BLACK PANTHER 2 directed by Ryan Coogler (TBD) 8 8

[drotto]

On 12/11/2022 at 12:20 AM, N e r V said:

As this business model continues to change the company’s ability to make money on streaming is easily one of their top concerns if not the most concerning. Shareholders are asking “what’s that going to look like?” with no clear answers just yet.

The streaming thing is a massive issue.  In the old model, movies would make millions by selling the film to the highest bidder for VOD, streaming, dvd/bluray and TV broadcasting rights. There was a lot of money there. Now with these films going to basically proprietary streaming services, they are relying on added subs, or sustaining subs as a revenue stream.  As streaming shows are proving, this is very hard to quantify, and us not the guaranteed money a top film used to bring in post it's theater run. That is why WB is looking into moving back to the more traditional post run structure. 

[Primetime]

On 12/10/2022 at 9:10 PM, N e r V said:

After the “Black Panther created by Lee & Kirby” credit there is a long list of creators listed under “with special thanks to” which are in alphabetical order and Bill Everett’s name is buried there when you get to the E’s. Just as well since it’s not really much of his work outside of the name.

I just saw the movie this week, and I was looking for Everett’s name and missed it. Anyone have a photo of it? 🤔@Ameri

Edited December 11, 2022 by Primetime

[N e r V]

On 12/10/2022 at 10:47 PM, Primetime said:

I just saw the movie this week, and I was looking for Everett’s name and missed it. Anyone have a photo of it? 🤔@Ameri

[Primetime]

On 12/10/2022 at 10:59 PM, N e r V said:

Ah you did take a photo 👏thanks 

 

[Ameri]

On 12/11/2022 at 1:59 AM, N e r V said:

Thanks for the screenshot! Even though the movie incarnation may not be the exact same Namor as the comics, I'm sure all the authors of comic book history since fandom began would agree that it's extremely disappointing to see Everett's name buried like that as just a mere contributor. Everett should have been given his own creator banner like they did with Black Panther created by Lee and Kirby. 

[Bosco685]

On 12/11/2022 at 10:35 AM, Ameri said:

Thanks for the screenshot! Even though the movie incarnation may not be the exact same Namor as the comics, I'm sure all the authors of comic book history since fandom began would agree that it's extremely disappointing to see Everett's name buried like that as just a mere contributor. Everett should have been given his own creator banner like they did with Black Panther created by Lee and Kirby. 

It has been a historic problem for DC and Marvel movies and TV shows. But especially when it comes to Marvel/Disney and how it compensates and recognizes creators.

Even key industry creators have been calling it out for some time like Neil Gaiman. But unfortunately it has been a slow burning fuse to address their concerns.

[Mr Sneeze]

On 12/11/2022 at 10:48 AM, Bosco685 said:

It has been a historic problem for DC and Marvel movies and TV shows. But especially when it comes to Marvel/Disney and how it compensates and recognizes creators.

Even key industry creators have been calling it out for some time like Neil Gaiman. But unfortunately it has been a slow burning fuse to address their concerns.

Sadly, I would not be surprised if most Marvel movie goers unfamiliar with the source material think one person is responsible for everything. Not meant as an insult to the said person, merely that it is an insult to the many talented writers and artists who have given us so much.

[Jaydogrules]

On 12/10/2022 at 8:49 PM, drotto said:

Saw another report that they may have spent upwards of $250 million in marketing on this film. 

You have a link/source to that by any chance?

-J.

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 12/11/2022 at 11:41 AM, Mr Sneeze said:

Sadly, I would not be surprised if most Marvel movie goers unfamiliar with the source material think one person is responsible for everything. Not meant as an insult to the said person, merely that it is an insult to the many talented writers and artists who have given us so much.

Casuals definitely think that Stan Lee and Kevin Feige are essentially gods when it comes to the content that was created under their leadership. They absolutely deserve a good deal of credit, but a guy like Favreau was maybe equally as important to the MCU's success, for example.

[paperheart]

after $9M WW weekend, this will ultimately scrape past $800M or nearly $550M less than BP1

[MattTheDuck]

On 12/19/2022 at 1:18 PM, paperheart said:

after $9M WW weekend, this will ultimately scrape past $800M or nearly $550M less than BP1

No Boseman, No Billion

[Jaydogrules]

On 12/19/2022 at 1:18 PM, paperheart said:

after $9M WW weekend, this will ultimately scrape past $800M or nearly $550M less than BP1

#notchallanoticket

I called this months ago. 

And the pain is even worse when you factor in the $50M larger budget this one had- that's a $600M negative swing between the two movies all so the cast and crew could indulge in some group therapy. 

No wonder the CEO was fired shortly after the subpar numbers on this started coming in.  

-J.

Edited December 21, 2022 by Jaydogrules

[drotto]

On 12/20/2022 at 6:51 PM, Jaydogrules said:

#notchallanoticket

I called this months ago. 

And the pain is even worse when you factor in the $50M larger budget this one had- that's a $600M negative swing between the two movies all so the cast and crew could indulge in some group therapy. 

No wonder the CEO was fired shortly after the subpar numbers on this statted coming in.  

-J.

Granted the ousted CEO green lit like none of the stuff coming out now.  These are really all Iger's films.

 

This one has got to get people to take note at Disney.  All the people virtually promising this film would hit $1 billion. Then people saying it would be a  embarrassment if the final did not have a 9 in front of it.  Now it is going to limp to $800 million. 

