Heritage's Next Event Auction has started posting books ! 31 31

[Microbia]

On 3/24/2023 at 10:48 AM, Robot Man said:

Just about all comics even funny animal books feature some degree of violence. Real violence in real life is unacceptable but violence in comic books has always been tolerated. Man, has always been a violent animal since the dawn of time. 

 

[Professor K]

On 3/24/2023 at 1:03 AM, jimbo_7071 said:

Knowing how many women have been murdered by their husbands is why I would never want a copy of that particular book. I'm fine with gruesome imagery that's fantasy-based, but I collect comics for enjoyment, and I don't derive any pleasure from viewing depictions of domestic violence.

I totally understand that and respect youre feelings. As a crime buff I can say there are lots of woman who snuff out their partners as well. Not as much as the opposite though but it is quite common. Usually out of jealousy or for Insurance money. I believe we are speaking of CSS 22. Personally I prefer Vault of Horror 35 more. It's what's about to happen that attracts my attention. 

[jimbo_7071]

On 3/24/2023 at 8:46 AM, batman_fan said:

Can you say the same thing about any comic that depicts violence or is man on man violence okay?

Man-on-man violence doesn't bother me. I'm talking about a visceral reaction to realistic violence against women, so I couldn't care less about trying to defend my views. Violence against a woman via some zany contraption or violence against a woman perpetrated by a monster or creature doesn't bother me, either.

Edited March 24, 2023 by jimbo_7071

[lou_fine]

Well, when I was a kid in the old days, I remember watching good clean fun cartoons like Beep, Beep, the Roadrunner where there was absolutely no violence at all.    

Edited March 24, 2023 by lou_fine

[woowoo]

On 3/24/2023 at 3:31 PM, lou_fine said:

Well, when I was a kid in the old days, I remember watching good clean fun cartoons like Beep, Beep, the Roadrunner where there was absolutely no violence at all.    

Don't forget. absolutely no violence

[LDarkseid1]

Why is Marvel Mystery 46 such an expensive issue? Just the combo of being a bondage, Hitler and Schomburg cover all together?

[comicnoir]

On 3/24/2023 at 8:16 PM, LDarkseid1 said:

Why is Marvel Mystery 46 such an expensive issue? Just the combo of being a bondage, Hitler and Schomburg cover all together?

Yes.

[LDarkseid1]

On 3/24/2023 at 5:18 PM, comicnoir said:

Yes.

Ok makes sense

[batman_fan]

On 3/24/2023 at 6:16 PM, LDarkseid1 said:

Why is Marvel Mystery 46 such an expensive issue? Just the combo of being a bondage, Hitler and Schomburg cover all together?

Ear worm

[LDarkseid1]

I wish my issue 43 was 3 issues higher haha

[LDarkseid1]

On 3/24/2023 at 6:15 PM, szav said:

Don't generally go for Timelys or Schomburgs because they're out of my price range...but this one is just pure awesome is it not?  Here we are drawing cartoonish green Hitlers sitting on a throne of bones, at I think right around the same time as the Allies were landing on the shores of Sicily.  It sorta gives me chills to think they were creating these comics right at the height of worldwide calamity.  It's not just the cover...but the context too.  For me anyway. 

When you add that context, yeah pretty freaking awesome!

[Cat-Man_America]

On 3/24/2023 at 8:23 PM, LDarkseid1 said:

When you add that context, yeah pretty freaking awesome!

MM #46 is undoubtably one of Alex's greatest, if not the greatest war/bondage cover from any GA artist. I'm not sure that there is a comparable composition.

What other artist had the audacity to dream-up the caricature of a fat-headed green ghoul Hitler ...wearing his own shade of fascist fuscia... in a subterranean bunker full of zombie stormtroopers, seated on a nazi skull & bone throne then add subtle details like the masked ear-worm and pet turkey-buzzard? On top of this jaw dropping scene there's Betty & Toro bound in chains being lowered into a fiendish spiked colander and you've got one of the creepiest, brilliantly executed visual satires of the war!  

