Traded: CGC 4.0 AF15 and CGC 9.6 TMNT 1 1 1

[Legion HQ]

I've noticed over the past few months that I've seen loads of kids here in the Fredericksburg, Virginia area out and about with TMNT shirts / toys quite frequently. Almost every other time I go to town I see some kid with a TMNT shirt on. Maybe it's just a regional thing to my area. But TMNT is far and away more "popular" than any other comic characters in that regard from my observation. It's not even close. What that means 20-30 years from now when those kids are all adults is anyone's guess.

[Jaydogrules]

This thread needs to die so as my last post here I will just say if someone also agrees with this:

 

"TMNT #1 has always had a very narrow collector base that is smaller than the 3000 print run which has always been able to satisfy."

 

Then SOT will always look at that opinion and person as:

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think that you are misconstruing toys and pajamas being sold to the parents with little kids as investor interest in the actual comic book. Yet I have never once even implied that TMN 1 is a worthless book. It may not be a "must get" to most collectors, but obviously there are enough out there to keep the book inflated to a certain extent. It's just hyper inflated now with this upcoming movie. If you need anyone to blame for this entire ludicrous conversation, blame the OP who began the entire thread by comparing turtles to the first appearance of Spiderman. And for crying out loud, please stop trying to compare the turtle book with classic silver age teams such as the ones in my current sig line . That's just as preposterous. No, their collector base is nowhere near any of those books either. TMNT are closer to the Power Rangers, if anything.

 

-J.

[chrisco37]

Up until 2008 nobody gave a mess about Iron Man. He was upper B-list (think Daredevil, Dr Strange, etc..). Turtles were bigger than IM.

[G.A.tor]

Up until 2008 nobody gave a mess about Iron Man. He was upper B-list (think Daredevil, Dr Strange, etc..). Turtles were bigger than IM.

and yet iron man has consistenly had a comic produced monthly (even in 2006/7 it was near top 50), where as TMNT couldn't even muster the sales to maintain a monthly comic during most of the 2000's, right (does anyone really count that 23 issue image disaster? )

[spracknetch23]

I think we have Nickelodeon to thank for bringing the TMNT back into the public consciousness in a big way. Before Nickelodeon, 4kids owned the licensing rights. Many people don't even know there was a TMNT cartoon show from 2003-2009. Their marketing of the property was horrible. I think as long as Nick keeps doing what they're doing, TMNT will be around for a long time, and therefore, TMNT #1 will be fine.

This is the first time a large corporation has owned the TMNT (previously creator-owned). The only way to go is up.

[Mister O]

Everything is cyclical in nature. With companies like Marvel and Apple they were trading at lower values only fifteen years ago and Marvel pretty much was going bankrupt if I recall. Yet these two companies rose from the ashes like the Phoenix.

 

Then you have mega keys like Marvel Comics #1 or Showcase #4 that were at the top of the OSPG for each of their categories for years only to see these books become less popular and become stagnant for years.

 

Books like Captain America #1 that were considered lower tier are now starting to catch Marvel Comics #1 and of course you have AF #15 and other books surpassing Showcase #4.

 

Who is to say that in 30 years time that other books will surpass AF#15 just like what is happening with Marvel Comics #1. It is hard to say what will happen over time no one will know.

 

The only thing we do know is that TMNT #1 has a supply of 3,000 books ever printed in the first run. It can be one of those books that remain stagnant, regress or the value can increase further. So long demand is there for TMNT#1 the prices will remain stable or increase over time.

 

The turtles may have had problems with comic purchases in the 2000's and short runs by Image that did not go anywhere, but that doesn't mean that fortunes can change for the Turtles like it did for Marvel, Apple, Captain America #1, or AF #15 years later.

 

No one is taking away that AF #15 is not a blue chip book and will remain so for years to come. Comparing the two books are almost like apples and oranges.

 

TMNT#1 can become a blue chip book in time, and AF #15 is already a blue chip book. (thumbs u

 

It would be nice to have bought an AF#15 prior to 2000 and hold onto the book. It would be nice to see TMNT#1 become a blue chip book down the road. It is not there yet, but it could be possible in time.

[Hulksdaddy1]

Up until 2008 nobody gave a mess about Iron Man. He was upper B-list (think Daredevil, Dr Strange, etc..). Turtles were bigger than IM.

and yet iron man has consistenly had a comic produced monthly (even in 2006/7 it was near top 50), where as TMNT couldn't even muster the sales to maintain a monthly comic during most of the 2000's, right (does anyone really count that 23 issue image disaster? )

 

Alan Scott doesn't have a book at all, not for a long time, so All-American Comics #16 musta tanked big time.

[Noodlez]

#3 book in the hobby vs. #1 Copper Book in HG.

 

No contest, the AF15.

 

(thumbs u

 

If you look at it like that, then why... yes!!

 

Seems like a personal preference at the end of the day.

 

The 3000 copies of TMNT 1 is the only factor I would consider if going with that choice.

[G.A.tor]

Up until 2008 nobody gave a mess about Iron Man. He was upper B-list (think Daredevil, Dr Strange, etc..). Turtles were bigger than IM.

and yet iron man has consistenly had a comic produced monthly (even in 2006/7 it was near top 50), where as TMNT couldn't even muster the sales to maintain a monthly comic during most of the 2000's, right (does anyone really count that 23 issue image disaster? )

 

Alan Scott doesn't have a book at all, not for a long time, so All-American Comics #16 musta tanked big time.

It's down a bit but hasn't tanked. Thank goodness even green lantern could manage keeping a book or two going all these years.

[Ryan.]

If TMNT was a Marvel or DC property then it's likely that it too would have been continuously published and marketed all these years.

