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C2E2 Variant Drama
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Started by fastballspecial,

4,556 posts in this topic

Sigur Ros

Sigur Ros

Posted
Posted
On 8/12/2022 at 1:14 PM, bc said:

Now that CGC has laid out the 3 criteria, if they don't allow it, our lawyer(s) could slap them with a discriminatory business lawsuit.

-bc

Doubt it. 

Let's ask. 

Is there a lawyer in the comic book forum? 

 

giphy (1).gif

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jcjames

jcjames

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On 8/12/2022 at 10:17 AM, jaybuck43 said:

How were the books graded? Was the acetate graded as the cover and the actual cover considered a page and therefore ignored finger bends/spin ticks etc?  Very hard to understand how thousands of submissions  from fans never rated anything higher than a 9.8 but magically the seller/creator works out with you guys to encapsulate these books and their submission of 10 books all come back the same with 1 10 3 9.9s and 6 9.8s (since the books haven’t even gone on sale yet only black flag has them in their possession to submit them to you) 40% of their submission is better than 9.8 when not a single book prior has every graded higher. Really suspect.

AND... how does punching four extra holes into the book post-production just get ignored and given a 9.8, 9.9 and 10 grade. 

The books were DAMAGED. The addition of the extra cover is NOT production-related - and it is NOT the same as a signature or remark - it is damage to the book. 

This is such a clusterf....

 

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Bob Sacamano

Bob Sacamano

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Posted (edited)
On 8/12/2022 at 12:20 PM, A. Schaeffer said:

I'm actually interested to see if they step it up and put a character they own on the overlay of a marvel book. Maybe they also talked to Disney ahead of time?

I don't know why I'm getting shades of a decade of looney tunes characters dressed as Kriss Kross on airbrushed t shirts. 

That’s supposedly what’s happening with the Ghost Rider book.  “Ghost Rider Vs” something er other variant.

Edited by Bob Sacamano
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DrunkWooky

DrunkWooky

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On 8/12/2022 at 11:15 AM, Dr. Balls said:

Man, eating the cost of that booth? I’d be surprised given the stance that the owner of Black Whatever thinks his books are “dope” and “makes people money”. Those people tend to not have things like this bother them.

Well CGC have made their stance clear on the next two books. Universal Grade Label with notes about aftermarket additions. 

What has occurred between Marvel and Black Flag is a separate story. CGC may be willing to grade the two future books, but is Marvel willing to allow them to see the light of day? Especially, given that there is speculation that one of them was a mash up of Infinite Black's IP and Marvel's:

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/who-are-infinite-black-of-the-black-flag-comics-acetate-covers/

"Zymotica[ ]is the name of the actetate cover intended to be created for Clayton Craine's Ghost Rider #1. for this weekend's Boston Fan Expo, the "Zymotica Vs" variant cover. Might that suggest Black Flag Comics were intending to use their existing retailer exclusive Clayton Crain Ghost Rider cover approved by Marvel, to promote their own intellectual property, created by Clayton Crain, with a bit of acetate on the cover? Might we get Zymotica Vs Ghost Rider? You could see how Marvel Comics might have a problem with that more than the "In God We Intrust" cover."

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A. Schaeffer

A. Schaeffer

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Posted
On 8/12/2022 at 1:25 PM, Bob Sacamano said:

That’s supposedly what’s happening with the Ghost Rider book.  “Ghost Rider Vs” something er other variant.

right, and disney is known to be lax with IP so it should be chill

but, maybe there's some grey area where you are modifying something you did license/buy under contract after the fact so it becomes fair use. 

what is sure though is now that these get a special label distinction you'll get copycats, and those should be even goofier. given cgcs newest statement i dont think youll ever see a copycat in a slab, but i would bet someone is drawing winne the pooh holding a flag on plastic as we speak

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JC25427N

JC25427N

Posted
Posted
On 8/12/2022 at 1:29 PM, A. Schaeffer said:

but i would bet someone is drawing winne the pooh holding a flag on plastic as we speak

I mean come on thats an easy bet, theres a do you pooh cover for everything. The amber turd cover was hilarious lol

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jcjames

jcjames

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On 8/12/2022 at 10:02 AM, CGC Mike said:

 

the rules we applied to his books:

 

  • The additional cover had to be created by an established artist in the industry.
  • The comic to which the cover was attached had to contain a cover by that same artist.
  • A copy of the comic with the attached cover had to be submitted to us for inspection prior to certifying any copies.

 

So... using these new, ad-hoc "rules" -

Any time anyone submits a CGC SS book for an artist-signing whereby, the artist in the process of "producing" this signed copy, puts a fingerprint, a crease, a bend or an extra pair of staples in the book... all those damages will now be overlooked during grading because those modifications were "created by an established artist in the industry" and the extra damage was to "a cover by the same artist". 

Great to know.

 

 

 

Edited by jcjames
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Jimmy Linguini

Jimmy Linguini

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On 8/12/2022 at 1:33 PM, eddly said:

How do we determine whether an artist is established in the industry?

when they say "Oh yes, I would love to do some retailer variants for you and no you don't have to pay me, you just have to give me comps so I can sell them at conventions."
 

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manetteska

manetteska

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On 8/12/2022 at 12:02 PM, CGC Mike said:

We feel it is important to provide transparency on how CGC arrived at our method of certifying Clayton Crain’s Ultimate Fallout comics with the attached acetate covers. For us, this was an unprecedented item to grade. After Mr. Crain spoke with us prior to C2E2, the rules we applied to his books:

 

  • The additional cover had to be created by an established artist in the industry.
  • The comic to which the cover was attached had to contain a cover by that same artist.
  • A copy of the comic with the attached cover had to be submitted to us for inspection prior to certifying any copies.

 

Given the recent circumstances, we have made adjustments to the labeling originally used for the Ultimate Fallout exhibiting the acetate cover. Going forward, any copies submitted to CGC will display in the label text: "In God We Intrust" Acetate Artist Cover attached with 2 staples after manufacturing. The books will still be allowed to receive a Universal label.

 

This will also apply to Mr. Crain’s forthcoming copies of Ghost Rider #1 and Deadpool Nerdy 30 #1 that contain an acetate cover.  

image.png

 

 

1. I'm not buying these 3 rules were actually talked about prior to this week, otherwise this post would have been created much earlier than today.

2. Ignoring the timing of these rules, it sounds like instead of applying the regular CGC grading standards to a book with items added after manufacturing, an "established artist" approached CGC, asked for a favor, and CGC obliged.

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