Is CGC trying to lose their dealers as well? 11 11

[Sigur Ros]

On 1/11/2022 at 11:49 PM, BigLeagueCHEW said:

Really? Be you mean? Take a CBCS rubberized slab, bow it backwards on the spine side. Let me know how it holds up compared to a CGC one.
 

This video shows someone twisting a slab, who the hell does that anyway?

Most often, you tubers who are comparing the strength, integrity, and protection offered from the various cases.  I think they all end up at the same conclusion. 

Who bows them backwards? 

Why is twisting wrong and bowing not? 

Lol... 

[Prince Namor]

In the end, none of this will deter the overwhelming number of submissions sent in to CGC.

[MAR1979]

On 1/10/2022 at 11:06 PM, blazingbob said:

It is not that the seller would sell one for less then the other.  It is that the buyers won't pay the same price.  Accurately graded books will always sell faster.  If you are looking at a book and questioning the grade and it is the same when looking at lots of books you come to the determination that their grading is loose and that you automatically downgrade the book in the holder.  CBCS did it to themselves,  the market didn't do it.  You get a reputation as a loose grader it sticks with you.

I truly wanted CBCS to succeed as folks like me benefit from true competition in the industry, but they put on clinic in what not to do.

Their Business plan needed to have included;

- Forecast and Expect to take losses their first 5-6 years of operation (Amazon did for at least that long)

- Charge enough lower than CGC to ensure submitter's  give you a try.  A dollar or 2 less won't do it. $4-5 might, then see rule #1

- Grade noticeably stricter than CGC and maintain that. This item is paramount. At first some will be "disgruntled" then slowly you will build reputation and positive perception.

CBCS did not do any of that.  Those who know Barock also know he is flipper of the highest order. The flipper mentality is a short-sighted and always for "the now".. It does not work well with a viable long term business plan. Yeah Borack has done OK for himself, no argument there, however both him and CBCS could have been the industry standard and leader raking more than CGC at this juncture in time, instead of being an also ran.

As result of their short-sighted vision the perception of CBCS will never ever change.

 

P.S.   I have 14 books in the CBCS slabs, All 9.8's, only 4 of which i think are deserving of the number on the label. The rest fall rather short IMHO. I also looked at at least 50 other of their slabs at cons.  I gave them a fair shot but I was very disappointed.

Edited January 12, 2022 by MAR1979

[Stronguy]

I just got a call back from CS -- they have someone dedicated to answering questions about this BS.  He confirmed, "At this time there is no plan to waive the dealer fee for ANY dealers, regardless of what volume they submit."  I gave him some very honest feedback about how this is being perceived in the dealer community, much of which has been said here.  I told him, as a direct result of the changes (discount cut, 2 prices increases, and a $200 tax all in less than a year) I would be making adjustments in my submissions and it would most certainly result in a net-dollar decrease for CGC.  It was a very poor and shortsighted business decision and I would be encouraging others to do the same.  I asked him to pass that on to their leadership team (whom he said made the decision) and he said he would.  It was a polite and professional call.

One thing I mentioned he was unaware of.  He said, "This seems to not be an issue for many dealers because they are paying the fee."  I told him it was more of a hostage situation because dealers who wanted to finish up existing business (I was going to enter an order yesterday morning) had to pay up right then.  He said, "Really?  This doesn't go into effect until February 18th."  That was not what popped up when I logged in yesterday; all it said was UNLOCK ACCESS.  At that point I assumed I could not start new orders.

Well, it appears this was a ham-handed rollout.  The Dealer Portal now brings up the Benefits page, which was not the case yesterday morning; it now mentions Feb. 18th.  He apologized for that and said he would pass that on.  I did verify that my account was unlocked and I am able to begin new orders.

So as it stands now there is not consideration for a fee waiver.  You pay up or you are done (his words were "lose certain benefits") on Feb. 18.  

If this pisses you off as much as it does me give them a call and let them know.  Be polite, be professional, but let them know what you are unhappy about and what you're going to do about it.  Hopefully if there is enough feedback they will realize just how unappreciated this is.

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/12/2022 at 5:52 AM, GACollectibles said:

Just because you don't deal with people who buy like that doesn't mean it isn't happening, it happens on a large scale all the time, whether it due to supply factors, trust of seller and the fact that CGC is not an absolute.  There used to be a big difference between the raw and graded prices of the same high books, that gap has narrowed significantly as people paid more then got the books slabbed, or had to pay more to get the books they wanted and didn't need them slabbed, as a couple of examples.

OMG  NO 

Never mind.   That has nothing to do with my point. 

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/12/2022 at 12:22 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

OMG  NO 

Never mind.   That has nothing to do with my point. 

You were making a point?

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/12/2022 at 9:26 AM, THE_BEYONDER said:

You were making a point?

[BigLeagueCHEW]

On 1/12/2022 at 7:57 AM, Sigur Ros said:

Most often, you tubers who are comparing the strength, integrity, and protection offered from the various cases.  I think they all end up at the same conclusion. 

Who bows them backwards? 

Why is twisting wrong and bowing not? 

Lol... 

Not understanding what you mean by who bows them backwards. The CBCS slab was already doing this when I received it. Who puts this out as an acceptable holder for comic storage, especially for something with a high dollar value.