[mystrymachine]

Currently, the AF15 is a 9K book and the TMNT #1 is an 8K book, so at this moment, the AF15 is the better deal. But, the Turtles movie could change that.

 

There's already been a turtles movie. How many does it take? And how long will the prices hold? Who will be in more demand 50 years from now?

[mystrymachine]

#3 book in the hobby vs. #1 Copper Book in HG.

 

No contest, the AF15.

 

+1

 

These two books shouldn't even be mentioned in the same breath.

 

On the one hand, you have a timeless, iconic character that's in the same league as Batman and Superman in terms of pop cultural awareness, and impact on the entire hobby, in a million dollar book in a comparable grade (9.6), regardless of how many "under copies" of it exist on the census.

 

And on the other, you have a fad book that has been over valued for a very long time, featuring novelty characters from the '80s that should have gone out along with Garbage Pail Kids. But hey, if you like your Turtles, more power to you.

 

No contest there at all.

 

AF 15 all the way baby. (thumbs u

 

-J.

 

 

In the 80's Spider-man was a fad.

 

TMNT #1 is the AF 15 of the Copper-Age.

 

It ain't going down anytime soon.

 

 

"Copper Age"..... the most reviled age of comic books. What's your point?

 

-J.

 

That is what Golden Age generation said about the Silver age generation of books.

 

My point is don't make uneducated remarks about books that are obviously not fads.

 

The only reason TMNT 1 is valued so highly is because of its rarity. Popularity has nothing to do with its price. Look at the Transformers 1 comic with a very successful line of toys and four movies made so far. A 10 dollar book because it is easy to find.

[G.A.tor]

If TMNT was a Marvel or DC property then it's likely that it too would have been continuously published and marketed all these years.

Possibly. But there have been many many Indy comics continuously published over that time frame that are not near as "popular" as tmnt

 

Yes #1 has low initial print run and I suspect that low supply will continue to create demand/price as long as the turtles are relevant.

 

And it's great there are some passionate fans here on the boards. But as far as macro comic demand (in general) , tmnt are near the bottom of the monthly sales charts for a reason (thumbs u

[spracknetch23]

Comparing tmnt 1 to Transformers 1 isn't the same thing. If I'm not mistaken, the cartoon came before the comic book, whereas the tmnt comic was their first appearance ever (sans Gobbledygook ad, if that even counts. IMO no).

However, appearing on tv first didn't stop Harley Quinn...

[Ryan.]

If TMNT was a Marvel or DC property then it's likely that it too would have been continuously published and marketed all these years.

Possibly. But there have been many many Indy comics continuously published over that time frame that are not near as "popular" as tmnt

 

Yes #1 has low initial print run and I suspect that low supply will continue to create demand/price as long as the turtles are relevant.

 

And it's great there are some passionate fans here on the boards. But as far as macro comic demand (in general) , tmnt are near the bottom of the monthly sales charts for a reason (thumbs u

 

This whole thread feels like a multifactorial answer in search of a single question. I'm not really sure how relevant ensuing sales are for either of these properties past their introductory issues. People go nuts for Crime SuspenStories 22 because it was featured in a book and Congressional hearing 60 years ago. It's not possible to know which book is going to be the marquee one to own in the future. It could be Scud the Disposable Assassin 1 if that property got picked up and turned into a movie franchise. Everything at this point is basically post hoc rationalization.

[Wally's Comics]

Alright stop, collaborate and listen!...

 

 

 

 

ummmm yeah, AF 15 baby!

 

 

 

[Jaydogrules]

Had to resurrect this thread for those of you who actually thought that a TMNT 1, 9.6 was a "better" or "equal" trade for an AF 15, 4.0 (from a value standpoint):

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&item=290758806719&si=T6Np1tB5%2FZYDnmTPautXEt6zbyY%3D&print=all&category=64

 

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rt=nc&item=321319937536&si=T6Np1tB5%2FZYDnmTPautXEt6zbyY%3D&print=all&category=64

 

As a side note, the TMNT buyer did not perform not even at the $8K and the seller has been repeatedly re-listing it with no serious takers. Meanwhile an AF 15, 3.5 just sold on Heritage for over $10K.

 

-J.

[MatterEaterLad]

Thanks for the recap.

 

(thumbs u

 

 

[Shawn Low]

New to the debate. As an owner of an AF15 4.0 and 3.5, I wouldn't trade either for TMNT 1 (both bought around the same time as the OP).

 

The Bay movie screen shots I've seen so far make me cringe. And I'm embarrassed to admit I watched the old '90s films too. Double cringe.

 

Sure, the book is rare and that dang black cover makes it hard to find in high grade. But Spidey has been around longer and has had interest re-booted plenty of times. ASM #1 (2014) is the best selling book of the 21st century. Spidey, like Supes and Bats, will remain in pop-culture lore when the TMNT are reduced to a footnote in comic-book history.

 

No contest.

 

But hey, if the OP is happy, good for him!

Edited May 15, 2014 by Shawn Low

[Conan_Aficionado]

New to the debate. As an owner of an AF15 4.0 and 3.5, I wouldn't trade either for TMNT 1 (both bought around the same time as the OP).

 

The Bay movie screen shoots I've seen so far make me cringe. And I'm embarrassed to admit I watched the old '90s films too. Double cringe.

 

Sure, the book is rare and that dang black cover makes it hard to find in high grade. But Spidey has been around longer and has had interest re-booted plenty of times. ASM #1 (2014) is the best selling book of the 21st century. Spidey, like Supes and Bats, will remain in pop-culture lore when the TMNT are reduced to a footnote in comic-book history.

 

No contest.

 

But hey, if the OP is happy, good for him!

 

I agree, "my stuff is *spoon* but your stuff is *spoonerer*"