 

[jimbo_7071]

On 3/24/2023 at 6:31 PM, lou_fine said:

Well, when I was a kid in the old days, I remember watching good clean fun cartoons like Beep, Beep, the Roadrunner where there was absolutely no violence at all.    

Part of what bothers me is that the hobby seems include a misogynistic element that seems to especially enjoy and seek out depictions of violence—including sexual violence—against women. (I'm not referring to anyone on the GA boards.) Those people are probably the main reason why the general public has a negative view of comic collectors. I'm not thrilled to have people like that participating in the same hobby that I do, but I try my best to maintain equanimity when it comes to things that are out of my control.

[skypinkblu]

On 3/25/2023 at 7:27 AM, jimbo_7071 said:

Part of what bothers me is that the hobby seems include a misogynistic element that seems to especially enjoy and seek out depictions of violence—including sexual violence—against women. (I'm not referring to anyone on the GA boards.) Those people are probably the main reason why the general public has a negative view of comic collectors. I'm not thrilled to have people like that participating in the same hobby that I do, but I try my best to maintain equanimity when it comes to things that are out of my control.

I don't know how much of that is actual misogyny and how much is interest in the action on the covers.

Years ago when my daughter was in college, I was selling a lot on eBay. I came up with the brainstorm (not really) of putting the word "bondage" in the titles when a female was tied up. I did that pretty much as a joke...but things sold. Then I started putting that in the title when men were tied up...Batman and Superman were bound quite a few times;)

They sold just as well.

I was always drawn to the Fiction House and Fox covers, because of the colors, not the women...yet I was asked twice (by the same person) if I was a Lesbian because I was looking at those books. I told him I was straight and married and that it was just the colors...

I wouldn't be shocked if a lot of males liked the colors...OK, Phantom Lady 17 is very sexy...I guess, but I don't think a lot of the Schomburg covers are...bondage and all...but I suppose your mileage may vary.

And honestly, although there are all those jokes about comic collectors and parent's basements...I've found very few actual collectors are that odd...most are pretty normal, they are just interested in the hobby. The ones who are odd, are just as odd as some of the Lego collectors, watch collectors, glass collectors, or the Civil War enactors...etc.

[MrBedrock]

On 3/25/2023 at 6:27 AM, jimbo_7071 said:

Part of what bothers me is that the hobby seems include a misogynistic element that seems to especially enjoy and seek out depictions of violence—including sexual violence—against women. (I'm not referring to anyone on the GA boards.) Those people are probably the main reason why the general public has a negative view of comic collectors. I'm not thrilled to have people like that participating in the same hobby that I do, but I try my best to maintain equanimity when it comes to things that are out of my control.

Part of what bothers me is that the hobby includes so many folks who are always judging others based solely on what they collect. I'm even referring to some on the GA boards.

[Cat-Man_America]

On 3/25/2023 at 6:27 AM, jimbo_7071 said:

Part of what bothers me is that the hobby seems include a misogynistic element that seems to especially enjoy and seek out depictions of violence—including sexual violence—against women. (I'm not referring to anyone on the GA boards.) Those people are probably the main reason why the general public has a negative view of comic collectors. I'm not thrilled to have people like that participating in the same hobby that I do, but I try my best to maintain equanimity when it comes to things that are out of my control.

There is going to be some element of deviancy from accepted norms in every collecting hobby, sport or activity; it's even worse in the political-arena (the third rail we must not discuss). In comics, especially GA comics, we're involved in collecting snapshots of attitudes from another era. Without judging people in respect to what they buy or why they buy it, there's a fascination for war propaganda art that often includes depictions that are socially unacceptable by today's standards. It doesn't make the collector deviant for being interested in history; in fact, it's laudable. George Santayana's quote about those who do not learn from history are condemned to repeat it is a poignant reminder that we should treasure those snapshots of time, to be aware of our past ...not to cancel it... and develop a historical curiosity for the sake of having a perspective on our own flawed humanity. 

This is the long way of saying what we collect are choices that define interests and taste.  We determine the rationales, justifications and parameters (where to draw the line).