In the case with my return, the eBay seller did not hesitate to accept it. Literally, if you took a straight edge, or even eyeballed it, it was bowing backwards. As a test, I applied very slight pressure to it, and sure enough it had previous creases, but I confirmed when pressing with slight pressure that the bowing caused all of them. Tested on the old and new CGC holders, nice and sturdy.

Your video shows an example of the CGC case cracking due to a harder material. Which means CBCS is a little soft. It was 1 and done for me. I like the extra thick CGC holders for my books. CBCS is a little flaccid @kav 

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/11/2022 at 2:03 PM, Bookery said:

I sell plenty of CGC books too, though usually I buy them already graded.  CGC's a perfectly fine company.  But let's face it... they are "experts" because they say they are experts.  I'm also an expert.  Have been one for 40 years (okay... let's say 30... I figure it takes about 10 years to become a truly "expert" grader, covering all the possible ramifications with golden-age to modern, restoration issues, etc.).  I'm guessing the majority of CGC graders don't have that 10 years experience yet.  If I suddenly patented and began slabbing and grading vintage paperbacks, would I now be more of an expert than I was the day before I slabbed them in plastic?  Obvious answer.

The majority of the CGC graders do have 10 years (many now 20 years) experience grading comic books. 

Now whether you agree with their grading or not, ok understood.  However, I know many dealers and collectors who are much older than me and their grading was and has always been terrible.  Years in while important also not the end all be all factor.  There are some people that can pick up a skill much faster than others.  

There is a very short list of professional graders in the world (most do not work at CGC) which I have been very vocal in telling CGC peeps that.  However, CGC does have many professional graders working there as well.  Some were professional graders before they went to work for CGC.

Most professional graders know they can make more money in 3 months working for themselves then grading other peoples books for 12 months. 

Edited January 12, 2022 by NewWorldOrder

[William-James88]

On 1/12/2022 at 10:30 AM, Bookery said:

A $30 slabbed book would, if raw, probably go in my $4-$10 boxes, since at that end of the spectrum, a big chunk of the value is indeed the slabbing itself.

To add to that, when you go below the $100 threshold, it can go the other way too where a $30 raw book wouldn't sell for more slabbed. 

Like a lot of midgrade DC silver age stuff which sells for $30-$50. Those sell around guide whether they are slabbed or not and since slabbing does not increase the worth of the book, there is nothing wrong with selling a raw at the rightfully valued guide price, which is also $30 in the case of these two below.

I get that when discussion CGC and price premiums, we think of keys of really big books, but the majority of books sent to CGC are not those. They are instead books that could just as easily sell for raw and would probably make even more money to the seller if they were sold raw. It being in a CGC slab simply makes it less of a headache when selling (less issues with returns, accessibility to some auction houses, ect) but it doesn't mean it's the way to get the highest return.

[GACollectibles]

On 1/12/2022 at 12:22 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

OMG  NO 

Never mind.   That has nothing to do with my point. 

It's ok.  I forgive you.

[NewWorldOrder]

On 1/12/2022 at 9:54 AM, GACollectibles said:

It's ok.  I forgive you.

I hate you, but miss your face at the same time. 

[GACollectibles]

On 1/12/2022 at 12:56 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

I hate you, but miss your face at the same time. 

[theCapraAegagrus]

On 1/12/2022 at 12:43 PM, BigLeagueCHEW said:

...CBCS is a little flaccid @kav 

Oof...

[Crops068]

On 1/11/2022 at 12:14 PM, NewWorldOrder said:

BlackStone should implement a CGC Boardie fee for posting non-sensical posts.

If they charged .99c each post they would generate more income than all the 2022 modern CGC submissions combined. 

Heck just from my drunk posts they would get me for a couple hundred bucks per year. 

Sorry I am like a billion pages behind but if they charge .99c in this fashion then it completely makes sense that the new post was added for @kav to have off topic rants discussions.  He will single-handed pay for the board himself.  

[THE_BEYONDER]

On 1/12/2022 at 1:31 PM, Crops068 said:

Sorry I am like a billion pages behind but if they charge .99c in this fashion then it completely makes sense that the new post was added for @kav to have off topic rants discussions.  He will single-handed pay for the board himself.  

What a treat the rest of the boards have been since kav got his sandbox 

[lostboys]

I hope dealers stop sending in thousands of books that came out last month. Its clogging up the system.

 

 

[lizards2]

On 1/12/2022 at 8:00 AM, MAR1979 said:

 

P.S.   I have 14 books in the CBCS slabs, All 9.8's, only 4 of which i think are deserving of the number on the label. The rest fall rather short IMHO. I also looked at at least 50 other of their slabs at cons.  I gave them a fair shot but I was very disappointed.

Since the outer and inner wells hide most of the flaws....., ouch.

I saw a bunch of HG PGX Atom slabs close on eBay Sunday, and OMG closing prices for obviously over-graded stuff. I did get one cheap that appeared OK - we'll see...,

[namisgr]

On 1/12/2022 at 1:52 PM, lizards2 said:

I saw a bunch of HG PGX Atom slabs close on eBay Sunday, and OMG closing prices for obviously over-graded stuff. I did get one cheap that appeared OK - we'll see...,

The first question will be whether the interior of the book matches with the cover.  

[shadroch]

On 1/12/2022 at 11:59 AM, namisgr said:

The first question will be whether the interior of the book matches with the cover.  

I've been hearing people call PGX a fly-by-night company operating out of someones garage for the last twenty years.