Detective Comics #27 CGC 9.2 4 4

[VintageComics]

Maybe the 9.2 is bangzooms!

 

The story of the year is the grade bumping of major keys....both in terms of actual grade and amount of restoration. The rise in price from 155K to 595K on the restored DT 27 is greed fueled. What can stop this....what has ever stopped making a profit.

 

It is very important that this record breaking comic book not be a "grade bump" book....

 

Mitch, grades can change simply because CGC sees a book differently. Nothing necessarily needs to be done to a book.

 

What is happening is these books are all vying for position (best, 2nd best, 3rd best, etc). Eventually they will settle into their respective positions.

 

 

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

 

Mitch where have you been the last 10 years? Maybe if you participated in a few threads outside of Action #1's you would have noticed that people have been talking about this since day one.

 

 

At no time has anybody made 2million on a grade bump/ press or whatever. So the book bumped 100 bucks ten years ago... But this trend is deeper, more profitable... And it is just beginning with ga mega keys....the new saying ..."crack and press"...and make 2+ million profit on a single book....it is coming big time.

I think we saw a near unique opportunity with the action 1. It was a beautiful book initially graded with a couple of removable flaws. Flaws that these days most remove before submitting for grading, thus eliminating the potential for upgrades.

 

Will folks continue to try to manipulate books into higher slabs, of course. It's human nature. Folks have been trying to improve books for profit as long as even you have been collecting Mitch (restoration was once widely positively accepted as increasing a books value)

 

However I'm pretty reluctant to think we will ever hear of a 2mil bump on a comic again, it is just not statistically probable.

 

Mitch was part of the 'problem', by paying record prices for comics and driving the market up into a stratosphere where even removing a wave from a book would make it worth while.

 

The comic market is no different than any other market. There is the good and the bad, and people looking to make a dollar through whatever legal (and illegal) means they can.

 

We're just more emotional about it because it's tied to our childhood.

[nearmint]

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

Ok, you point is we are at the "point of no return". I disagree. One label and the market reduction of paying 10 times for a book that is "untouched" is gonna do it in the long run. The multiple prices need to come down not UP.

 

I can barely make out what you're saying.

 

I can't bring myself to even make the effort.

[eman13]

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

Ok, you point is we are at the "point of no return". I disagree. One label and the market reduction of paying 10 times for a book that is "untouched" is gonna do it in the long run. The multiple prices need to come down not UP.

 

I can barely make out what you're saying.

 

I can't bring myself to even make the effort.

I AM the Bat-Man! (since logic is out the window, why not have some fun with it?)

[Gotham Kid]

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

Ok, you point is we are at the "point of no return". I disagree. One label and the market reduction of paying 10 times for a book that is "untouched" is gonna do it in the long run. The multiple prices need to come down not UP.

 

I can barely make out what you're saying.

 

Me neither, and I speak 6 languages.

[VintageComics]

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

Ok, you point is we are at the "point of no return". I disagree. One label and the market reduction of paying 10 times for a book that is "untouched" is gonna do it in the long run. The multiple prices need to come down not UP.

 

I can barely make out what you're saying.

 

Me neither, and I speak 6 languages.

 

I'm fluent in 2, can get by in a 3rd and can scratch on cave walls in possibly several others.

 

 

[markseifert]

You know what, being fair to Mitch, and playing devil's advocate here... he's probably actually making a point worth pondering here.

 

A 2 million dollar bump does likely pave the way towards new methods. It's not a new behavior or dynamic, but it IS potentially a level-up.

 

As Gator saw the book as an 8.0 (I think?), and given his experience, he's in the best position to know that this is a difficult-to-repeat set of circumstances.

 

And yet... and yet.... a $2 million dollar bump. At that point, you can say to a conservator, "here's $100,000. (or $200,000. or $500,000). If money is (nearly) no object, what can you do to make this book look better?

 

The door was already wide open, but this does (yet again) push it open a few inches farther. There's little doubt that [insert names of experts here] are thinking about what they could do with those kinds of resources. What equipment and methods they could explore. What university and museum conservation experts they could consult with.

 

Revolutionary? No. Evolutionary? Yeah, probably. And it doesn't have to be as drastic as 8.0->9.0. What's the Cage Action 1 worth in a 9.2 holder? Think you could get it there if I gave you $250k? How about if I gave you $500k?