Personally, I don't care for stereotypical racial depictions that are used purely as comic relief.  There are a borderline exceptions, but they're rare. This precludes my collecting certain comics that would be considered unacceptable to display given today's sensitivity standards as it impacts my comfort level as well. That said, my collecting interests don't judge other's collecting interests. The line I've chosen to draw is at war propaganda ...yellow peril stereotypes... because these accurately reflect the public's reaction to perceived threat.  I don't embrace the views of that era, but the history is fascinating and crucially important to understanding how those perceived fears manifested in society.

Misogyny is another animal altogether. it's easy to find misogyny in the unrealistic stylized depictions of men & women in comics today, even though women are usually depicted as more self-reliant. That's definitely a plus IMO, but hasn't been without trade-offs. The overt exaggerated sexualization of girls and women seems more pronounced in a lot of current comic art. But who am I to judge evolving fantasy tastes and collector's interest? Undoubtably some of the more exploitive content would've been too extreme for the GA, but social norms have changed.  Violence and gore seem to be more pronounced today as well, but again, who am I to judge collector tastes?  

I'm pretty much in agreement with Richard on this. We shouldn't be judging folks by what they collect. Yes, there are lines everyone draws and it's a topic is worthy of exploration, but it doesn't diminish anyone to collect the popular culture of another era. My long-winded, caffeine influenced two centavos (is it okay to say centavos without it looking like an offensive ethnic reference?)

Edited March 27, 2023 by Cat-Man_America
spelling edits; there'll probably be more!

[Telegan]

On 3/25/2023 at 6:27 AM, jimbo_7071 said:

Part of what bothers me is that the hobby seems include a misogynistic element that seems to especially enjoy and seek out depictions of violence—including sexual violence—against women. (I'm not referring to anyone on the GA boards.) Those people are probably the main reason why the general public has a negative view of comic collectors. I'm not thrilled to have people like that participating in the same hobby that I do, but I try my best to maintain equanimity when it comes to things that are out of my control.

I get where you're coming from.  I, personally, don't care for horror movies, vampires/Dracula, zombies, etc. but fell in love with PCH covers because it was a) mind-boggling I didn't know this genre existed and b) it's such a unique period in comic history - a wild west of sorts.  Plus, the rarity of issues drew me to it, not from a flipper's point of view, because I don't flip comics, but from a "I want that cover - I gotta get it - I got it" chase exacerbated by the fact you may not see many of these covers show up for sale too often.  Most of the PCH stuff I have is just because I saw it and said "that's a cool cover".  Of course, some of them also have what some may consider misogynistic themes on the covers while others have nothing like that.

The beheading, murder, etc. stuff is a bit disturbing to me, but I'm not attracted to it, but rather the rarity and resulting popularity of the comic itself.  And much of that popularity is due to word-of-mouth and the need to have it :

"This is a grail!"
"Sez who?"
"Everybody!"
"Wow, I better see if I can get it, too, then!"

I had to stop myself and ask why I was looking for particular comics, but then I realized I just had some innate affinity toward the art of the era and just the era of the 1920s-1960s in just about anything : comics or otherwise.  I love space-themed covers, I don't really watch westerns, but I do like some western covers, I love some of the more rare "cartoon-type" covers, etc.  These were all just part of the era, and I enjoy collecting them all at various points.  Plus, in many cases, you're among the less-than-30 or 40 people probably who own a copy of the book, so there's that.

But let's face it, there's always going to be a certain element of society that's attracted to those misogynistic views and other "less-than-wholesome" ideals.  I first did a double-take when half the stuff on eBay for PCH comics had "headlights" (Seriously?  Grow up.) and "bondage" in their titles and description to attract offers.  Like prices are driven up another 50%-100% just because somebody's tied up.  Now, that .... that's weird. But hey, who am I to judge? lol.

[jimbo_7071]

On 3/25/2023 at 3:23 PM, Telegan said:

I get where you're coming from.  I, personally, don't care for horror movies, vampires/Dracula, zombies, etc. but fell in love with PCH covers because it was a) mind-boggling I didn't know this genre existed and b) it's such a unique period in comic history - a wild west of sorts.  Plus, the rarity of issues drew me to it, not from a flipper's point of view, because I don't flip comics, but from a "I want that cover - I gotta get it - I got it" chase exacerbated by the fact you may not see many of these covers show up for sale too often.  Most of the PCH stuff I have is just because I saw it and said "that's a cool cover".  Of course, some of them also have what some may consider misogynistic themes on the covers while others have nothing like that.

