They're Still Out There! 22 22

[pemart1966]

1 hour ago, Mmehdy said:

I think that your statement of opinion  on what you define as a" true comic book collector" can be challenged. My definition does limit to "old school: collectors who were at the dinosaur age of comic book collecting. That is NOT my definition. A "true comic book collector" can come on board any time, any place. My definition is simple...a comic book collector who buys the GA/SA comic book FOR the book itself. The art, cover, ownership with a purpose. The non -true  comic book collector in my book is not any part of a true comic book  collector at all. They are buying widgets whether it is Gold futures or Lumber. They can care less about fandom, about the art and true beauty of a comic book. There sole purpose is to buy low and sell high and never look back. There needs to be a dividing line in our great Ga/Sa comic book world to differentiate between the two in my opinion. My definition is "True comic book collector"  is those who have a emotional connection to our great GA/SA world...Man Women, Child some  human connection other than greed itself. The speculators have none and are devoid of any emotional connection. I am a true comic book collector and I love Ga/SA and every aspect of our world, whether its 50 plus years for me, or 50 minutes for you...we are all on the same page.

 Your post itself does what you dislike the most. It categorizes old (Grumpy) vs new collectors and it is just not that simple. In the fact the answer is very simple...it is where your heart lies in the GA/SA comic book world that really counts.

But what stinks in this whole scenario is that the speculators are responsible in large part for driving prices up forcing some of the "true collectors" out of the acquisition picture.

Do "true collectors" have any more right to a book than speculators?  Probably not AND sellers are probably thankful for speculators for helping drive prices to ever increasing heights.  But for a "true collector" that may just want a book or two out of this collection - it stinks.

[lou_fine]

On 5/8/2021 at 3:30 PM, buttock said:

On 5/8/2021 at 2:34 PM, GreatCaesarsGhost said:

If there’s anyone that doesn’t believe at least some of the Promise Collection books are overgraded, let’s play a game. If this is a 9.2 . . . 

 

The second copy with the big stains on the back cover and tear at the staple is probably a 7.0 or 7.5.  Can you not see those defects? I mean it's pretty clear which is the nicer copy, although the second one looks great before you turn it over.  But you can't just ignore glaring defects.  

The only problem I see with playing this game is that it's not being played on a level playing field.  

If this exact same copy here had not been submitted as part of the Pormise Collection pedigree set of books with its known and now seemingly acceptable signature defects, and simply submitted as a random HG GA book by a collector, I highly doubt it would come back encased in a CGC 9.2 holder.  Especially since I believe the graders would nit pick and hit the grade of the book for the clearly visible chips along the top edge of the cover, the huge dust shadow running down the entire length of the back cover, not too sure about the staple area from just a scan, and the large writing on the front cover.    

Just like you yourself said in your above post, "Can you not see those defects...........you can't just ignore glaring defects."  .  

Edited May 10, 2021 by lou_fine

[Comcav]

4 minutes ago, sfcityduck said:

If they wanted to ensure their anonymity, there would be no story.  The story they have told likely gives up too much information for the family to stay anonymous.  

Or, we could opt to be decent human beings and leave them alone.  There is enough info to make it a human interest piece, not a owner reveal.  But there is no upside in digging around.  They do not want to talk to the press, I for one will adamantly respect their right for privacy.

[pemart1966]

8 minutes ago, sfcityduck said:

If they wanted to ensure their anonymity, there would be no story.  The story they have told likely gives up too much information for the family to stay anonymous.  

 

11 minutes ago, Funnybooks said:

If they wanted to be anonymous, there would be much less story attached to the collection?

If they didn't give up any of their story, they'd have to call it the "Anonymous Pedigree".  

Someone is a good detective if they can track them down based on two first names which could have been made up...

 

 

Edited May 10, 2021 by pemart1966

[innocuous]

1 hour ago, Mmehdy said:

My definition is simple...a comic book collector who buys the GA/SA comic book FOR the book itself. The art, cover, ownership with a purpose.

