Superman: The Man of Steel #17 & 18 (Doomsday) 3 3

[divad]

No, 17 is the first brief appearance (one page, four panels, covered arm only) and the three other Superman titles each have their own similar page with four panels showing the progression of Doomsday breaking the wall of his prison.

 

If this is your argument, I rest my case . . .

 

They are NOT the same page.

 

 

You need to get off your duff and actually read the books.

 

 

I read them and I see them above. They're all pitifully tiny cameos.

[divad]

I'll admit, I haven't gone back and really looked at those panels since I was a kid. Seeing them all lined up does it make more interesting -- and does tilt the first cameo squarely in MoS 17's favor.

 

However, why does this cameo command more than the full appearance (when it is usually the opposite)?

 

It really SHOULDN'T even if it has. If there were only one singular cameo I'd agree with the fervor to collect the 'first cameo' appearance....but seeing there are multiple "cameos" it devalues, dillutes and confuses the value IMO.

That said, there's only one true first "full appearance" and that's MOS 18....and it's easy to make that determination.

 

Yes, otherwise, you'd have to call MOS 18 the fifth app.

[Brandon Shepherd]

I'll admit, I haven't gone back and really looked at those panels since I was a kid. Seeing them all lined up does it make more interesting -- and does tilt the first cameo squarely in MoS 17's favor.

 

However, why does this cameo command more than the full appearance (when it is usually the opposite)?

 

It really SHOULDN'T even if it has. If there were only one singular cameo I'd agree with the fervor to collect the 'first cameo' appearance....but seeing there are multiple "cameos" it devalues, dillutes and confuses the value IMO.

That said, there's only one true first "full appearance" and that's MOS 18....and it's easy to make that determination.

 

It was mentioned previously in this thread about Overstreet and other sources always notating MOS #17 as the first appearance and #18 as only 'Doomsday appearance', and how that lead many to pursue #17.

 

To go along with the whole cameo vs full argument, what if it could also be Superman collector versus flipper, a Superman collector would probably favor #17 as the first appearance, and true beginning of the Death of Superman saga versus everyone else, the dealers, flippers and over all comic readers?

 

I'm partial to #17 personally but if asked, I'd say it's all about #18.

[Lazyboy]

Don't forget the difference in print runs.

[RockMyAmadeus]

It's hard to argue against that big, beautiful appearance on the cover of #18.

 

It does make quite the impression.

[divad]

No, 17 is the first brief appearance (one page, four panels, covered arm only) and the three other Superman titles each have their own similar page with four panels showing the progression of Doomsday breaking the wall of his prison.

 

 

The last (cameo) pages of Superman: The Man of Steel #17, Superman #73, Adventures of Superman #496 and Action Comics #683.

 

Nicely done, btw, Brandon. (thumbs u

[Brandon Shepherd]

Thanks!

[Brandon Shepherd]

 

 

The last (cameo) pages of Superman: The Man of Steel #17, Superman #73, Adventures of Superman #496 and Action Comics #683.

 

 

Cover and page scans from Fortress of Bailytude

http://www.fortressofbaileytude.com/the-death-and-return-of-superman/

[divad]

It's hard to argue against that big, beautiful appearance on the cover of #18.

 

It does make quite the impression.

 

Yes, it does:

 

[Broke as a Joke]

I don't get it. Cover of 18 shows his left fist covered up. Last panel of the door slamming shows his hand ripped through it. Soooo, the cover of 18 takes place prior to the door punching in 17, making 18 his true first appearance. Where is my no-prize

[accessndx]

I know this isn't "NEW" info, but upon reviewing those pictures leaked from the JL/BvS set(s) it does appear that folks are leaving flowers for Superman by his destroyed memorial statue.

 

If that doesn't smell and look like a Death of Superman/Doomsday sequeway I don't know what is. If you're going to "kill" superman on the big screen, why not cull it straight from the already established and well known story?

Come to think of it, DC/WB seems to be on a trajectory to do their most critically acclaimed storylines.....The Dark Knight Returns is B vs S after all....and they've done the whole animated route already.

They've also done the Death of Superman arc as animation....so it'd be natural for the live action version to follow.

The finale of the JL movie is probably going to see Supes "dead", with the aftermath explored in other movies (Flash/GL Teamup, Shazam, WW, etc.) and a resolution in either JL 2 or MOS 2.

 

http://thebananadoc.wordpress.com/2014/06/25/more-spoilers-from-todays-shoot-in-pontiac/

[Lazyboy]

I don't get it. Cover of 18 shows his left fist covered up. Last panel of the door slamming shows his hand ripped through it.

 

That is kind of funny. I guess they didn't tell Bogdanove that they were going to have the covering torn off in the build-up panels in the other titles.

 

Soooo, the cover of 18 takes place prior to the door punching in 17, making 18 his true first appearance. Where is my no-prize

The covering wasn't torn in MoS 17. The picture is right here, like two posts up!

 

[divad]

I don't get it. Cover of 18 shows his left fist covered up. Last panel of the door slamming shows his hand ripped through it.

 

That is kind of funny. I guess they didn't tell Bogdanove that they were going to have the covering torn off in the build-up panels in the other titles.

