Superman: The Man of Steel #17 & 18 (Doomsday) 3 3

[bryan91]

The Death of Superman was ridiculous. It was precisely the type of story aimed at 8 year old boys, with 8 year old reasoning. Nothing was explained, there was no buildup, there was no backstory, this guy just decided to show up and wallop Superman, and 7 issues later, Supes is dead?

 

Stupid.

 

If I was 8, I would have thought it was the greatest thing ever, just like I thought the Poseidon Adventure was the greatest movie ever when I was 8.

 

The only clever part was the decreasing number of panels per book. That was kinda cool.

 

 

[kimik]

I know this isn't "NEW" info, but upon reviewing those pictures leaked from the JL/BvS set(s) it does appear that folks are leaving flowers for Superman by his destroyed memorial statue.

 

If that doesn't smell and look like a Death of Superman/Doomsday sequeway I don't know what is. If you're going to "kill" superman on the big screen, why not cull it straight from the already established and well known story?

Come to think of it, DC/WB seems to be on a trajectory to do their most critically acclaimed storylines.....The Dark Knight Returns is B vs S after all....and they've done the whole animated route already.

They've also done the Death of Superman arc as animation....so it'd be natural for the live action version to follow.

The finale of the JL movie is probably going to see Supes "dead", with the aftermath explored in other movies (Flash/GL Teamup, Shazam, WW, etc.) and a resolution in either JL 2 or MOS 2.

 

http://thebananadoc.wordpress.com/2014/06/25/more-spoilers-from-todays-shoot-in-pontiac/

 

My that they do a Kingdom Come movie/movies as an Elseworlds kind of thing at some point as well. That would be awesome to see on the big screen......

[Brandon Shepherd]

Also, whatever happened to everyone admitting that the "death of Superman" storyline just sucked in general?? It was laughed at back then, so I don't understand what makes it worth revisiting all these years later. I never got the feeling that Doomsday had any long term potential back then and don't see any real development in his character now. Maybe they bring him out for a villain role in the new movie coming out, but Bane had two movies and that book seems capped.

 

In terms of revisiting all these years later, you have to think about all the collectors out there who were started on comics because of this. There are a lot of us, including myself, who collect this set for the nostalgia, and that can be good for dealers. But, when removing the nostalgic lens, this storyline falls short.

[Broke as a Joke]

Also, whatever happened to everyone admitting that the "death of Superman" storyline just sucked in general?? It was laughed at back then, so I don't understand what makes it worth revisiting all these years later. I never got the feeling that Doomsday had any long term potential back then and don't see any real development in his character now. Maybe they bring him out for a villain role in the new movie coming out, but Bane had two movies and that book seems capped.

 

In terms of revisiting all these years later, you have to think about all the collectors out there who were started on comics because of this. There are a lot of us, including myself, who collect this set for the nostalgia, and that can be good for dealers. But, when removing the nostalgic lens, this storyline falls short.

 

Believe me I'm not out to ruin somebody's nostalgic memories of a comic book story. There are books I enjoyed as a kid that I cringe at now. Regardless of how one may feel about the Death of Superman storyline, this thread seems more focused on Doomsday, as it should be. I don't see how the character can evolve into a top tier villain, when he is always depicted as just a big brute.

[Brandon Shepherd]

Also, whatever happened to everyone admitting that the "death of Superman" storyline just sucked in general?? It was laughed at back then, so I don't understand what makes it worth revisiting all these years later. I never got the feeling that Doomsday had any long term potential back then and don't see any real development in his character now. Maybe they bring him out for a villain role in the new movie coming out, but Bane had two movies and that book seems capped.

 

In terms of revisiting all these years later, you have to think about all the collectors out there who were started on comics because of this. There are a lot of us, including myself, who collect this set for the nostalgia, and that can be good for dealers. But, when removing the nostalgic lens, this storyline falls short.

 

Believe me I'm not out to ruin somebody's nostalgic memories of a comic book story. There are books I enjoyed as a kid that I cringe at now. Regardless of how one may feel about the Death of Superman storyline, this thread seems more focused on Doomsday, as it should be. I don't see how the character can evolve into a top tier villain, when he is always depicted as just a big brute.

 

No worries,I agree, Doomsday was not the most original or fascinating villain. At least Bane had a back story and a brain.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Now, the hysteria SURROUNDING the Death of Superman...now THAT was the real entertainment. That was way, way better than the actual story itself

 

It was the very last vestiges of the old conventional wisdom...that comic books were worthless, kid's entertainment, best suited for the trash can...swept out with the early morning breeze, and the new era,..where comic books were all instant collector's items, and everyone had to save them in perfect condition, and you would be able to send your kids to college one day with them...was officially inaugurated.

