ASM #252 CGC 9.8 Record Sale - something fishy going on? - Holder Tampering Incident confirmed by CGC 50 50

[Sigur Ros]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:39 PM, AbsoluteCarnage said:

@WestcoastDAVEngers has a cool Eric Larsen interview on his vids too. There are some good youtubers out there. Glad to have seen these guys get the ball rolling on this. 

Davengers and 9.9Newsstand are one thing.  All those others who took that info from them and ran with it are another.

Now everyone seems to have a video about it.

Also, can't stand Larsen, he's a loser... so I'll pass.

[AbsoluteCarnage]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:42 PM, Sigur Ros said:

Davengers and 9.9Newsstand are one thing.  All those others who took that info from them and ran with it are another.

Now everyone seems to have a video about it.

Also, can't stand Larsen, he's a loser... so I'll pass.

Everyone entitled to their own opinion sir so I respect that but there was a website up forget what it was but it was a community way back where you could post comics and collections and he was on there and I had  him on my friend list. He was nice to talk to. 

[MAR1979]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:22 PM, Sigur Ros said:

Am I the only one getting very tired of youtube opinions ?

I have gone all of 2023 thus far without watching even a single youtube-r's video.  I plan on continuing my streak throughout 2024.

Edited January 1 by MAR1979

[Chip Cataldo]

 

On 12/31/2023 at 6:57 PM, MAR1979 said:

I have gone all of 2023 thus far without watching a single youtube-r, I ain't going to start now.  I plan on continuing my streak for all of 2024.

They really don't add much to the hobby at all. They're all about clicks and ad revenue. That's it.

Edited January 1 by Chip Cataldo

[Sigur Ros]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:57 PM, MAR1979 said:

I have gone all of 2023 thus far without watching even a single youtube-r's video.  I plan on continuing my streak throughout 2024.

I've watched a couple videos by Davengers/9.9   Nothing wrong there, of course, because they brought this info forward.  They're good guys.

But then part of the one in the beginning of this thread by Swaggle(?), same info. And then part of one by Automatic because he claimed he proved something. He didn't. Same info.  After that I've avoided them.

 

[ADAMANTIUM]

Spoiler

Probably been thought of, but a good business venture idea, Probably just droll

 

[HighGrade]

I think it's funny so many people are worried about cracking and swapping when this is not even close to being proven, NOBODY has successfully done this without the tampering being evident.

The scam "my opinion" was MUCH MUCH easier, like possibly said person sent in just the inner well and label, AND it was never checked due to flawed protocol, or maybe the person doing custom labels was even in on it. The only sealing that may have happened was on the inner well, again MUCH easier to slip out the label in older in well holders reseal and FOOL a "new" employee that either A doesn't even care or B is in on it. Newer holders the label is separate, would hate to think it, but it really could have been just as easy for scammer to send opened holders and NEW employees just not caring or understanding, or in on it. (maybe the reason for a private investigator to check backgrounds)

Scammers, thieves, look for the path of least resistance, I think they found this flaw in the reholder system, NOT the holders themselves. 

CGC better come out quick to explain this, and verify the holders are not the issue, and they still show any tampering. That is very important before this gets out of hand. I'm all for added security on holders, BUT I truly feel this is not the issue at all.

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:32 PM, HighGrade said:

I think it's funny so many people are worried about cracking and swapping when this is not even close to being proven, NOBODY has successfully done this without the tampering being evident.

The scam "my opinion" was MUCH MUCH easier, like possibly said person sent in just the inner well and label, AND it was never checked due to flawed protocol, or maybe the person doing custom labels was even in on it. The only sealing that may have happened was on the inner well, again MUCH easier to slip out the label in older in well holders reseal and FOOL a "new" employee that either A doesn't even care or B is in on it. Newer holders the label is separate, would hate to think it, but it really could have been just as easy for scammer to send opened holders and NEW employees just not caring or understanding, or in on it. (maybe the reason for a private investigator to check backgrounds)

Scammers, thieves, look for the path of least resistance, I think they found this flaw in the reholder system, NOT the holders themselves. 

CGC better come out quick to explain this, and verify the holders are not the issue, and they still show any tampering. That is very important before this gets out of hand. I'm all for added security on holders, BUT I truly feel this is not the issue at all.

This is what I figured out last night, when people that maybe ithough it was cgc cheerleadering, but rings truer than most and is why I'm curious what cgc will offer as tangible proof of a "fix".

The reholder guy being fired might not suffice when they've tried hiring new qc people often with low results.

Edited January 1 by ADAMANTIUM

[sledgehammer]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:32 PM, HighGrade said:

The scam "my opinion" was MUCH MUCH easier, like possibly said person sent in just the inner well and label, AND it was never checked due to flawed protocol, or maybe the person doing custom labels was even in on it.

If I sent in an inner well and a label, and i asked CGC to send me them back in a new holder, unchecked, I would be able to hear the laughter at my home in Chicago.

