bullcwap.

[FFB]

I somehow thought FFB always leaned toward believing Chucks tale, or giving him the benefit of the doubt? Either way, I am glad he is one of us NOT on the Chuckwagon of Bullcwap.

 

Aman, I love ya, but you've gotta learn to spot facetiousness when it is staring you in the face.

[Aman619]

wow. never saw it d'oh!

[Illiterati-migration]

I somehow thought FFB always leaned toward believing Chucks tale, or giving him the benefit of the doubt? Either way, I am glad he is one of us NOT on the Chuckwagon of Bullcwap.

 

 

Was someone looking for me?

[Shield]

I somehow thought FFB always leaned toward believing Chucks tale, or giving him the benefit of the doubt? Either way, I am glad he is one of us NOT on the Chuckwagon of Bullcwap.

 

 

Was someone looking for me?

 

Stop it - my LCD screen at work just round-house kicked me in the face!