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

By the way...the first no-contest "second printing" based on sellout demand that Marvel ever did?

 

Ghost Rider #1, 1990.

What constitutes this being "no-contest"? While I'm not informed about the G.I. Joe reprints, the first issue of The 'Nam quickly went to a second printing due to demand in 1986. (I first started collecting right around this time, and the reprint was on sale around the same time as issue 3 or 4.)

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

Turok #1 sold 1.75 million copies to the Direct market...and it was only the SIXTH highest selling book of 1993 (MOS #22, Supes #78, Action #687, Adventures #500, 501.)

And the 5th for the month it was released (same month as launch of Reign of the Supermen)

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

Thanks. It seems to the general audience, a 9.8 is "perfect" and a 9.9 or 10 must be hand-assembled by Benedictine monks or something.

For shame! That might result in fingerprints.

[GeeksAreMyPeeps]

The Death of Superman was ridiculous. It was precisely the type of story aimed at 8 year old boys, with 8 year old reasoning. Nothing was explained, there was no buildup, there was no backstory, this guy just decided to show up and wallop Superman, and 7 issues later, Supes is dead?

 

Stupid.

 

If I was 8, I would have thought it was the greatest thing ever, just like I thought the Poseidon Adventure was the greatest movie ever when I was 8.

 

The only clever part was the decreasing number of panels per book. That was kinda cool.

The bigger problem with the story is that Superman would find a way of winning that doesn't constitute just walloping Doomsday.

[divad]

The Death of Superman was ridiculous. It was precisely the type of story aimed at 8 year old boys, with 8 year old reasoning. Nothing was explained, there was no buildup, there was no backstory, this guy just decided to show up and wallop Superman, and 7 issues later, Supes is dead?

 

Stupid.

 

If I was 8, I would have thought it was the greatest thing ever, just like I thought the Poseidon Adventure was the greatest movie ever when I was 8.

 

The only clever part was the decreasing number of panels per book. That was kinda cool.

 

 

Which, of course, is why the then 8-year olds are now scrambling to buy copies of these. (thumbs u

[valiantman]

By the way...the first no-contest "second printing" based on sellout demand that Marvel ever did?

 

Ghost Rider #1, 1990.

What constitutes this being "no-contest"? While I'm not informed about the G.I. Joe reprints, the first issue of The 'Nam quickly went to a second printing due to demand in 1986. (I first started collecting right around this time, and the reprint was on sale around the same time as issue 3 or 4.)

Wouldn't Star Wars reprints be a result of demand?

Or, are we somehow separating second prints from reprints (which come out second)?

[porcupine48]

By the way...the first no-contest "second printing" based on sellout demand that Marvel ever did?

 

Ghost Rider #1, 1990.

What constitutes this being "no-contest"? While I'm not informed about the G.I. Joe reprints, the first issue of The 'Nam quickly went to a second printing due to demand in 1986. (I first started collecting right around this time, and the reprint was on sale around the same time as issue 3 or 4.)

Wouldn't Star Wars reprints be a result of demand?

Or, are we somehow separating second prints from reprints (which come out second)?

I go with RMA.I believe the Joes and Star Wars were reprints,no?

[RockMyAmadeus]

By the way...the first no-contest "second printing" based on sellout demand that Marvel ever did?

 

Ghost Rider #1, 1990.

What constitutes this being "no-contest"? While I'm not informed about the G.I. Joe reprints, the first issue of The 'Nam quickly went to a second printing due to demand in 1986. (I first started collecting right around this time, and the reprint was on sale around the same time as issue 3 or 4.)

 

You're right! I forgot all about Nam #1.

 

Thanks!

 

That does raise an interesting question, though...

 

How fast does a later printing have to show up to differentiate it from a reprint (such as the Joes, printed 2-4 years after the fact) vs. a "second" (or third, or fourth) printing? Ghost Rider #1 was an instant sellout, and the reprint was ordered and printed very quickly, but how quickly...I do not recall.

[RockMyAmadeus]

By the way...the first no-contest "second printing" based on sellout demand that Marvel ever did?

 

Ghost Rider #1, 1990.

What constitutes this being "no-contest"? While I'm not informed about the G.I. Joe reprints, the first issue of The 'Nam quickly went to a second printing due to demand in 1986. (I first started collecting right around this time, and the reprint was on sale around the same time as issue 3 or 4.)