[VintageComics]

The edge of the envelope has always been there to push for people looking for a way to improve a book, whether ethically or unethically. It was done decades ago and nothing changes to this present day.

 

The dollar amount certainly increases incentive, but for people who have been doing it all along nothing really changes. Except for the dollar amount.

 

 

[Gotham Kid]

can scratch on cave walls in possibly several others.

 

 

well if we're gonna show off, I can speak braille.

[Mmehdy]

Maybe the 9.2 is bangzooms!

 

The story of the year is the grade bumping of major keys....both in terms of actual grade and amount of restoration. The rise in price from 155K to 595K on the restored DT 27 is greed fueled. What can stop this....what has ever stopped making a profit.

 

It is very important that this record breaking comic book not be a "grade bump" book....

 

Mitch, grades can change simply because CGC sees a book differently. Nothing necessarily needs to be done to a book.

 

What is happening is these books are all vying for position (best, 2nd best, 3rd best, etc). Eventually they will settle into their respective positions.

 

 

 

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

 

Mitch where have you been the last 10 years? Maybe if you participated in a few threads outside of Action #1's you would have noticed that people have been talking about this since day one.

 

 

At no time has anybody made 2million on a grade bump/ press or whatever. So the book bumped 100 bucks ten years ago... But this trend is deeper, more profitable... And it is just beginning with ga mega keys....the new saying ..."crack and press"...and make 2+ million profit on a single book....it is coming big time.

I think we saw a near unique opportunity with the action 1. It was a beautiful book initially graded with a couple of removable flaws. Flaws that these days most remove before submitting for grading, thus eliminating the potential for upgrades.

 

Will folks continue to try to manipulate books into higher slabs, of course. It's human nature. Folks have been trying to improve books for profit as long as even you have been collecting Mitch (restoration was once widely positively accepted as increasing a books value)

 

However I'm pretty reluctant to think we will ever hear of a 2mil bump on a comic again, it is just not statistically probable.

 

Let's look at the 9.4 bump on the D27 from 9.2....was 155K now 595K... if that bump is even greater even more dollars up. I see in todays Hollywood Reporter an article as to WHY Metro paid over 3.2 million dollars for the Action One...give it read...interesting...here I will sum it up for you....i

"it is gonna be worth more"....

 

If you own a GA Key....and can grade bump it .2,.4. or a full grade...what are you gonna do...Gator the 2 million dollar profit Gold Rush( see Chuck R market comments)..has just began..just too much greed and money on the table NOW.

Edited September 3, 2014 by Mmehdy

[markseifert]

The edge of the envelope has always been there to push for people looking for a way to improve a book, whether ethically or unethically. It was done decades ago and nothing changes to this present day.

 

The dollar amount certainly increases incentive, but for people who have been doing it all along nothing really changes. Except for the dollar amount.

 

 

The dollar amount certainly increases incentive, but for people who have been doing it all along nothing really changes. Except for the dollar amount.

 

I don't disagree, but I think the thing that you have to think about is at what various $$ levels new achievements are unlocked, so to speak.

 

Consider: Let's say you've got a Tec 27 cgc 8.0 that is gorgeous except for a color breaking crease.

 

If you threw $250k at it, could you get that crease removed, or make it invisible without adding anything? I don't know, but it's interesting to think about.

 

You could pay an expert to sit in a room with a microscope every day for a year... slowly, carefully teasing paper fibers and color flakes into place. Is it possible? No idea, but I wouldn't bet against it given $x resources.

[MrBedrock]

You know what, being fair to Mitch, and playing devil's advocate here... he's probably actually making a point worth pondering here.

 

ALERT THE MEDIA!

[drbanner]

You could pay an expert to sit in a room with a microscope every day for a year... slowly, carefully teasing paper fibers and color flakes into place. Is it possible? No idea, but I wouldn't bet against it given $x resources.

You don't have to pay an individual, you just have to pay CGC. They can do whatever they want and then decide for themselves how good of a job they did, if it's purple or blue or maybe aqua-marine, and finally if it's good enough to get that 0.2 or 0.4 or 1.2 to warrant a $500,000 (and up) bump. It's one-stop shopping now, and the payoff has never been bigger, how exciting!

[Mmehdy]

grade bumping is just that,not just to the book and its value but to the collectors who paid top dollar for a top ranking book KNOWING the books that are under them.