This eliminates a lot of "collectors" on this board. Not just from other ages, but also with other motivations, such as collecting based on historical or cultural significance.

[Funnybooks]

1 minute ago, Comcav said:

Or, we could opt to be decent human beings and leave them alone.  There is enough info to make it a human interest piece, not a owner reveal.  But there is no upside in digging around.  They do not want to talk to the press, I for one will adamantly respect their right for privacy.

We are not entitled to anything more than what the family wishes to reveal regarding the origin of these books and now the Promise collection. Enjoy them for what they are and let's celebrate having access to one of the most important OO collections this hobby has ever seen. We'll all need to agree to disagree but let's not disparage the collection or how Heritage wishes to handle the consignment. Ultimately, our words can negatively impact the value of the books and thus hurting the monetary return the family will achieve.

[Funnybooks]

4 minutes ago, pemart1966 said:

 

If they didn't give up any of their story, they'd have to call it the "Anonymous Pedigree".  

Someone is a good detective if they can track them down based on two first names which could have been made up...

 

 

They could have labeled it the Mars collection and that the original owners left the books in the attic of the Chichen Itza when they left earth and we would still be fascinated by the new pedigree. 

[lou_fine]

On 5/9/2021 at 12:12 AM, Courageous Cat said:

On 5/8/2021 at 1:57 PM, MrBedrock said:

If CBCS had graded this collection imagine how many 10.0s we would be seeing!

kinda looks like CBCS grading actually 

Actually, I believe the grading from CBCS is a lot more consistent as compared to what we are seeing here.  

With the seeming inconsistency and seeming lowered grading standards being applied to the Promise Collection, it's probably actually approaching PGX grading standards. 

[MrBedrock]

4 hours ago, buttock said:

This concept of "I'm a true collector and you're not" really needs to die a sad whimpering death.  Just because someone doesn't collect exactly the same way you did doesn't mean they're not a "true collector".  I'd love to hear anyone give me a definition of what a "true collector" is. 

sacentaur

[sagii]

@Comcavactive in a NON sales Thread!!!

[MrBedrock]

1 hour ago, Mmehdy said:

I think that your statement of opinion  on what you define as a" true comic book collector" can be challenged. My definition does limit to "old school: collectors who were at the dinosaur age of comic book collecting. That is NOT my definition. A "true comic book collector" can come on board any time, any place. My definition is simple...a comic book collector who buys the GA/SA comic book FOR the book itself. The art, cover, ownership with a purpose. The non -true  comic book collector in my book is not any part of a true comic book  collector at all. They are buying widgets whether it is Gold futures or Lumber. They can care less about fandom, about the art and true beauty of a comic book. There sole purpose is to buy low and sell high and never look back. There needs to be a dividing line in our great Ga/Sa comic book world to differentiate between the two in my opinion. My definition is "True comic book collector"  is those who have a emotional connection to our great GA/SA world...Man Women, Child some  human connection other than greed itself. The speculators have none and are devoid of any emotional connection. I am a true comic book collector and I love Ga/SA and every aspect of our world, whether its 50 plus years for me, or 50 minutes for you...we are all on the same page.

 Your post itself does what you dislike the most. It categorizes old (Grumpy) vs new collectors and it is just not that simple. In the fact the answer is very simple...it is where your heart lies in the GA/SA comic book world that really counts.

Mitch, the problem with your definition is that if those older collectors "who have a emotional connection to our great GA/SA world" truly felt that way then why are they overwhelmingly the ones who try to beat comic dealers up on price? If they truly felt that way then money should be no object.

[skypinkblu]

5 minutes ago, MrBedrock said:

Mitch, the problem with your definition is that if those older collectors "who have a emotional connection to our great GA/SA world" truly felt that way then why are they overwhelmingly the ones who try to beat comic dealers up on price? If they truly felt that way then money should be no object.