 

I know I harp on this, but you can not keep making $250 billion budget films with at least $150 million in marketing possibly more.  It was WDW Pro's (you can judge if he is trustworthy or not) reporting they may have spent $250 million to market this film. Those spends are not sustainable.  If the $500 million number is true, BP2 may end up losing money.  That is bonkers to think about.

[Jaydogrules]

On 12/20/2022 at 4:58 PM, drotto said:

Granted the ousted CEO green lit like none of the stuff coming out now.  These are really all Iger's films.

 

This one has got to get people to take note at Disney.  All the people virtually promising this film would hit $1 billion. Then people saying it would be a  embarrassment if the final did not have a 9 in front of it.  Now it is going to limp to $800 million. 

 

I know I harp on this, but you can not keep making $250 billion budget films with at least $150 million in marketing possibly more.  It was WDW Pro's (you can judge if he is trustworthy or not) reporting they may have spent $250 million to market this film. Those spends are not sustainable.  If the $500 million number is true, BP2 may end up losing money.  That is bonkers to think about.

Chapek may not have been the guy to greenlight all this nonsense but he was clearly the scapegoat and fall guy.  Somebody needed to go and it wasn't going to be Kevin feige.  

I agree that the prior business model Disney has been using on these is obsolete.  To think that this cost 2.5X what Venom did and will make 50M less is just pathetic.  There is just no papering over how bad that is.  They literally wrecked a billion dollar franchise because they caught some sad "feels".   This will have to go down as one of the biggest unforced errors ever.  

-J.

[KingOfRulers]

I thought the movie was decent. I'm glad I watched it. I don't have a desire to see it again. Wakanda Forever was a fine installment to keep the MCU moving along.

As far as Disney's grand, overarching plan for the MCU, I just don't know. As a stock holder, it's cause for concern. I can only predict declining returns. The movies will likely remain profitable, in general, for quite some time. The days of the Earth-shattering, mega-blockbusters are likely over for the MCU.

There was so much excitement in the early days of the MCU. Remember when the first Avengers movie came out? All the build up there was for that movie. Amazingly, that fever-pitch level of excitement surrounding the first Avengers movie continued to build through the Infinity War movies. They were more than just some movies. It was a cultural thing. Everyone was talking about it, whether they were into this sort of thing or not. At this time, I'm not sensing anything vaguely near that level of interest in the MCU.

[Coverless 9.8]

On 12/11/2022 at 10:35 AM, Ameri said:

Thanks for the screenshot! Even though the movie incarnation may not be the exact same Namor as the comics, I'm sure all the authors of comic book history since fandom began would agree that it's extremely disappointing to see Everett's name buried like that as just a mere contributor. Everett should have been given his own creator banner like they did with Black Panther created by Lee and Kirby. 

When it comes to creator credit, what's one Namor or less!  

Edited December 21, 2022 by Coverless 9.8

[Bosco685]

On 12/20/2022 at 11:27 PM, KingOfRulers said:

There was so much excitement in the early days of the MCU. Remember when the first Avengers movie came out? All the build up there was for that movie.

Went to see it three times at the theater in a two week period and was so excited each time we had an Avengers movie.

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 12/20/2022 at 7:58 PM, drotto said:

Granted the ousted CEO green lit like none of the stuff coming out now.  These are really all Iger's films.

 

This one has got to get people to take note at Disney.  All the people virtually promising this film would hit $1 billion. Then people saying it would be a  embarrassment if the final did not have a 9 in front of it.  Now it is going to limp to $800 million. 

 

I know I harp on this, but you can not keep making $250 billion budget films with at least $150 million in marketing possibly more.  It was WDW Pro's (you can judge if he is trustworthy or not) reporting they may have spent $250 million to market this film. Those spends are not sustainable.  If the $500 million number is true, BP2 may end up losing money.  That is bonkers to think about.

Didn't Feige negotiate his contract in a way that Disney doesn't really interfere with the MCU? Why put any blame on the CEO(s) of Disney when the leader of the MCU is truly at fault?

[KingOfRulers]

On 12/21/2022 at 4:56 AM, Bosco685 said:

Went to see it three times at the theater in a two week period and was so excited each time we had an Avengers movie.

Yep, that was a common tale. Wasn't that so much freakin' fun? I wonder how many of us have seen any recent MCU films multiple times in theaters. Probably not many. I can't even recall the last MCU installment, I saw more than once. In the early MCU days, I was seeing every movie at midnight. I was in my early and mid-20's from Iron Man to Avengers, so I was one of the people in line with my friends to see all of those formative MCU movies right when they hit theaters. We were counting down the days like a little kid before Christmas or their birthday. I didn't see Black Panther 2 until last weekend, and at that point the movie had been out for just over one month.  

I miss that level of wild excitement. I long for it. I took it for granted at the time, but that was an amazing time for our hobby and cinema. We're still living in the superhero era, of which there's still much to be thankful for. But it's sad to think that we're on the backend of the era. I hope Disney can find a way to recapture that lightning in a bottle. I just don't know how they'll do it. If Disney brought me in as a consultant and asked me, "How would you recapture that MCU magic?", I suppose I'd suggest Secret Wars, but honestly, I don't even think that would do the trick. I think the culture at-large is in a, "been there, done that" mindset with superheroes at this point.

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 12/21/2022 at 9:20 AM, KingOfRulers said:

I wonder how many of us have seen any recent MCU films multiple times in theaters. Probably not many.

I saw No Way Home (no surprise there) and Multiverse of Madness twice each. None of the other trailers/premises were interesting enough for me and my family/friends.