 

Forget that...nothing is safe anymore...not if a book can be grade bumped up to a full grade .

For example...a really good book is Wonderworld comics #1...9.4 allentown which metro has...a great book, but they note the next graded book is 5.5.....If I owned the 5.5, I would make it a 6.5 in a heartbeat if all I cared about was money. vWhen your book gets bumped you will understand what I mean or when your book which you sold is regraded and jacked up 300% you will understand.

 

What this sale and others have done, is not to devalue comic books or your book but to devalue the CENSUS and all the HYPE that is used to make the book 5 or 10 times its actual value because its in a plastic holder and is a top graded book ( see Hulk 181 CGC ad)

 

Folks, My advice: buy the BOOK, not the census from now on.

Edited September 3, 2014 by Mmehdy

[G.A.tor]

Maybe the 9.2 is bangzooms!

 

The story of the year is the grade bumping of major keys....both in terms of actual grade and amount of restoration. The rise in price from 155K to 595K on the restored DT 27 is greed fueled. What can stop this....what has ever stopped making a profit.

 

It is very important that this record breaking comic book not be a "grade bump" book....

 

Mitch, grades can change simply because CGC sees a book differently. Nothing necessarily needs to be done to a book.

 

What is happening is these books are all vying for position (best, 2nd best, 3rd best, etc). Eventually they will settle into their respective positions.

 

 

 

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

 

Mitch where have you been the last 10 years? Maybe if you participated in a few threads outside of Action #1's you would have noticed that people have been talking about this since day one.

 

 

At no time has anybody made 2million on a grade bump/ press or whatever. So the book bumped 100 bucks ten years ago... But this trend is deeper, more profitable... And it is just beginning with ga mega keys....the new saying ..."crack and press"...and make 2+ million profit on a single book....it is coming big time.

I think we saw a near unique opportunity with the action 1. It was a beautiful book initially graded with a couple of removable flaws. Flaws that these days most remove before submitting for grading, thus eliminating the potential for upgrades.

 

Will folks continue to try to manipulate books into higher slabs, of course. It's human nature. Folks have been trying to improve books for profit as long as even you have been collecting Mitch (restoration was once widely positively accepted as increasing a books value)

 

However I'm pretty reluctant to think we will ever hear of a 2mil bump on a comic again, it is just not statistically probable.

 

Let's look at the 9.4 bump on the D27 from 9.2....was 155K now 595K... if that bump is even greater even more dollars up. I see in todays Hollywood Reporter an article as to WHY Metro paid over 3.2 million dollars for the Action One...give it read...interesting...here I will sum it up for you....i

"it is gonna be worth more"....

 

If you own a GA Key....and can grade bump it .2,.4. or a full grade...what are you gonna do...Gator the 2 million dollar profit Gold Rush( see Chuck R market comments)..has just began..just too much greed and money on the table NOW.

mitch, here's my rebuttal...first, greed and money on the table is nothing new...been happening for the past 10 years since the advent of cgc, and happened the previous 30 years to that (just on a diff scale)...

second, the tec you bring up did change in grade, but until someone actually buys it, it has not changed in value...I can "ask" anything I want for a book ,but ask yourself, do you think a 9.4 mod Tec 27 is worth 595K? (don't even consider what it was before, just what it is now)...we've never seen a restored Key even sniff 200K, have we? so don't panic just yet...

[Straw-Man]

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

Ok, you point is we are at the "point of no return". I disagree. One label and the market reduction of paying 10 times for a book that is "untouched" is gonna do it in the long run. The multiple prices need to come down not UP.

 

I can barely make out what you're saying.

 

I can't bring myself to even make the effort.

 

the ignore button has served me well, except when you guys quote him.

[Erndog]

If I owned the 5.5, I would make it a 6.5 in a heartbeat

 

You can do that!?!? That's awesome!

[woowoo]

When you graded a book in 84-90 a Fine could be a vg or VF today?Thats a huge grade bump. Steve F talked to me in early 80s and said we need a 10 point G system. I thought the good vg/fine/vf/nm/m was the only way had no idea what he was talking about.

I think CGC was to hard early on books they all looked undergraded for what we all new. I think now they new they were to hard and some things were ok so its fair now.