Wouldn't Star Wars reprints be a result of demand?

Or, are we somehow separating second prints from reprints (which come out second)?

 

Yes, there was nothing called "second printing" for Star Wars. They are just labeled "reprint", and there were more than two of them.

[RockMyAmadeus]

By the way...the first no-contest "second printing" based on sellout demand that Marvel ever did?

 

Ghost Rider #1, 1990.

What constitutes this being "no-contest"? While I'm not informed about the G.I. Joe reprints, the first issue of The 'Nam quickly went to a second printing due to demand in 1986. (I first started collecting right around this time, and the reprint was on sale around the same time as issue 3 or 4.)

Wouldn't Star Wars reprints be a result of demand?

Or, are we somehow separating second prints from reprints (which come out second)?

I go with RMA.I believe the Joes and Star Wars were reprints,no?

 

Joes are almost all labeled "second", "third" printing (except for #3-5), so they're easy to classify, even if they didn't come out until 1985-1986...2-4 years after they were first printed.

 

The Joes are a quite unique situation. Someone at Hasbro was either pestering Marvel to reprint the books, or someone at Marvel was far-sighted (probably Larry Hama.)

 

By 1985, early Joes were the hottest thing on the market, just before the explosion part of the B&W Explosion, and #2 first prints were $50 books at one pont (in 1985 dollars, making a raw copy worth about $125 in 2014 dollars!)

 

FIrst, they reprinted #3-4 in 1983 (who knows why they didn't reprint #2 first, and #1 was, of course, because of the Baxter paper.)

 

Then, a few other issues were reprinted in 1984 (#7, #10, #17-19), and the rest mostly in 1985 and 1986 (see 65 cent cover price, not in place before April, 1985 cover dates.)

 

It was totally haphazard and random. I'm going to have to sit Larry Hama down some day and have him explain what was going on at the time.

 

[divad]

By the way...the first no-contest "second printing" based on sellout demand that Marvel ever did?

 

Ghost Rider #1, 1990.

What constitutes this being "no-contest"? While I'm not informed about the G.I. Joe reprints, the first issue of The 'Nam quickly went to a second printing due to demand in 1986. (I first started collecting right around this time, and the reprint was on sale around the same time as issue 3 or 4.)

 

You're right! I forgot all about Nam #1.

 

Thanks!

 

That does raise an interesting question, though...

 

How fast does a later printing have to show up to differentiate it from a reprint (such as the Joes, printed 2-4 years after the fact) vs. a "second" (or third, or fourth) printing? Ghost Rider #1 was an instant sellout, and the reprint was ordered and printed very quickly, but how quickly...I do not recall.

 

They're all reprints. It doesn't matter what you call them. And by you, I mean anyone, not you personally.

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

FIrst, they reprinted #3-4 in 1983 (who knows why they didn't reprint #2 first, and #1 was, of course, because of the Baxter paper.)

 

In fact....this may go some length to explain the Bizarro pricing of these books during that era. If you look at ads from the era, pricing was all over the place, with #2 being the most expensive, but #3-5 being cheaper than #6 and #8, and #12 being more expensive than #9-11, etc. It was quite bizarre.

 

But...

 

If you consider that #3-5 were reprinted earlier, but lacked markings noting that (esp #3-4), it's entirely possible that the reprints filled in the demand that books that weren't reprinted until 1986....like #6, #8, etc....couldn't fill with their original print runs.

 

 

That really sounds plausible.

[porcupine48]

Okay...very complete and well put explanation on the Joes there.Thank you,a lot of info but easily understood.Now,would folks consider these 65 cent reprints desirable(. Nevermind,of course someone will)?I have a few and just chalked them up to Canadian pricing variants.

A tad off topic,but anyone here have a complete set,reprints et all?That would be quite a feat and chore.

Jimmers

Edited July 7, 2014 by porcupine48

[r100comics]

The Death of Superman was ridiculous. It was precisely the type of story aimed at 8 year old boys, with 8 year old reasoning. Nothing was explained, there was no buildup, there was no backstory, this guy just decided to show up and wallop Superman, and 7 issues later, Supes is dead?

 

Stupid.

 

If I was 8, I would have thought it was the greatest thing ever, just like I thought the Poseidon Adventure was the greatest movie ever when I was 8.

 

The only clever part was the decreasing number of panels per book. That was kinda cool.

 

 

 

I loved those issues then and the 8 year old in me still loves them now.

 

Great battle issues are what got me into comics in the first place and this was an epic battle story arc.