[sledgehammer]

I just realized that comiclink sold an IH 340 on November 29th by auction, that Ebay had recently authorized a return on, from briva3 for a sale on October 17th.

I also realized that they never responded to my tag that they just listed a 9.8 ASM 194 newstand, that is from a submission that is extremely typical for scamboy, loaded with 9.8 keys like he lists continuously.

Ignorance is bliss, I guess. If Roy was here, he could tell me he called them, and everything is A-OK.

[Chip Cataldo]

On 12/31/2023 at 7:32 PM, HighGrade said:

CGC better come out quick to explain this, and verify the holders are not the issue, and they still show any tampering.

This is what I'm talking about as far as most of the posts in this thread. "They'd BETTER come out QUICK to explain this!!!"

Lol. They'll do no such thing, whether multiple people here demand it or not. They'll probably say nothing else, and life will go on as usual.

I doubt they'll lose even 1% off their submitted comic total for 2023 going forward into the new year.

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:50 PM, Chip Cataldo said:

This is what I'm talking about as far as most of the posts in this thread. "They'd BETTER come out QUICK to explain this!!!"

Lol. They'll do no such thing, whether multiple people here demand it or not. They'll probably say nothing else, and life will go on as usual.

I doubt they'll lose even 1% off their submitted comic total for 2023 going forward into the new year.

This is true as well imo, it is a year off from being in any kind of resolution phase and or bounce back from whatever depresmode this is

I just come here as there are new posts and yet there really is nothing new too share 

 

Edited January 1 by ADAMANTIUM

[Sigur Ros]

On 12/31/2023 at 7:32 PM, HighGrade said:

NOBODY has successfully done this without the tampering being evident.

Maybe... But you certainly don't know that.  I mean...how would ya ?

However, in this case, he had CGC do it for him.

Guy was brilliant.

[thehumantorch]

On 12/31/2023 at 5:35 PM, ADAMANTIUM said:

This is what I figured out last night, when people that maybe ithough it was cgc cheerleadering, but rings truer than most and is why I'm curious what cgc will offer as tangible proof of a "fix".

The reholder guy being fired might not suffice when they've tried hiring new qc people often with low results.

The reholderin guy was likely following unofficial CGC policy intended to get these books back out the door as quickly and cheaply as possible

[ADAMANTIUM]

On 12/31/2023 at 7:07 PM, thehumantorch said:

The reholderin guy was likely following unofficial CGC policy intended to get these books back out the door as quickly and cheaply as possible

Well it may very well be as you say. From past experience with mods and or cgc phone reps, they all seemed to say, "it wasn't lax in that regard!"

WHICH is now going to bite them in the keister, since we have some reporting that they've sent just the inner well and a label, and getting a reholder done. I don't doubt that, but also agree it was not what was reported on the site nor by any people who "talked before this issue"

What troubles me is were those special circumstances, things falling through the cracks or ?

When mechanical errors happened, there was a bunch and I mean a BUNCH of talk or questions on, what kind of damage to the case would require regrade as oppose to mechanical error free reholder.

There are the 2 sides to that, and I suspect that both have some validity 

Edited January 1 by ADAMANTIUM

[ADAMANTIUM]

I mean regardless cgc was supposed to flip through the book to see if grade estimate held true, which wasn't evidently happening.

And yet that wasn't the script being read when people asked about damages to holders. Hindsight it all might have been downplayed to "it'll be assessed and reholdered or regraded", but due to cgc not wanting a bunch of shaken comic syndrome complaints (in addition to being rushed as people have stated) didn't do a "good enough job!"

Still not an easy proof or tangible way to say it is all now "fixed", and same with any possible legal recourse. Unfortunately the burden of proof is on cgc, which is time and a lot of patience.

 

Edited January 1 by ADAMANTIUM

[BlancoBros]

On 12/31/2023 at 7:18 PM, Sigur Ros said:

I've watched a couple videos by Davengers/9.9   Nothing wrong there, of course, because they brought this info forward.  They're good guys.

But then part of the one in the beginning of this thread by Swaggle(?), same info. And then part of one by Automatic because he claimed he proved something. He didn't. Same info.  After that I've avoided them.

 

Personally, I think its fine that several different youtubers reported on it, even though most of them were just rehashing what everyone else said.

I first heard the news on swagglehaus's channel. I had never heard of davenger/9.9 before this. Now i got few new channels to check out.

The various channels have different sets of followers. They got the news out to a larger audience. No different then an AP news story. Some viewers want their favorite youtuber take/opinion on the topic. There a few channels I cant stand myself, i just skip past them.

At the end of the day, these channels help drive the hobby.

[grendel013]

I only watch youtubers if they are flipping through comic books.

[grendelbo]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:57 PM, grendel013 said:

I only watch youtubers if they are flipping through comic books.

I miss @etanick. 

[lightninglad]

Everyone is talking about what CGC is going to do, but this is Blackrock’s baby now. They will not loose money unless forced to. Not a single thing will be done about this without national attention. That means national news coverage, federal investigation, lawsuit…. anything short of that and this goes under the rug.