BUUUUUT now maybe money and comp is changing things not happy with the 9.2 Ext to 9.4 Mod Tec 27. The Action 1 as long as nothing was added to the book only press you have to say its Bad A.. book and i dont think colors like that will be seen to much its the best i have seen in 40 years.

[rob_react]

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

Ok, you point is we are at the "point of no return". I disagree. One label and the market reduction of paying 10 times for a book that is "untouched" is gonna do it in the long run. The multiple prices need to come down not UP.

 

I can barely make out what you're saying.

 

I can't bring myself to even make the effort.

 

the ignore button has served me well, except when you guys quote him.

 

+1

[rob_react]

Maybe the 9.2 is bangzooms!

 

The story of the year is the grade bumping of major keys....both in terms of actual grade and amount of restoration. The rise in price from 155K to 595K on the restored DT 27 is greed fueled. What can stop this....what has ever stopped making a profit.

 

It is very important that this record breaking comic book not be a "grade bump" book....

 

Mitch, grades can change simply because CGC sees a book differently. Nothing necessarily needs to be done to a book.

 

What is happening is these books are all vying for position (best, 2nd best, 3rd best, etc). Eventually they will settle into their respective positions.

 

 

 

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

 

Mitch where have you been the last 10 years? Maybe if you participated in a few threads outside of Action #1's you would have noticed that people have been talking about this since day one.

 

 

At no time has anybody made 2million on a grade bump/ press or whatever. So the book bumped 100 bucks ten years ago... But this trend is deeper, more profitable... And it is just beginning with ga mega keys....the new saying ..."crack and press"...and make 2+ million profit on a single book....it is coming big time.

I think we saw a near unique opportunity with the action 1. It was a beautiful book initially graded with a couple of removable flaws. Flaws that these days most remove before submitting for grading, thus eliminating the potential for upgrades.

 

Will folks continue to try to manipulate books into higher slabs, of course. It's human nature. Folks have been trying to improve books for profit as long as even you have been collecting Mitch (restoration was once widely positively accepted as increasing a books value)

 

However I'm pretty reluctant to think we will ever hear of a 2mil bump on a comic again, it is just not statistically probable.

 

Let's look at the 9.4 bump on the D27 from 9.2....was 155K now 595K... if that bump is even greater even more dollars up. I see in todays Hollywood Reporter an article as to WHY Metro paid over 3.2 million dollars for the Action One...give it read...interesting...here I will sum it up for you....i

"it is gonna be worth more"....

 

If you own a GA Key....and can grade bump it .2,.4. or a full grade...what are you gonna do...Gator the 2 million dollar profit Gold Rush( see Chuck R market comments)..has just began..just too much greed and money on the table NOW.

mitch, here's my rebuttal...first, greed and money on the table is nothing new...been happening for the past 10 years since the advent of cgc, and happened the previous 30 years to that (just on a diff scale)...

second, the tec you bring up did change in grade, but until someone actually buys it, it has not changed in value...I can "ask" anything I want for a book ,but ask yourself, do you think a 9.4 mod Tec 27 is worth 595K? (don't even consider what it was before, just what it is now)...we've never seen a restored Key even sniff 200K, have we? so don't panic just yet...

 

I will keep asking this... why do we care that a book in a PURPLE RESTORED LABEL got a grade bump? I am not a blue label grade absolutist, so I don't get bent out of shape by a bump on a blue label book, but this is the first time I've heard anyone get crazy about a grade bump on a book that is LABELED AS RESTORED.

 

Since it's labeled as restored... someone did some work on it and got a grade bump. Or maybe it just looks nicer to a different grade and it gets .2? Why are the pitchforks out for this book?

 

[chrisco37]

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.

 

Ok, you point is we are at the "point of no return". I disagree. One label and the market reduction of paying 10 times for a book that is "untouched" is gonna do it in the long run. The multiple prices need to come down not UP.

 

I can barely make out what you're saying.

 

I can't bring myself to even make the effort.

 

the ignore button has served me well, except when you guys quote him.

 

+1

 

You're doing yourself a disservice. You could miss out on hobby shattering bombshells like this:

 

 

Interesting business model....change the standards every 5 years and regrade and regrade . Right now its grade bumping 1 grade and possible 1.2 grades higher. What happens when it it two grades higher....buying at the top is dangerous to say the least. But VC when know what is done to comics today to restore or unrepair to grade bump. Vying for a position does not mean what is occurring is a good and healthy thing.