 

Soooo, the cover of 18 takes place prior to the door punching in 17, making 18 his true first appearance. Where is my no-prize

The covering wasn't torn in MoS 17. The picture is right here, like two posts up!

 

There's no argument whatsoever that ALL FOUR OF THESE ISSUES came out before MOS 18, you are a scream fine sir.

[vader2001]

I just got these back today, I was hoping for a better 5th printing, but still not bad grade. 4th printing was nice also.

 

 

superman mos 18 4th printing by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

superman mos 18 5th printing by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

superman mos 18 4th and 5th together by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

 

[Brandon Shepherd]

Very cool, congrats!

[Comixroc]

I just got these back today, I was hoping for a better 5th printing, but still not bad grade. 4th printing was nice also.

 

 

superman mos 18 4th printing by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

superman mos 18 5th printing by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

superman mos 18 4th and 5th together by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

 

Congrats on the 4th print in 9.8

 

..........almost as cool as mine

 

[vader2001]

I just got these back today, I was hoping for a better 5th printing, but still not bad grade. 4th printing was nice also.

 

 

superman mos 18 4th printing by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

superman mos 18 5th printing by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

superman mos 18 4th and 5th together by dghmwyatt, on Flickr

 

 

Congrats on the 4th print in 9.8

 

..........almost as cool as mine

 

 

 

Very nice 4th! Much pretty than mine....

[Silverdream]

SO...

 

MOS 18 is really tanking in 9.8 huh...

 

Happens all the time with comics that are plentiful -- and plentiful in high grade.

 

Someone notices the graded copies are selling for a nice profit (considering one could buy them raw for $3-$5 and get them graded for $25 or so).

 

Then the number of census copies go up and the price comes down.

 

Some saturation going on with 18. That said, it appears that folks are a bit more driven currently to collect the "cameo" in 17 vs. the first full appearance in 18. Same thing is happening with the unofficial first appearance of Constantine.

I believe you'll see another bump in both issues as soon as there's another announcement related to Doomsday (which is inevitable).

Also: There may be elevated prices for a "newstand" edition vs. a "direct" edition. They're more rare in high grade and apparently more desirable.

 

Much ado about nothing. #17 has always out-priced #18. It will eventually turn around for good. Hold your 18s and stick to your guns. Sell your 17s while the gettin' is good.

 

What will be the catalyst that sees 18 replace 17 as the "one to own"?

 

Considering there are still full sealed cases of MoS 18 floating around, I dont know how high it can go long term. As little as a few months ago a sealed case of 200 copies was sold on ebay for just over $1,000. Hard to say how they look inside, but... thats a lot of copies either way. The problem for MoS 18 will always be the print run vs 17. Heck every collection I have ever purchased either had one copy of 17 and multiples of 18, or start ant 18 with multiples. Its still a superman book from the 90's ( Mos 17) so the print run is pretty large, but 18 was hoarded.

[Broke as a Joke]

SO...

 

MOS 18 is really tanking in 9.8 huh...

 

Happens all the time with comics that are plentiful -- and plentiful in high grade.

 

Someone notices the graded copies are selling for a nice profit (considering one could buy them raw for $3-$5 and get them graded for $25 or so).

 

Then the number of census copies go up and the price comes down.

 

Some saturation going on with 18. That said, it appears that folks are a bit more driven currently to collect the "cameo" in 17 vs. the first full appearance in 18. Same thing is happening with the unofficial first appearance of Constantine.

I believe you'll see another bump in both issues as soon as there's another announcement related to Doomsday (which is inevitable).

Also: There may be elevated prices for a "newstand" edition vs. a "direct" edition. They're more rare in high grade and apparently more desirable.

 

Much ado about nothing. #17 has always out-priced #18. It will eventually turn around for good. Hold your 18s and stick to your guns. Sell your 17s while the gettin' is good.

 

What will be the catalyst that sees 18 replace 17 as the "one to own"?

 

Considering there are still full sealed cases of MoS 18 floating around, I dont know how high it can go long term. As little as a few months ago a sealed case of 200 copies was sold on ebay for just over $1,000. Hard to say how they look inside, but... thats a lot of copies either way. The problem for MoS 18 will always be the print run vs 17. Heck every collection I have ever purchased either had one copy of 17 and multiples of 18, or start ant 18 with multiples. Its still a superman book from the 90's ( Mos 17) so the print run is pretty large, but 18 was hoarded.

 

Yep.

 

Also, whatever happened to everyone admitting that the "death of Superman" storyline just sucked in general?? It was laughed at back then, so I don't understand what makes it worth revisiting all these years later. I never got the feeling that Doomsday had any long term potential back then and don't see any real development in his character now. Maybe they bring him out for a villain role in the new movie coming out, but Bane had two movies and that book seems capped.

[RockMyAmadeus]

The Death of Superman was ridiculous. It was precisely the type of story aimed at 8 year old boys, with 8 year old reasoning. Nothing was explained, there was no buildup, there was no backstory, this guy just decided to show up and wallop Superman, and 7 issues later, Supes is dead?

 

Stupid.

 

If I was 8, I would have thought it was the greatest thing ever, just like I thought the Poseidon Adventure was the greatest movie ever when I was 8.

 

The only clever part was the decreasing number of panels per book. That was kinda cool.