Money can be no object if you HAVE the money to spend. I remember seeing books 20 years ago that I couldn't even imagine buying that I might be able to now.

With that being said, there is no reason to beat up people when you want to buy something, either you can or you  can't afford it.

[MrBedrock]

1 minute ago, skypinkblu said:

either you can or you  can't afford it.

Simple as that.

[Funnybooks]

1 hour ago, Mmehdy said:

I think that your statement of opinion  on what you define as a" true comic book collector" can be challenged. My definition does limit to "old school: collectors who were at the dinosaur age of comic book collecting. That is NOT my definition. A "true comic book collector" can come on board any time, any place. My definition is simple...a comic book collector who buys the GA/SA comic book FOR the book itself. The art, cover, ownership with a purpose. The non -true  comic book collector in my book is not any part of a true comic book  collector at all. They are buying widgets whether it is Gold futures or Lumber. They can care less about fandom, about the art and true beauty of a comic book. There sole purpose is to buy low and sell high and never look back. There needs to be a dividing line in our great Ga/Sa comic book world to differentiate between the two in my opinion. My definition is "True comic book collector"  is those who have a emotional connection to our great GA/SA world...Man Women, Child some  human connection other than greed itself. The speculators have none and are devoid of any emotional connection. I am a true comic book collector and I love Ga/SA and every aspect of our world, whether its 50 plus years for me, or 50 minutes for you...we are all on the same page.

 

I believe your definition is too narrow and that we all collect differently.  I have both an emotional connection to my books and to my money, so that makes me "less" of a true collector?

As a true collector, if money were not a factor, would you be willing to sell your books at cost in the future? Better yet, have you ever sold a book for a profit?

Curious mind?

[Funnybooks]

13 minutes ago, MrBedrock said:

That is a pretty interesting statement, coming from Bleeding Cool - the same online muckraking website that goes out of its way to disrespect the privacy wishes of retailers and publishers industry wide.

Agenda much?

[sfcityduck]

39 minutes ago, Comcav said:

Or, we could opt to be decent human beings and leave them alone.  There is enough info to make it a human interest piece, not a owner reveal.  But there is no upside in digging around.  They do not want to talk to the press, I for one will adamantly respect their right for privacy.

We've seen this story before.  Tom Reilly.  Never verified.  It is naïve to think that if you put out a story to hype a collection you want to sell, to create an emotional reaction, no one is going to attempt to verify the story.  

[MrBedrock]

2 minutes ago, Funnybooks said:

Agenda much?

Me? Or William?

[ThothAmon]

21 minutes ago, MrBedrock said:

Bleeding Cool

I only look at Bleeding Cool when someone links it in a post here but it seems interesting that the linked “article” indicates it is a “heritage auctions sponsored post”  Not a news story but a paid for Heritage advertisement I would guess?  Not that there’s anything wrong with that but it’s certainly not journalism and is nothing more than marketing.   

 

[pemart1966]

52 minutes ago, Funnybooks said:

We are not entitled to anything more than what the family wishes to reveal regarding the origin of these books and now the Promise collection. Enjoy them for what they are and let's celebrate having access to one of the most important OO collections this hobby has ever seen. We'll all need to agree to disagree but let's not disparage the collection or how Heritage wishes to handle the consignment. Ultimately, our words can negatively impact the value of the books and thus hurting the monetary return the family will achieve.

I don't know that there's been any disparaging talk in this thread.  What there has been is healthy discussion as to whether, in some cases, the grade is congruent with the physical book.  That's good discussion to have. 

Let's face it.  This isn't a charity auction.  No one is approaching bidding with altruistic thoughts.  Buyers, be they "true comic book collectors" or speculators, want to buy these books for as little as possible.  The consignors and Heritage on the other hand, would like to see world record prices set for every book.

[Spyder!]

To me, a "true collector" is someone who gets drunk, goes online, and buys a comic book they never would have purchased if sober.