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Where in the world was the Quality Control at CGC???
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6,152 posts in this topic

How in the world does this go out, without ANYBODY SAY,

 

HOLD UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

WHO OR HOW DID ONE OR TWO OF THREE OF YOU GRADERS

 

 

CALL THIS A 8.0 ?????????????????????

 

Why you yelling so loud. Hurt my ear.

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I just read through this thread and I'm extremely interested to see how CGC reviews this. Kudos to mycomicshop for going the extra measure on this. And great eye, Wally, thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention!

 

Damage to the outer slab means nothing. Unless you can switch the label (seam runs across the label so extremely unlikely) or swap the book out of the inner reservoir (virtually impossible without blatant evidence) then this was just a screwed pooch by CGC.

 

We have examined the book closely and don't see any evidence that the slab has been tampered with. The "Minor side edge crack" mentioned in our item listing is not evidence of tampering--it's just a tiny hairline crack about an inch below the upper right corner. Our consignment manager says she'd have to break it open to examine the inner well, but doesn't see anything off about the exterior.

 

Just spoke to CGC and they were very helpful. We are sending the book to CGC to review and determine what happened.

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I was going to say 4.5/5.0.

 

I'm disgusted. I consider my grading skills lame outside of the higher grades but this is pathetic. CGC Reps have some splaining on this one, true believers.

 

They HAD to have put the wrong label on the book. No other reasonable explanation.

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Someone had mentioned the label could not be swapped because it was enclosed within the seam of the sealed well.

 

I'm not sure if they noticed, but this well "type" has sharp diagonal corners. I've seen this type of well design on earlier label slabs.

 

From the image below (areas circled in red), you can see the label protruding outside the corner of the well, and the red arrow on the left shows the gap/opening of the two sheets of barex (those two lines running diagonally are an opening in the well).

 

In the past, I've literally taken each end of that well corner and pulled apart the two sheets of barex to open the well. The old label wells, you could literally peel them apart as if they were bonded using sticky note grade adhesion.

 

Removing the label and reseating another is possible on this well design:

 

label_well_zps72517b75.gif

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Someone had mentioned the label could not be swapped because it was enclosed within the seam of the sealed well.

 

If this was a case of tampering, and I think it is, there is a scenario where the label doesn't have to be removed. The consignor has two slabs, one is an 8.0 and the other is a 5.0 (the problem book). He gently removes the inner well of the 8.0, leaving the label intact. He deslabs the 5.0 but leaves it in the inner well. He then places the 5.0 into the 8.0 slab. You now have an 8.0 slab, label intact and never touched, with a 5.0 book in the inner well. Trust me, you can crack open a slab and remove the inner well with minimal evidence of tampering. I think CGC will find that the hairline crack an inch below the top corner is the evidence.

Edited by bomber-bob
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While it looks like a 4.0/4.5 to my eyes, it wouldn't surprise me if the book was graded as a soft CGC 5.0.

 

Probably just an error of hitting 8 instead of 5, but how in blue blazes does that slip through? Could be tampered with I suppose, too.

 

The whole thing could be more easily put to rest if CGC's grader's notes were more thorough.....

 

Just another log on the fire of "buy the book, not the label", which is frankly sage advice.

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I wonder legally what can be done here.

If MCS is sending the book to CGC, did they ask they consigner if that was ok with them first?

 

If not, is that even legal?

 

They can just take the persons book, and call foul on it, and send it somewhere else? What gives them that right or authority?

 

If the cosigner is aware that this is happening, and approved it, fine, but if not, this doesn't seem right.

 

We don't know for sure that anything was deliberately done to this book, and if it was, that the current owner is the one that did it.

 

I would think the right thing to do would be cancel the auction, contact the consigner, and tell them they have some doubts about the legitimacy of the book, and send it back to them, if the cosigner decides to go ahead and send it in to CGC for inspection, fine, but I don't think that's someone else's decision to make.

 

Of course we all want to see it sent in, and find out what the deal is because we are curious, but think if that was your book, and you knew you didn't do anything to it, and now it's being impounded by MCS and CGC, how would you feel?

 

I'm just playing devils advocate for a possibly innocent consigner, and wondering what can LEGALLY be done here.

 

On the other hand, if the consigner did switch out a lower grade book into a higher grade label, than F him, I hope his name gets blasted around the Net, and his rep ruined.

 

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I think it's time for a total redesign of the slab. It should have better security features, some imbedded UV protection and be more sturdy. If CGC wants to continue to be leaders in this market, they should be proactive and make efforts to stay ahead of the game. They need a new marketing vision that adapts and reflects the concerns and demands of their customer base. They should be able to easily do this and still control costs, no different than how other businesses have had to it, my field of profession included.

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Why not just put a few of those tamper resistant hologram security stickers on each edge?

 

I have a few different products that use them. They have them over areas where they would have to be removed or torn to get the area open, and if they are, it immediately voids the warranty.

 

You could put one in the center of each of the four sides.

No way you are sliding a comic past them.

They are about the size of a dime, and wouldn't detract from the visual presentation of the case and book.

Plus they would be cheap in bulk for CGC, and just take a minute to apply

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Once that i can tell. It was listed in august on eBay for like 2k+ but since it's not listed as sold in GPA one can assume the eBay sale never went through.

 

Any idea who the eBay seller was?

 

Whoever it was, they're going to jail. :(

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How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

 

This thought had occurred to me some years ago when I realized swapped parts could be used in this manner. Of course everything seems like a cost until an incident happens that calls into question their tamper evident system. Because there are a number of different style wells and holders, I wondered why CGC didn't letter code them. This way, an "A" coded outer holder could not be paired up with a "B" style inner well, and the same with a "B" with "C", etc. I understand their final decision and choice might depend on the comic their slabbing, but letter coding the case and well could be a stamping process (maybe laser etchng, but not the kind that could be rubbed out) that occurs during the sealing process. This would definitely make it easier to catch in the wild, and would deter people from trying to match up old label wells with perfect post-breached outer cases because they are better suited for label swapping.

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How hard would it be to etch the serial on the slab say on the back at the very bottom of the slab.

Course this would add to cost.

 

But how would that help? The issue isn't making sure the label aligns with the outer slab, it's making sure the label aligns with the comic.

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Someone had mentioned the label could not be swapped because it was enclosed within the seam of the sealed well.

 

If this was a case of tampering, and I think it is, there is a scenario where the label doesn't have to be removed. The consignor has two slabs, one is an 8.0 and the other is a 5.0 (the problem book). He gently removes the inner well of the 8.0, leaving the label intact. He deslabs the 5.0 but leaves it in the inner well. He then places the 5.0 into the 8.0 slab. You now have an 8.0 slab, label intact and never touched, with a 5.0 book in the inner well. Trust me, you can crack open a slab and remove the inner well with minimal evidence of tampering. I think CGC will find that the hairline crack an inch below the top corner is the evidence.

 

The only thing is that the serial number on this book matches an 8.0 grade. In order for a label swap scheme to work in this scenario, the label swapping would require a donor that actually got that grade. I'm not completely eliminating the possibility that this is one of the biggest gift grades I've seen in a slab to date, but if it is a case of tampering (and I've mentioned the things I see off about about slab, but 100% certainty is impossible from scans alone) then the more likely scenario is a label swap. You'd need at least one well style with an open top sleeve to remove and reseat the label to pull this off.

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