The beheading, murder, etc. stuff is a bit disturbing to me, but I'm not attracted to it, but rather the rarity and resulting popularity of the comic itself.  And much of that popularity is due to word-of-mouth and the need to have it :

"This is a grail!"
"Sez who?"
"Everybody!"
"Wow, I better see if I can get it, too, then!"

I had to stop myself and ask why I was looking for particular comics, but then I realized I just had some innate affinity toward the art of the era and just the era of the 1920s-1960s in just about anything : comics or otherwise.  I love space-themed covers, I don't really watch westerns, but I do like some western covers, I love some of the more rare "cartoon-type" covers, etc.  These were all just part of the era, and I enjoy collecting them all at various points.  Plus, in many cases, you're among the less-than-30 or 40 people probably who own a copy of the book, so there's that.

But let's face it, there's always going to be a certain element of society that's attracted to those misogynistic views and other "less-than-wholesome" ideals.  I first did a double-take when half the stuff on eBay for PCH comics had "headlights" (Seriously?  Grow up.) and "bondage" in their titles and description to attract offers.  Like prices are driven up another 50%-100% just because somebody's tied up.  Now, that .... that's weird. But hey, who am I to judge? lol.

Horror movies I like—the scarier the better. I guess I'm able to put those in a "fantasy" box, so the violence isn't real even when female victims are depicted. I grew up in a household where my mother was abused by her live-in boyfriend, so that's probably where some of my distaste for domestic violence comes from—but not all of it. I've also seen a few too many stories in the news about women being murdered by their husbands.

Much of the bondage is in superhero comics, and you know that the victim is about to be rescued, so that makes it different—at least to me. Like I said, it's an emotional thing, not a logical thing. Violence against animals also bothers me. I don't like covers that show animals being killed.

[skypinkblu]

On 3/25/2023 at 8:48 PM, jimbo_7071 said:

Horror movies I like—the scarier the better. I guess I'm able to put those in a "fantasy" box, so the violence isn't real even when female victims are depicted. I grew up in a household where my mother was abused by her live-in boyfriend, so that's probably where some of my distaste for domestic violence comes from—but not all of it. I've also seen a few too many stories in the news about women being murdered by their husbands.

Much of the bondage is in superhero comics, and you know that the victim is about to be rescued, so that makes it different—at least to me. Like I said, it's an emotional thing, not a logical thing. Violence against animals also bothers me. I don't like covers that show animals being killed.

Wonder Woman was bound in about every other GA issue...her author, was kind of kinky...or very kinky. It was so lame, it was funny after a while...as are most of the GA "bondage" covers.

I agree with @Cat-Man_Americaabout the newer issues. I think of the older covers more as a piece of art.  If you look at the PL 17 cover, the ropes are just kind of draped around her.

I don't read horror stories, but the books that really really upset me, are Romance comics...Most have women depicted in a much worse light than any Fiction house or Fox book. 

It's wonderful that you think of your mom and women who were in abusive relationships...that's kind. 

Edited March 26, 2023 by skypinkblu

[lou_fine]

On 3/22/2023 at 5:07 PM, szav said:

They take a huge cut on raw books FYI.  Around 40% total for their take  iirc.  When I consigned slabbed books, I got a fantastic rate, with the sellers fee waived and then some, but was told that raw books were not part of deal and would be subject to a higher than normal sellers fee.

I presume it’s from the additional hassle they incur having to grade/evaluate and deal with returns.

Totally NOT surprised that there would be a much higher rate for raw books which they have to grade in-house using their own graders, as that would involve extra costly work on their part in terms of the need to hire graders.  Definitely a lot more work than simply loading pics of already slabbed books into their auction platform.  

Any idea if this higher auction commission fee would also apply to raw books which they are simply forwarding on behalf of the consignor to CCS and CGC for their pressing and/or grading services?